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Thoughts and Logic

Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by armywife210, Oct 21, 2005.

  1. armywife210

    armywife210 Active Member

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    I am of the belief that RDI. However, as I sit here right now I am trying to be openminded and just think about LOGIC... while all of these far fetched ideas roll around, and perhaps one of them is right, I tend to lean a bit more to the logical side of things. Unless a RDI, the only logical thing I can come up with is some sicko meant to kidnap her after silencing her. He then got a bit excited, brought her downstairs. Began sexually abusing her, torturing her through the garotee. Sometime, whether it was when he was bringing her downstairs or when he was down there he banged her head hard. Perhaps he dropped her on the cement. Perhaps he banged her head on a doorway. Its hard for me to believe though that such a bad injury would be caused by an accidental bang.
    Also there are just so many other things that I just can't fit into the IDi theory.
     
  2. Brefie

    Brefie New Member

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    Me too armywife. I think the crack in her skull was way too big to have simply been 'knocked' against something. That would mean the intruder was careless and rushing - hardly fits in to not waking anyone up and Lord knows with the length of the RN we know the perp was in no hurry.
     
  3. wenchie

    wenchie Former Member

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    Added to that, the "kidnapper" washed her, redressed her, drew a heart in her palm and wrapped her up in a blanket.
     
  4. narlacat

    narlacat Former Member

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    And was considerate enough to give her a little late night snack.
     
  5. armywife210

    armywife210 Active Member

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    What a nice guy that wackjob intruder must have been! People with that kind of consideration for others, well I just can't say enough good things about them!:rolleyes:
    What do you think is the deal with the heart? To me it looks nothing like a heart in the autopsy photos. Even if you take into account that it could have been rubbed off a bit over time, it still doesn't look like a "perfectly formed heart".
     
  6. narlacat

    narlacat Former Member

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    Hi Armywife,
    I don't think it looks like a heart either and don't how Patsy thought it was a "perfectly formed heart". I guess it could have rubbed off partially mkaing it look more like a U....
     
  7. Maikai

    Maikai New Member

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    pervert---but loving parents who had absolutely no history of violence, perversion, or mistreating their children. Where's the logic in that? God only knows how many senseless crimes are perpetrated against innocent people, because they just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, or happened to come to the attention of the sicko. Who would have thought some l6 year old goth kid would kill a well-known defense attorney's wife?

    Besides no history whatsoever of the Ramseys having a criminal mind, if you think they're involved then you have to believe one of them would use a garrotte to strangle their daughter to death, while she was clawing at the cord. And they could look into her face while doing it. Then, they knew all the movie lines, and had seen all the movies referenced in the note, and they had a stun gun to add to the torture.

    And then one of them just for kicks clobbered poor JBR in the head with a blunt object with a lot of force.

    After all that, then they were able to site down and write the note, with the lights off in the house---no panic or terror, running around in the dark to cover everything up....and THEN...calmly went back to bed.

    The logic, when you look at the crime scene-the acts against JBR, and the note, is that this was done by someone that wasn't a stranger to violence; to breaking and entering; and possibly an attraction to little girls. They had a stun gun, possibly a bat and rope---a toolkit for a kidnapping--one they had no idea as to how to pull it off.

    As far as the heart on the hand, an article about JR was found that was marked up like a scene from "Ricochet." X's on the other entreprenaur's winners (in red), and a red heart around John Ramsey's face. Ricochet was all about revenge----the two heart's could be connected---another movie theme.
     
  8. Maikai

    Maikai New Member

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    did not show loving care. JBR was simply dragged into the cellar room (arms were outstretched).....and the blanket thrown over her---her face and feet were sticking out. She was left with the garotte around her neck, and a crushed skull, and was stungunned in the face and back. The perp made an attempt to wipe her, leaving navy blue fibers on her. He wasn't that good--he left his DNA and footprint and handwriting on the note.
     
  9. narlacat

    narlacat Former Member

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    Mostly all of this is blatent misinformation.
    The blanket was wrapped around her "papoose style", it wasn't just "thrown over her" at all.
    There is absolutely no evidence to support Lou Smit's stun gun theory. The only way that theory could have been proven to have been correct is if JonBenet's body was exhumed.
    We all know it wasn't.
    The DNA was useless, it cannot be relied upon to point to the killer. It was degraded and could not be dated. " This is not a DNA case".
     
  10. Brefie

    Brefie New Member

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    JBR was the furthest thing from being in the wrong place at the wrong time. How can being in your bed at night be classed as 'wrong place / wrong time?'
    Also, there was an RN - addressed to Mr. Ramsey.
    Wrong place / time suggests chance - the only people taking a chance, IMO were the Ramseys. It worked!

    Also, people snap all the time. It's not all that rare.
     
  11. Maikai

    Maikai New Member

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    Doberson did the scientific research of stun gun articles worldwide---he replicated the marks on pigs, and he's gone on record saying he thinks they'e stun gun marks with a high degree of certainty. Doberson should know--he missed stungun marks in the Bogg's case, and when the police found a stun gun in a suspect's trunk, they exhumed the body and did the tests and matched the stun gun marks. It was the only piece of evidence the police had to tie the suspect to the crime and he was convicted.

    The DNA is not useless. It was only last year they found another blood spot that was never tested, and it had most of the markers--it was a good sample, and matched the others, including DNA under JBR's fingernails. You can't discount the DNA---and JBR got a piece of the perp.
     
  12. Maikai

    Maikai New Member

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    I also said someone can happen to come to the attention of the wrong person, which is what happened in the Ramsey case. It could have been the pageants...could have been the Access Article 5 days earlier which was the trigger. Wealthy father and beauty queen daughter are the perfect combination if someone was looking for a kidnap victim....someone that was inspired by "Ransom" and other movies.

    People can snap, but there's usually some history there, or other factors such as alcohol, drugs, financial problems, or history of mental instability.
     
  13. Holdontoyourhat

    Holdontoyourhat Former Member

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    You're right. Serious problems don't just pop up. Whoever killed JBR is seriously disturbed and IMO can't hide it very well.
     
  14. Lacy Wood

    Lacy Wood Former Member

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  15. concernedperson

    concernedperson Former Member

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    The things that go on in families can be hidden for years and years. Most would think it not appropriate to discuss this with themselves and certainly not outsiders. Please venture over to Crimes in the News from time to time to see how dysfunction plays out in our country everyday. It is not always a class situation i.e. abused wives and/or children, it happens across the board.
     
  16. why_nutt

    why_nutt New Member

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    JonBenet was not "dragged" into the cellar room. The forensic examination in the autopsy report does not have the back of her heels, legs, buttocks, back, or hair filled with loose cement dust from being dragged across the floor.

    The blanket was not thrown over her. John Ramsey said that she was wrapped with the blanket under her, and on that matter, the autopsy supports his statement forensically.

    Her face and feet were sticking out? So what? I have a picture of John Ramsey holding the infant JonBenet. In it, she is wrapped papoose-style in a blanket, with her face and feet sticking out. Would you like to see it? Would you take it to mean that John Ramsey hated his daughter when she was an infant?

    The ligature was left around JonBenet's neck, true, but all that can mean is the possibility that whoever put it there was more afraid of leaving even more forensic evidence behind, through fiber evidence or DNA, via the process of needing to force the killer's fingers through the nonexistent gap between the cord and the neck skin in order to help loosen the cord up for removal.

    The crushed skull? Nobody, whether intruder or Ramsey parent, knew she had a crushed skull. It is a fact that nobody has X-ray vision, which is what would have been needed to see the fracture. All that person knew was that JonBenet had been hit on the head, and that she became unconscious. I have a hint for some people: this is a routine thing to see in comedies. Remember that when looking around for movies the killer may have enjoyed, and remember that the Ramseys loved comedies.

    Stun guns marks on face and back? Not proven. Since John Ramsey said he had to practically manhandle JonBenet's unconscious body to get her out of the car, he could have inflicted abrasions on her then, banging her against the car door frame on the way out of the back seat.

    Navy blue fibers left on her? Every single item of navy blue fabric that John, Patsy, Burke, JonBenet, John Andrew, Melinda, and every other relative and friend who lived or visited the house ever owned were not taken into evidence, therefore it is to this day premature to say that whatever blue fabric left the fiber evidence was never in the house prior to that night.

    The footprint could have been deposited years before, as proven by photos showing that the so-called "mold" which is really concrete dust can persist, completely unchanged, for many years. Shall I trot out that proof again, comparing the "mold" from the crime scene with "mold" that a certain other forum owner took pictures of a long time later?
     
  17. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    Exactly concernedperson! We don't know that John wasn't a violent person, we don't know what went on in that home behind closed doors. He could have been abusing JB for years and noone knew about it! Who says it was his first time, but even then look at the rage killing of Pamela Vitale... I'll bet that was that kid's first killing too. A criminal has to start somewhere.
     
  18. concernedperson

    concernedperson Former Member

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    I so appreciate your thoughts backing mine up. If we had to be brutally honest some people would cower in the background. But we go gently into the night. Thanks for being my friend. Hoping for justice for victims everywhere. :blowkiss:
     
  19. Brefie

    Brefie New Member

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    Exactly! People are not born with a history of violence.
     
  20. why_nutt

    why_nutt New Member

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    The day before John began the affair that would result in his divorce, would anybody have been able to say, "Sure, I know John Ramsey really well, I know he's going to ruin his marriage and behave so badly his wife will refuse to accept counseling in her eagerness to get rid of his lying ass"?

    I somehow think nobody predicted that turn of events, which means that John Ramsey can behave unpredictably, even to the most intimate of his family like his wife.

    And let us not forget that Patsy Ramsey, who has gone on the official record as saying that she experienced several panic attacks in her life, had those attacks denied by John, who knew her well enough to have sex with her and father children with her, yet insisted that even though he knew her so well, he could never even imagine her having panic attacks.
     

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