State v. Bradley Cooper - 3-15-2011 (after Lunch) - 3.?

[otto]

I think we're getting hung up on a combination of symantics and human nature. Nancy was cancelling her Friday morning run. Carrie asked about Saturday and Nancy said she wasn't available until Sunday because she was planning to paint on Saturday. She had not finalized that with Jessica but Nancy wasn't going to schedule yet another run that she would have to cancel because Nancy was planning to paint. If Jessica had told her that she couldn't do it Saturday morning, Nancy could still call Carrie back if she actually even felt like running on Saturday a.m. That's the way I saw it anyway.

That is how the prosecution would like this detail to be viewed, but since Nancy didn't have plans to paint until 12 hours later, it's surprising that the running friend testified that Nancy claimed to have the plan before it was a plan. I think it's also possible that Nancy did not say that she was painting or did not give a time for painting, but the running friend and the painting friend compared notes such that the running friend (who spoke in absolutes) made her story match the other story.

 

[otto]

Not gossip. Personal experience. We're not talking about third-hand testimony here!

We've been hearing lots of third hand testimony. The husband said the wife said that Nancy said ... too much of this.

 

[jmflu]

I see how juries get hung now. People just don't believe the evidence OR the testimony.

 

[borndem]

I also found Brad's body language quite interesting when CC first took the stand. His head was hung and he didn't even offer a glance at her. Like he just couldn't bear the truth that she was going to spew.

Go -- I noticed his hangin' head, too. I thought, "This can't be good..." along with you.

And has this man ever smiled except in fotos?? Not that he has any reason to these days, just wonderin.'

I went back and read some of the affs, and (was it Krista's??) affiant said that BC's mom was very stony, not affectionate, critical, cold and seemed to show no feelings at all, especially with NC and Bella; the only time she spoke to BC was about her poor mothering skills. :maddening: If BC were raised with that type of mom -- I have read that lack of early bonding (months old, not years) can result in a sociopathic personality -- well that's honestly a sad thing for all of the Coopers. Again, just wonderin.' :waitasec:

 

[otto]

I see how juries get hung now. People just don't believe the evidence OR the testimony.

I think juries have problems with inaccurate or conflicting testimonies. One person says plans were made at 5 in the morning, the person making the plans contradicts that information by saying that plans were not made until 12 hours later. That's a problem when it comes to knowing the facts and believing a witness.

 

[otto]

Go -- I noticed his hangin' head, too. I thought, "This can't be good..." along with you.

And has this man ever smiled except in fotos?? Not that he has any reason to these days, just wonderin.'

I went back and read some of the affs, and (was it Krista's??) affiant said that BC's mom was very stony, not affectionate, critical, cold and seemed to show no feelings at all, especially with NC and Bella; the only time she spoke to BC was about her poor mothering skills. :maddening: If BC were raised with that type of mom -- I have read that lack of early bonding (months old, not years) can result in a sociopathic personality -- well that's honestly a sad thing for all of the Coopers. Again, just wonderin.' :waitasec:

If we're going to throw mud at the parents of Brad ... please realize that the mud is going to fly at Nancy's parents too. Do we really want to take the discussion down that road?

 

[Cheyenne130]

I think juries have problems with inaccurate or conflicting testimonies. One person says plans were made at 5 in the morning, the person making the plans contradicts that information by saying that plans were not made until 12 hours later. That's a problem when it comes to knowing the facts and believing a witness.

Nancy had plans to paint. It was Nancy's plan! She had not yet spoken to Jessica. The plans that Nancy had may have changed if Jessica said that it wouldn't work but Nancy's plan was already in place. Does that make more sense?

 

[BrownRice]

Nancy had plans to paint. It was Nancy's plan! She had not yet spoken to Jessica. The plans that Nancy had may have changed if Jessica said that it wouldn't work but Nancy's plan was already in place. Does that make more sense?

Yes, that is exactly how I interpret it. Nothing nefarious on Carey's part - or JA's - just a timing issue of when the painting plans were solidified. NC figured she'd paint Saturday a.m. but needed to confirm (and she assumed JA would be up for it).

 

[borndem]

- The big vase next to the stairs when JA was last in the house on 7/11/08 had tall decorative sticks in it. Those sticks were no longer there when Cary PD snapped the photo of that entry way (on 7/12/08).


Can you remind me again about the vase with the sticks? I seem to recall a lot of time being spent on that topic in the deposition video. THnx.

Seems to me that in an affy -- which?? -- one (or part of one) of the sticks -- or something verrrrry similar -- was in BC's hair, or hand or something at the dump site.... :waitasec:

 

[jmflu]

If you can throw stones at Nancy's parents...you will truly lose any credibility with this group. That is one fine family, and to disagree would speak volumes about YOU... Not them.

 

[jilly]

Romantic Pursuit: Obnoxious Drunken People making a pass.

I often do things that are not notated on my calendar. The fact that she did not have the Saturday painting appointment listed does not prove that she did not plan to do it. As JA stated, she did not have an appointment listed for the previous Wednesday painting session, but it happened.

When I was her age, I did too!:biggrin: Plus if you're Nancy who's husband is with-holding your weekly allowance because of painting jobs, you might not put it on a calendar for fear of your husband seeing.

 

[Cheyenne130]

Knowing that Nancy was painting at Jessica's house, why wasn't her number the first one that he called when he became concerned and started calling around looking for her?

 

[SleuthyGal]

Knowing that Nancy was painting at Jessica's house

He probably had no idea that Nancy was planning to paint at JA's house. And when JA spoke to BC that Sat morning she didn't tell him of their plans.

 

[Cheyenne130]

He probably had no idea that Nancy was planning to paint at JA's house. And when JA spoke to BC that Sat morning she didn't tell him of their plans.

I get that but as he is calling around looking for Nancy, why wasn't Jessica Adam on that call list?

 

[otto]

If you can throw stones at Nancy's parents...you will truly lose any credibility with this group. That is one fine family, and to disagree would speak volumes about YOU... Not them.

I don't think so. We don't have a situation here where the parents have put themselves all over the news making declarations. I see no reason to throw mud at Brad's parents. If the parents of this completely dysfunctional couple are going to made fair game, I see no reason to stop at the parents of only one half of the dysfunctional couple. Clearly both Brad and Nancy has some serious problems. Since they were both adults, I see no reason to hold their parents responsible for their actions. However, if we're going to dissect Brad and Nancy and blame their parents, I think we need to realize that both sets of parents could be dissected.

 

[jmflu]

What, is this us against you or something? ? It has been noted that Brad's mother was a cold person and that is very sad. That actually gives me sympathy for him. Why try to find something negative to counter with??

 

[otto]

When I was her age, I did too!:biggrin: Plus if you're Nancy who's husband is with-holding your weekly allowance because of painting jobs, you might not put it on a calendar for fear of your husband seeing.

She actually wasn't going to be paid for painting that Saturday morning. Also, Nancy spent $27,000 in one year on credit, the family finances were a mess. Because of the debt, and the fact that they were in the process of divorce, Nancy was receiving $300/wk for groceries, gas and pocket money. I think $300 a week should have been enough for those necessities, but Nancy wanted to spend the money on pedicures/manicures for herself and the pre-schoolers. I get the impression that Nancy was living far beyond their means, and was unwilling to work with Brad to curb their spending.

 

[otto]

What, is this us against you or something? ? It has been noted that Brad's mother was a cold person and that is very sad. That actually gives me sympathy for him. Why try to find something negative to counter with??

Have the friends of Brad's parents come forward and described her as cold, or is this more neighborhood gossip. I would like to see the parents of this family left alone. Is there a problem with that?

 

[Just the Fax]

Otto.....By many accounts, the defendant is a rather odd duck, to say the least. Did you see the deposition on the mental evaluation? Discussions about his parents and upbringing is quite relevant to the discussion of BC's state of mind when considering if he killed Nancy.
Nancy is the victim, as are her parents. You're right, don't go there.

 

[Cheyenne130]

She actually wasn't going to be paid for painting that Saturday morning. Also, Nancy spent $27,000 in one year on credit, the family finances were a mess. Because of the debt, and the fact that they were in the process of divorce, Nancy was receiving $300/wk for groceries, gas and pocket money. I think $300 a week should have been enough for those necessities, but Nancy wanted to spend the money on pedicures/manicures for herself and the pre-schoolers. I get the impression that Nancy was living far beyond their means, and was unwilling to work with Brad to curb their spending.

I seriously doubt that Nancy was the only one running up that credit card debt. We have evidence presented by the defense that Brad was pretty lousy with finances. I have to believe it was mutual. I can appreciate Brad wanting to get the family finances under control but if he was only controlling half of the problem then I can certainly understand why sparks would fly.