South Hadley,MA Phoebe Prince 15 kills self over bullying #3

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Harley1971

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Boy...No wonder they were SO happy at the cotillion. Phoebe wasn't there. Imagine...if Phoebe had shown up? All dolled up...in her pretty new dress...getting all the boys attention. Bet they didn't want THAT to happen. Hence..the BIG smiles.

IMO

I'm almost thinking they WANTED her to show up...why would they want to miss that opportunity to bully her some more, in front of her date and on a night she really wanted to have fun?
I guess they didn't really care, either way. They had "accomplished" their mission. :(
 

Harley1971

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Boy, I want to hit something, and I'm a non-violent bystander. Imagine how Phoebe's Family feels? This author is jumping on the bandwagon of publicity...

They BETTER show the END sentence in her book report where she SAYS the book helped her to "comprehend what people close to me" have gone through. But I bet they won't, I bet they'll proclaim Phoebe was a cutter. I am sickened.

Watch out cutters, and anyone else who has problems...it's open season! You are no longer protected under the law...according to this bullcrap...you can be harassed, stalked and raped!
http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/23/morning-buzz-assisted-suicide-goes-to-court/

I get sick to my stomach when I think about what the defense is going to try and do to Phoebe. She was such a beautiful, caring, peaceful person, they are going to really have to dig deep to destroy her. Ugh. "She was a cutter, she was mentally unstable", "she was a *advertiser censored*", "she smoked", "she was bullied back in Ireland"...blah blah blah. No matter what kind of person Phoebe was, she didn't deserve what those horrible kids did to her. It's going to be ugly.
 

MaureenN

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Letters to the editor on Masslive re: 'Where were the parents of these bullies' - http://www.masslive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/04/letters_south_hadley_adults_se.html

I'm wanting to reply to the first commenter, but am still examining my feelings about it. See, I agree, that the bullies were failed by society (and their families/parents), too. I just don't think that that means that they should not accept the consequences of their actions. I feel sorry for them, that they never learned how to feel simple pride in acting with dignity and grace towards others. But, I still think that the best thing for them, right now, is to learn from the natural consequences of their illegal choices. Hopefully, at some point, they will feel the immorality of their choices, too, to the point where they choose to change & take pride in their lives.
 

McKEire

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The Nareys, well, Ray is deceased and Susan is Kayla's Mother. He was purportedly a firefighter who passed in 2008.
(links on 1st thread)

Not sure if this is important, and I can't find the link, but I believe Kayla's mother was a teacher at West Springfield High School

And Dan Smith is a resident of Holyoke, not South Hadley, maybe that's why he doesn't care what happens after they leave.
 

Paladine

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Not sure if this is important, and I can't find the link, but I believe Kayla's mother was a teacher at West Springfield High School

And Dan Smith is a resident of Holyoke, not South Hadley, maybe that's why he doesn't care what happens after they leave.
That IS VERY interesting. A fellow teacher. Hmm...Thanks!

We''ll link hunt ;) Is Dan Smiths brother Micheal Smith? The one the middle school is named after? The former Superintendent of Schools? I read rumor he was but have no link, yet, either...

I have to go out for a bit but I'll be back later...:)
 

Harley1971

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Letters to the editor on Masslive re: 'Where were the parents of these bullies' - http://www.masslive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/04/letters_south_hadley_adults_se.html

I'm wanting to reply to the first commenter, but am still examining my feelings about it. See, I agree, that the bullies were failed by society (and their families/parents), too. I just don't think that that means that they should not accept the consequences of their actions. I feel sorry for them, that they never learned how to feel simple pride in acting with dignity and grace towards others. But, I still think that the best thing for them, right now, is to learn from the natural consequences of their illegal choices. Hopefully, at some point, they will feel the immorality of their choices, too, to the point where they choose to change & take pride in their lives.

I am a big fan of "old enough to know better". Which these kids were. I am not sure that all of their parents knew how they behaved at school - except for Sharon Chanon Velazquez's mom, she knew her daughter was suspended. All I can say about this, is teenagers are sneaky little things. I was teased in school, but my parents never knew. I was able to hide it from them, I didn't want them to know, I was embarrassed. I think that some of these bullies might have been able to get away with it without their parents knowing. And that is where the school administration should be held accountable. If these kids had been punished and their parents informed of how they were torturing this girl, their parents would have known. Then I would hold some responsibility on the parents. I just wonder if they knew that their little darlings turned into big monsters at school...??
 

Paladine

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Great point, Harley...I'm not sure the administration even told most parents. I recall rumor, just after the indictments, when it bacame know 3 we're still in school, that the parents lawyers we're involved. Now, maybe that's why the other kids we're never suspended or expelled...because the parents we're never, ever notified?

Now..I gotta go...I had sent my Daughter out to buy a new dress for a formal and gave her my bank card. She accidently showed my bank card at the bank, she was supposed to use an ATM...and they confiscated it! I have to go and get another...grrr...;)
 

MaureenN

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Being notified of their kids' behavior by the schools would definitely be a good thing. And, I know teens can be sneaky... that's why parents need to be diligent even after their kids hit the teen years. :)

So much of this happened on the internet & via text messages. I still hold the parents responsible for not parenting their kids, 24/7, even if that means checking in with their teachers & school admin on their own. Doesn't mean I don't *also* hold the kids responsible for their own actions, too.
 

Harley1971

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Being notified of their kids' behavior by the schools would definitely be a good thing. And, I know teens can be sneaky... that's why parents need to be diligent even after their kids hit the teen years. :)

So much of this happened on the internet & via text messages. I still hold the parents responsible for not parenting their kids, 24/7, even if that means checking in with their teachers & school admin on their own. Doesn't mean I don't *also* hold the kids responsible for their own actions, too.

I agree, the parents could have been way more involved in their kid's lives. If I had a teenager, you bet I would be monitoring their internet usage and text messages.
Maybe their parents thought they were good kids. Maybe their parents relied on the school to let them know if their kids were having behavior issues. My point is that the school administrators KNEW she was being bullied. We don't know for sure if all of the bullies' parents knew. :)
 

McKEire

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That IS VERY interesting. A fellow teacher. Hmm...Thanks!

We''ll link hunt ;) Is Dan Smiths brother Micheal Smith? The one the middle school is named after? The former Superintendent of Schools? I read rumor he was but have no link, yet, either...

I have to go out for a bit but I'll be back later...:)

yes Dan Smith is the brother of the fomer Superintendent, but I did not know that the middle school was named after him.
No link for that, I knew the family about 10 years ago when the brother was Superintendent and Dan Smith was a teacher
 

thebear14

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Boy...No wonder they were SO happy at the cotillion. Phoebe wasn't there. Imagine...if Phoebe had shown up? All dolled up...in her pretty new dress...getting all the boys attention. Bet they didn't want THAT to happen. Hence..the BIG smiles.

IMO

It was probably a relief for them. Phoebe, hands down, would have been the most beautiful one there, on the inside and out. I didn't even know the girl and I can say that with certainty.

This case kills me.
 

Paladine

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yes Dan Smith is the brother of the fomer Superintendent, but I did not know that the middle school was named after him.
No link for that, I knew the family about 10 years ago when the brother was Superintendent and Dan Smith was a teacher
Thanks a bunch :)

Well, that brings it full circle. I read on a board they were brothers, that as a result of Micheal having been super, he had connections that Dan could use to protect him.

There is a Micheal E. Smith Middle School in SH. When was it built/named and what is Dan's bro's middle name, are 2 questions that come to mind... a guy who gets a school named after him has some power, imo.
http://smithmiddle.shschools.net/
 

Paladine

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Being notified of their kids' behavior by the schools would definitely be a good thing. And, I know teens can be sneaky... that's why parents need to be diligent even after their kids hit the teen years. :)

So much of this happened on the internet & via text messages. I still hold the parents responsible for not parenting their kids, 24/7, even if that means checking in with their teachers & school admin on their own. Doesn't mean I don't *also* hold the kids responsible for their own actions, too.
I agree wholeheartedly, Maureen. I check my Daughter's FB, daily. I check FB updates and privacy settings....and friends pictures and comments, too...if I see something, I comment. She may not like it at times but it shows others that an adult is watching...

This does not relieve parents of responsibility, either. We should know what our kids are doing without having to be told, imo. But I do fault the school if these parents were never informed.
 

Laurence

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It was probably a relief for them. Phoebe, hands down, would have been the most beautiful one there, on the inside and out. I didn't even know the girl and I can say that with certainty.

This case kills me.

Plus they thought they had gotten away with it. If they'd been afraid of punishment for what they'd done to her there would have been none of the boasting (!) about it on Facebook and elsewhere.
 

Laurence

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I am a big fan of "old enough to know better". Which these kids were. I am not sure that all of their parents knew how they behaved at school - except for Sharon Chanon Velazquez's mom, she knew her daughter was suspended.

And you don't get suspended for just a little name calling.
 

t93

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Basically it was a pretty short piece, touching on her moving from Ireland in 2009 and being harassed by upperclassmen for dating someone popular. A recounting of the day she killed herself. Not anything new. A lot of students condemning the bullies. The story they spent the most time on was a young man who was harassed for 4 years by being called "f*g or gay". He dropped out, got his GED, and got therapy. His parents said had they sent him back one more day he would have probably been dead. He won a lawsuit against the school for gender discrimination. I am sure this was a famous case but this was the first I heard of it. It is called "E" Investigates: Bullying. It will reair tomorrow morning at 10:00 AM central, Sunday at 2:00 PM if you can catch it.
 

thebear14

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Plus they thought they had gotten away with it. If they'd been afraid of punishment for what they'd done to her there would have been none of the boasting (!) about it on Facebook and elsewhere.

yeah seriously. If I said so much as one mean thing to someone and he/she took his/her life...I would lock myself away in shame and regret and probably have to seek therapy forever. These kids tortured her for months, told her to kill herself, and when she did continued to trash talk her and party two days later. I can't even express anymore thoughts I have about that right now :furious: :banghead:
 

daisy7

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The threads should be topic specific and we should all try and stay on topic as much as possible.
Because there were general discussion threads open, there is confusion where to post things.
If we keep the threads more focused that confusion will disappear.
If you have a thread called The Smiths it doesn't tell anyone what belongs on it.

if you have a thought about something, look and see if it is being discussed. if it is ,bump that thread and continue discussion there. Don't start a thread just to ask a single yes or no question. Look and see if your question fits into a topic. if you have a new topic idea and it is not being discussed go ahead and start a new thread. be sure to search first.

Please don't post the same thing on 2 threads. I know it may have overlap and can go on two threads, but please pick the best one or we have parallel discussions going on.

Think about being able to retirve information at trial or as new developments come up. It is hard to isolate discussion in a general discussion or broad topic thread, but it is easy to find a specific topic and update it with information.

You will get into a groove before you know it and follow the lead of posters that have been here a but longer.They can be very helpful and provide guidance if you are unsure.

Thank you! the goal is to be able to discuss every aspect of the case and devote threads to those apsects.

Wanted to let everyone know I will be closing the gen. discussion thread in a few days and will not be starting a new one.

PLEASE start topic-specific threads!! Just think about the topics you are discussing on the gen. thread, and start a new thread on that topic. A perfect example is the cutting, which Paladine started a thread for (thanks, Paladine!).

It may take a little while to get used to not having a gen. discussion thread, but it will definitely be better as threads will be focused on one topic.

Please let me know if you have any questions.
 
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