Theories On What Happened to Caylee Part #8

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GeekyGirl

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And the adhesive side would have been covered with Caylees DNA. The DNA witness today got positive "Touch DNA" in a case with a conviction, in which the "Touch DNA" was 20 years old, But no DNA on the adhesive side of the "murder weapon??" I was born at night, but not last night.

Try an experiment if you're masochistic (actually don't, this is a demonstrative hypothetical) and firmly apply a place of quality duct tape on your inner thigh tight enough that if it were on your face it would suffocate you, and if you dare, wait a day and pull it off!! Along with your flesh of course. The point is, that duct tape wasn't tested for being a murder weapon, before it was thrust into that role, and it certainly wasn't tested so it could be verified as the murder weapon either.

The State is leaving so many doors of reasonable doubt cracked, one of them is bound to blow open, and when that happens, Justice for Caylee will shamefully not be served. JMOO

And then leave said duct tape exposed to the two elements that most degrade DNA, and break down much of the residue containing said epithelial cells for, oh say, 6 months... Whether it was the murder weapon or not, it would have had SOME DNA on it... Unless the DNA was destroyed.

ETA: I'm as cynical as can be, but this seems like clear and simple logic to me. MOO
 

LongtimeMedic

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detailed timeline of the 31 days. Cell phone logs for the 15th/16th at the following link:

http://www.acandyrose.com/casey_anthony_31days.htm

I've looked at the timeline... GA, ICA and Caylee were home with ample time alone for an accidental drowning regardless of whether GA or ICA were awake or not. Tell me... is there a link to GA's cell phone movement (ping map) for this entire time as well... or Lee's or Cindy's?? I'd love to see it, but I haven't found one.
 

GeekyGirl

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And then leave said duct tape exposed to the two elements that most degrade DNA, and break down much of the residue containing said epithelial cells for, oh say, 6 months... Whether it was the murder weapon or not, it would have had SOME DNA on it... Unless the DNA was destroyed.

ETA: I'm as cynical as can be, but this seems like clear and simple logic to me. MOO

Bad form to quote myself, I know, but I think my brain is fried and that post ended up being very confusing. I was trying to say that IMO, the lack of DNA means nothing. The tape was exposed to the elements for so long, that I would expect to NOT find DNA. MOO
 

Baznme

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And the adhesive side would have been covered with Caylees DNA. The DNA witness today got positive "Touch DNA" in a case with a conviction, in which the "Touch DNA" was 20 years old, But no DNA on the adhesive side of the "murder weapon??" I was born at night, but not last night.

Try an experiment if you're masochistic (actually don't, this is a demonstrative hypothetical) and firmly apply a place of quality duct tape on your inner thigh tight enough that if it were on your face it would suffocate you, and if you dare, wait a day and pull it off!! Along with your flesh of course. The point is, that duct tape wasn't tested for being a murder weapon, before it was thrust into that role, and it certainly wasn't tested so it could be verified as the murder weapon either.

The State is leaving so many doors of reasonable doubt cracked, one of them is bound to blow open, and when that happens, Justice for Caylee will shamefully not be served. JMOO

I was born at night too but like you, it certainly wasn't last night. It was many many nights ago...LOL

BBM - in your comments, waiting one day before pulling duct tape off your thigh wouldn't prove a thing if your comparing that to what was on Caylee's face. I don't know how you "test" for the tape being a murder weapon unless you put duct tape on someone and allow them to perish.....but common sense tells me it could happen to a 2 year old. With the body along with the tape being exposed to the conditions it was, the adhesive side of the tape dissipated....therefore any fingerprints that may have BEEN on that side of the tape was gone. My logic tells me if the adhesive is gone, so are the prints. That's not a hole in the State's case nor does it equate to "so many doors of reasonable doubt cracked" in their case. That's the way it is. They don't need the prints anyway.....they've got so much else to get her convicted. The DEFENSE has nothing and it's becoming more and more evident every day.
 

Baznme

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I say Caylee got up when GA and Casey were asleep and CA was gone to work, and went swimming as she so loved to do... a fatal mistake made by hundreds of toddlers every year. GA got up first and looked and and saw her missing. He then found her on the bottom of the pool... she may have been there all night. That sure won't look good for the Anthony's if you called 911 and said we found her in the pool, and we're not sure when she got in there, and she's obviously dead. That is when Casey finds out. Lee and George orchestrated the cover-up and tell Casey to just disappear from the family and 'we'll deal with mom when we have to, just don't say anything!!'

Casey's car got towed on the 30th of June, the Anthony's should have received the first notice by the 7th or so of July... but it went 'missing' too. All the same, George doesn't pick up the car until the 15th?? So they haven't seen their daughter or granddaughter since the 16th of June, but what the heck... we'll wait another week to get the car (which I don't know what that cost, so if you do please tell me). First thing GA does when he goes to pick up the car, aside from buying gas in advance, he tells the tow guy "My granddaughter has been missing a month!" Wow... first time tahat was pubklicly announced! and then says something about how he hopes that smell from the car isn't them, and asked the tow guy to open the trunk?? Really?? Why??

What's his next step?? Drives the "reeking" car home, and goes to work! You can't ignore these things in my opinion. They tell me that Casey is guilty of many crimes... and so are several others that all deserve their punishment too!! Actual Justice For Caylee!!! Not Vengeance... that is reserved for a much higher power.

There are extensive theories on what happened to Caylee and lots of detailed information all about when they got the notice for the car, that it was stuck in the front door for so many days and unnoticed because they never used the front door, etc., etc., etc. I believe the costs for tow storage, towing, etc. was about $450.00 if I'm not mistaken. Irregardless, there are many many posts that address the conversation between CA and GA when he got the car to the house. CA sent him to work. She cleaned the car. She may have cleaned the stain but not enough to erase all traces of decomp IMO.

I don't know where you are concluding that there's vengeance against Casey. It's not coming from here as my experience is everyone here posts with fairness and respect no matter what your opinion is. If Casey is guilty, she will be punished accordingly as most of us here still believe in the justice system and thank heaven for small favors we have HHJP residing over this case. If she is found not guilty, she'll be released. It could happen.
 

manorlady

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I have been wondering if the Anthonys were involved somehow. I am sure I have missed many discussions about it on this site, so this may be stale repetition.
First, I reject the idea that any other family member than Casey participated in a psychotic 31-day head in the sand bender. Therefore, the George involvement is ridiculous. And forget about Lee.
However, I do wonder if the Anthonys may have had chloroform somewhere in the home, and when they realized what had happened, they suddenly understood that Casey had taken it and used it, so they tried to cover up this fact. This could also be the source of George's alleged claim that it was an accident that went bad. I highly doubt that Casey manufactured chloroform, even if she looked it up. Stealing is her MO.
 

Tink

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I say Caylee got up when GA and Casey were asleep and CA was gone to work, and went swimming as she so loved to do... a fatal mistake made by hundreds of toddlers every year. GA got up first and looked and and saw her missing. He then found her on the bottom of the pool... she may have been there all night. That sure won't look good for the Anthony's if you called 911 and said we found her in the pool, and we're not sure when she got in there, and she's obviously dead. That is when Casey finds out. Lee and George orchestrated the cover-up and tell Casey to just disappear from the family and 'we'll deal with mom when we have to, just don't say anything!!'

Casey's car got towed on the 30th of June, the Anthony's should have received the first notice by the 7th or so of July... but it went 'missing' too. All the same, George doesn't pick up the car until the 15th?? So they haven't seen their daughter or granddaughter since the 16th of June, but what the heck... we'll wait another week to get the car (which I don't know what that cost, so if you do please tell me). First thing GA does when he goes to pick up the car, aside from buying gas in advance, he tells the tow guy "My granddaughter has been missing a month!" Wow... first time tahat was pubklicly announced! and then says something about how he hopes that smell from the car isn't them, and asked the tow guy to open the trunk?? Really?? Why??

What's his next step?? Drives the "reeking" car home, and goes to work! You can't ignore these things in my opinion. They tell me that Casey is guilty of many crimes... and so are several others that all deserve their punishment too!! Actual Justice For Caylee!!! Not Vengeance... that is reserved for a much higher power.

This honestly doesn't make much sense to me. Let's say that, yes, Caylee did somehow get into the pool and drown and George got up and found her. As you said, this tragedy happens all the time to toddlers. It's terrible, but it happens - so why wouldn't he just call the authorities? Casey is just crazy enough to think she can lie her way out of any situation, but George knows that this isn't a situation you can just avoid. Eventually, it has to be faced and it makes far more sense to face it now than later.

Their evidence was that the tow company notice was delivered to the front door so they missed it. (A similar thing happened to a friend of mine where a notice about a package was put on the front door she never uses - she didn't notice it for over a month.) I think that George brought gas with him because he knew the car had been towed - and what would be a likely reason for Casey's car to be towed? Running out of gas. If you don't need it, no big deal, but it makes sense to bring it just in case. I think that on the way over, he was starting to think things over and get worried. Casey had been talking to Cindy, telling her all was well and never mentioning that she didn't have the car. Now, here they have this notice saying that the car had been towed much earlier. Why hadn't Casey mentioned not having the car to Cindy? What could be going on? I think he started to get anxious, all this was running through his mind, and that's why he blurted out the fact that he hadn't seen Caylee in a month.

I thought George's testimony made his thought process when he got to the car pretty clear. He smelled the decomp, had the terrible thought that it might be his daughter and/or granddaughter, and yet denied to himself that it could be possible. Who can believe something like that? I think when he saw the bag of garbage he convinced himself that "oh, the smell was just garbage."

If he'd actually had something to do with Caylee's death, why would he draw the attention of the tow-yard guy to the smell? Makes no sense. He could have just zipped the car out of there and nobody the wiser.

I think that George knew Casey had problems and was a liar, but who would expect that your child would kill your grandchild? You'd want to believe any possible scenario except that one. Sadly, today he knows it's true and it must be breaking his heart. Cindy's too.

Tink
 

katydid23

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According to whose testimony??

It looks like the state is getting ready to testify about the timeline of the 16th, using computer forensics, and I will bet, the phone records as well. This is what LDB said this morning in court right before JB freaked out.

Here is a question for you though. IF there had been an accident that morning, and both George and Casey were there, why don't they know approximate time of the event? Baez even said today there was ' NO TIMELINE OFFERED.' Does that make sense?

AND, if you were the attorney, and your client told you that she was innocent and the incident was an accident, wouldn't you look at her computer usage for THAT DAY? This morning Baez admitted he has not done that yet.
 

katydid23

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Quoting myself which is bad form, but I thought this might be relevant in light of Linda's comments in court today re 16 June and a timeline they will be presenting to the jury in their rebuttal case. Woohoo! :) Of course we were all hoping they would do this as it can be clearly shown that there is no way Caylee drowned in the swimming pool in the "early morning hours" as the defense stated.

My timeline did not concentrate on the early morning - so I will be updating this later with more information.

Finally, I am absolutely STUNNED!! that Baez did not break down the activity on the computer on this day to see that his clients "story" was bogus and could not possibly be true.

First, thank you for setting out the timeline for that day. Apparently you have already done more research than Baez has for the potential timeline of that day. lol

Here is one more thing you might consider adding. It would plug up that huge hole before the 11:47 am call to Tony. [ from ACandyROse timeline]

June 16, 2008 (Mon)
09:27am
Casey Anthony @PC:
PhotoBucket Upload
Casey uploaded a photo of interior of the Fusian Ultra Lounge at 9:27am from IP address 97.100.16.240 which is the desktop PC at 4937 Hopespring Drive


So this seems to show that she was uploading Fusion pix at 9:30 am. So the defense might want to say she was busy doing that and Caylee snuck outside at that time. But the problem for the DT is that there is that pesky 19 minute call to Tony @ 11:47. He has said she was fine that day and not upset at all.

SO IS THE DT GOING TO SAY SHE WAS UPLOADING FUSION PIX, HER CHILD DROWNS, SHE IS CRYING AND HOLDING HER DEAD BODY---AND THEN SHE CALLS TONY AND TALKS ABOUT THEIR MOVIE DATE AN HOUR LATER?
 

GeekyGirl

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It looks like the state is getting ready to testify about the timeline of the 16th, using computer forensics, and I will bet, the phone records as well. This is what LDB said this morning in court right before JB freaked out.

Here is a question for you though. IF there had been an accident that morning, and both George and Casey were there, why don't they know approximate time of the event? Baez even said today there was ' NO TIMELINE OFFERED.' Does that make sense?

AND, if you were the attorney, and your client told you that she was innocent and the incident was an accident, wouldn't you look at her computer usage for THAT DAY? This morning Baez admitted he has not done that yet.

No that makes no sense. I really never thought it would be the DT that convinced me it was murder, but I'm leaning more and more that way every day. I almost feel like the state is going to win by default, and that doesn't sit well with me, even if the defendant is Casey.
 

LongtimeMedic

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It looks like the state is getting ready to testify about the timeline of the 16th, using computer forensics, and I will bet, the phone records as well. This is what LDB said this morning in court right before JB freaked out.

Here is a question for you though. IF there had been an accident that morning, and both George and Casey were there, why don't they know approximate time of the event? Baez even said today there was ' NO TIMELINE OFFERED.' Does that make sense?

AND, if you were the attorney, and your client told you that she was innocent and the incident was an accident, wouldn't you look at her computer usage for THAT DAY? This morning Baez admitted he has not done that yet.

Why would Baez narrow the time frame down for the State? So they can use it against his client? No one shows their cards when they don't have to. As for the computer, the defense team did retain a computer expert to translate the searches the State disclosed. The defense doesn't have one retained now due to the fact they brought this up after they presented and finished their CIC last week. JMO
 

katydid23

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No that makes no sense. I really never thought it would be the DT that convinced me it was murder, but I'm leaning more and more that way every day. I almost feel like the state is going to win by default, and that doesn't sit well with me, even if the defendant is Casey.

But in reality, even if she had a better attorney, the facts would remain the same. And the rest of the DT team is very experienced and well respected. So Baez is not single handedly causing her demise. She is the one who created this nightmare. imoo
 

GeekyGirl

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But in reality, even if she had a better attorney, the facts would remain the same. And the rest of the DT team is very experienced and well respected. So Baez is not single handedly causing her demise. She is the one who created this nightmare. imoo

True, but still... I would feel better knowing that she a competent defense. There are stones they're leaving unturned, and I just think that the jury deserves as much evidence as possible, especially in a DP case. *sigh* I think I've enough for one day... Good night all!
 

katydid23

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Why would Baez narrow the time frame down for the State? So they can use it against his client? No one shows their cards when they don't have to. As for the computer, the defense team did retain a computer expert to translate the searches the State disclosed. The defense doesn't have one retained now due to the fact they brought this up after they presented and finished their CIC last week. JMO

WHY would they narrow the time frame? Because if it were the truth then it would exonerate her. If it were the truth than she would say it happened at 9:45 am and then there would be corroborating evidence to verify her story. Both George and Casey would be off their cells and house phones and computers at that time and for a while afterwards. So the computer forensics would exonerate her. They could ask the neighbors, 2 of who have unobstructed views into the Anthonys yard where they were at that time. If they were away from home, that makes the story more believable.

The only reason not to disclose facts such as the time and the person who pulled her from the pool is to protect themselves because it is A LIE. imo

And if they had a forensics expert then they should have looked already at that key date. Why wouldn't they? Wouldn't they want to look for things to bolster her story. IF IT IS TRUE THEN WHY HIDE THE FACTS?
 

LongtimeMedic

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I was born at night too but like you, it certainly wasn't last night. It was many many nights ago...LOL

BBM - in your comments, waiting one day before pulling duct tape off your thigh wouldn't prove a thing if your comparing that to what was on Caylee's face. I don't know how you "test" for the tape being a murder weapon unless you put duct tape on someone and allow them to perish.....but common sense tells me it could happen to a 2 year old. With the body along with the tape being exposed to the conditions it was, the adhesive side of the tape dissipated....therefore any fingerprints that may have BEEN on that side of the tape was gone. My logic tells me if the adhesive is gone, so are the prints. That's not a hole in the State's case nor does it equate to "so many doors of reasonable doubt cracked" in their case. That's the way it is. They don't need the prints anyway.....they've got so much else to get her convicted. The DEFENSE has nothing and it's becoming more and more evident every day.

The only point I was trying to drive home, was that the witness today told of a case where they retrieved touch dna after 20 years! We know that there was trace dna on the adhesive side at marker 17, the FBI testified to that, so yes, there was dna on the duct tape. But if we're to believe that the tape was affixed to the face so firmly as to cause suffication, there was a lot of dna there at some point, and there could have been more determined had the State contacted Dr Eikelenboom to see if they could have retrieved a full profile. Baez squeezed it in that Dr Eikelenboom had contacted the State and offered his services to them for free but they turned them down. Ashton screamed an objection, and Baez wasn't allowed to pursue that line of questioning. Wonder why Ashton would turn them down???
 

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Why would Baez narrow the time frame down for the State? So they can use it against his client? No one shows their cards when they don't have to. As for the computer, the defense team did retain a computer expert to translate the searches the State disclosed. The defense doesn't have one retained now due to the fact they brought this up after they presented and finished their CIC last week. JMO

Why would Baez narrow the time frame down for the state?

Because if the story were true there wouldn't be CONTRADICTORY evidence for that narrow time frame.

If the source of the story was ICA, you would think somebody would have checked out what ICA was doing on June 16...maybe before Baez got up in front of the nation and said she was running around with George hunting for Caylee and then crying and crying and crying.

If it turns out ICA spent the whole time up until George's e-pass records show George headed for work viewing shot girl pictures and instant messaging them suggestions about what to wear for "Hot Body" night at Fusian, this will be ICA's 3rd version of "what happened to Caylee" proven to be a lie.
 

LongtimeMedic

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WHY would they narrow the time frame? Because if it were the truth then it would exonerate her. If it were the truth than she would say it happened at 9:45 am and then there would be corroborating evidence to verify her story. Both George and Casey would be off their cells and house phones and computers at that time and for a while afterwards. So the computer forensics would exonerate her. They could ask the neighbors, 2 of who have unobstructed views into the Anthonys yard where they were at that time. If they were away from home, that makes the story more believable.

The only reason not to disclose facts such as the time and the person who pulled her from the pool is to protect themselves because it is A LIE. imo

And if they had a forensics expert then they should have looked already at that key date. Why wouldn't they? Wouldn't they want to look for things to bolster her story. IF IT IS TRUE THEN WHY HIDE THE FACTS?

Because anything the defense would offer, they would use try to use it to convict her. Baez said it was in the early morning hours... how do we know that doesn't mean anytime after 12:01am?? after all... that's the early morning hours.
 
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