The Verdict Waiting Room #2

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Freya1977

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Eammon Atkinson ‏@EAtkinson7 1m
#BadenClay judge: "They may be proved by circumstantial evidence alone, by direct evidence alone, or by a combination of direct and (cont)
(cont) circumstantial: that is, both direct and circumstantial evidence are acceptable proof of facts." #BadenClay
 

Freya1977

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Eammon Atkinson ‏@EAtkinson7 58s
#BadenClay judge to jury: "So you should consider all the evidence, including circumstantial evidence." @7NewsBrisbane
 

KG1

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I actually feel they are close but needing to be absolutely sure. This is a huge decision they are making ...... and it is huge deciding such a thing on only circumstantial evidence, I would certainly be feeling the pressure and would need some reassurance. I hope I'm right but I do believe they are close now.....

I think that they are close too Thinking. I hope I am right and that they are close to a GUILTY OF MURDER verdict.
 

squizzey1

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There definitely won't be a verdict today.

if they were close and their query was only about circumstantial evidence hopefully not too long but yes today is nearly gone , but cant they extend if they have a verdict or are VERY close
 

kiwi50

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Kate Kyriacou ‏@KateKyriacou 23s

Judge says a case based entirely on circumstantial evidence means guilt should be only rational inference based on circumstances. #badenclay

This is worrying, he might as well say if you have any doubt you must acquit. Many cases only have circumstantial evidence.
 

alioop

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Francene Norton ‏@francenenorton 1m
Justice John Byrne is re-reading parts of his summing up again, to do with circumstantial evidence. @abcnews #badenclay
Justice Byrne: both direct and circumstantial evidence are to be considered. #badenclay @abcnews

Sarah Elks ‏@sarahelks 36s

Judge: "If there is any reasonable possibility consistent with innocence, it is your duty to find the Accused not guilty." #badenclay


TimArvier ‏@TimArvier9 1m
Judge is reading instructions on circumstantial evidence to jury now #badenclay

Well the judge has made this clear. So the only other possibility raised by the defence was suicide, no abduction etc. So if the jury does not think there is a reasonable possibility Allison committed suicide then they have to find him guilty of murder or manslaughter.

I'll bet that one or more of them has the belief that they cannot find someone guilty if all the evidence is circumstantial.

Probably. Hopefully that's now cleared up for them. They also don't have to be satisfied about each individual piece of evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. Just taking all that evidence as a whole is what is needed to be determined beyond reasonable doubt for a guilty verdict.
 

marlywings

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if they were close and their query was only about circumstantial evidence hopefully not too long but yes today is nearly gone , but cant they extend if they have a verdict or are VERY close


Kate Kyriacou @KateKyriacou · 25m

The jury will usually deliberate until 4.15pm but can request to go later. #badenclay
 

Smegal

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I am very worried that they still think that it matters one way or another whether evidence is circumstantial or not. They need to consider all evidence (both direct and circumstantial), the fact that they are trying to make a distinction concerns me!

I agree. I can understand needing clarification on the legal jargon but they've been deliberating for two days, shouldn't that have been asked some time ago? Hopefully Squizzey is right and they are close to making a decision but just wanted that extra reassurance.
 

alioop

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I actually feel they are close but needing to be absolutely sure. This is a huge decision they are making ...... and it is huge deciding such a thing on only circumstantial evidence, I would certainly be feeling the pressure and would need some reassurance. I hope I'm right but I do believe they are close now.....

I am feeling the same.
 

Freya1977

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Sarah Elks ‏@sarahelks 35s

For Justice Byrne's full redirection to the #badenclay jury on circumstantial evidence, check @australian website shortly. I'll tweet link.
 

squizzey1

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I agree. I can understand needing clarification on the legal jargon but they've been deliberating for two days, shouldn't that have been asked some time ago? Hopefully Squizzey is right and they are close to making a decision but just wanted that extra reassurance.

actually nearly three days , not being picky, but it is dragging on
 

alioop

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This is why I think juries should be given written directions about these legal issues. They can determine the facts but it's very hard for them to apply the legal requirements when they can't see it in writing.
 

alioop

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actually nearly three days , not being picky, but it is dragging on

Squizz lucky you weren't holding out for the Rolf Harris verdict. You would be a shadow of your former frog from the stress.
 

squizzey1

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time is up are they extending , come on keep going
 

ollijack

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07:32am :cuckoo:
Good morning, dear Websleuthers! I'm now here, finally. First I need :cup: or :coffeeup: or :coffeecup: or all together.

:rockon: :cheer: :rockon: :cheer: :rockon: :cheer: Sorry, but we have won the FIFA World Cup! Our fan-zone in Berlin: more than 250.000 fans;
in München and Hamburg about 50.000 fans; everywhere public viewing and high life!
The pics are showing you our goal scorer and our chancellor with the football team and of course once more our hot Neuer.
............... And now right away to Justice for Allison![/QUOT

It was brilliant. Congratulations. *advertiser censored*
 

MsAnais

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At the risk of sounding outrageously schmaltzy :blushing:- I think it would be powerful if we all collectively imagined the jury coming back with a resounding "Guilty" and let ourselves feel the relief and positive feelings at receiving that news.

I'm a big believer in the power of thought - seems worth trying as otherwise the anxiety will just make us batty!!! :seeya:
 

Oddsocks

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I'm having such a bad/sad day I wouldn't be surprised if he's acquitted just to add to today's crap.
One of my pets (aka best friend) died on the lounge next to me :'(
 

MadDoc

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07:32am :cuckoo:
Good morning, dear Websleuthers! I'm now here, finally. First I need :cup: or :coffeeup: or :coffeecup: or all together.

:rockon: :cheer: :rockon: :cheer: :rockon: :cheer: Sorry, but we have won the FIFA World Cup! Our fan-zone in Berlin: more than 250.000 fans;
in München and Hamburg about 50.000 fans; everywhere public viewing and high life!
The pics are showing you our goal scorer and our chancellor with the football team and of course once more our hot Neuer.
............... And now right away to Justice for Allison!

Congratulations to the German team! It sounds like a very well deserved victory!

My heritage is Polish ("Basil Fawlty" voice: Don't mention the war! Don't mention the war!) but in any match between Germany and anybody other than Poland, I'll happily support Germany.

Let's take anything positive that happens today as an omen for "Justice for Allison".
 
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