TKS S1 Ep 4: A Darkness on the Edge of Town

[DakotaMayi]

Just came home to Robert Kolker's booked delivered to my door... more LISK stuff to get into.

 

[lookingaroundli]

I'm new and this is my first post. I'm. It sure if this is where it goes but after watching episodes 3 & 4 tonight, I started really looking at the dr. I thought about the wiki edits in episode 1 and looked at them tonight. There are edits from an IP address numerous times, including tonight, that goes back to ft Meyers Florida. The dr moved to ft Meyers Florida. I think PD really dropped the ball on this guy. I suspect that he had a deep belief that he could medically "cure" these girls of their ways and when he couldn't, he would put them in a "suitable" place to examine his case work.


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[KalamityKay]

I live about 30 mins north of Daytona Beach. I remember these murders clearly. I also work in the Daytona Beach area, and frequently pass all of the areas the victims were found in. I hope something comes of this being put back in the spotlight on the show.

 

[FindHG]

I am copying and pasting this research I did for the DB, AC and GB cases. Since the abducting and disposal of women's bodies are an outdoor event I was curious about the weather, moon phases, etc. The first DB victim, Laquetta Gunter, sounds like overkill, and risky!

DB4

Sat. 12-24-05 Laquetta Gunter.....Mostly cloudy and hazy....winds N-NE 10-24 gusting to 24....Moon last quarter...rise 12:45 am...set 12:45 pm

Fri. 1-13-06 Julie Green....Fog, rain, thunderstorms, overall cloudy....wind S-SW gusts to 37 mph...Moon full...rise 5:07 pm...set 6:59 am

Fri. 2-24-06 Iwanna Patton....Overall cloudy and overcast....wind NE gusts to 23 mph...Moon waning cresent..rise 4:24 am...set 2:34 pm

Sat, 1-3-2008 Stacy Gage.....Over cloudy and overcast wind N/NW/NE, gusts to 32mph...Moon waning cresent...rise 3:09 am...set 1:44 pm

AC4

Sat. 10-7-06 Molly Jean Dilts...Rain, overcast..wind NE, gusts to 32 mph....Moon Full...rise 6:43 pm...set 7:30 am

Tues. 10-17-06 Barbara Breider...Rain, light rain...wind SE, gusts to 30 mph...Moon waning cresent...rise 2:43 am...set 4:25 pm

Wed. 11-15-06 Tracy Roberts...Mostly cloudy, overcast, fog...Wind SE, gusts to 17 mph...Moon waning cresent....rise 1:30 am...set 2:07 pm

Sun. 11-19-06 Kim Raffo....Mostly cloudy, overcast....Wind NW, gusts to 20 mph...Moon waning cresent...rise 5:33 am...set 3:37 pm

GB4

Mon. 7-9-07 Maureen Brainard Barnes....Mostly clear...Wind variable, gusts to 21 mph...Moon waning cresent...rise 12:56 am...set 3:48 pm

Sun. 7-12-09 Melissa Barthelemy....Rain, clouds, clear by 8 pm...Wind West, gusts to 21 mph...Moon waning gibbous...rise 10:57 pm...set 10:32 am

Sun. 6-6-10 Megan Waterman....Overall cloudy w/occasional clearing and rain...Wind W/SW gusts to 32 mph...Moon waning cresent... rise 1:33 am..set 2:35 pm

Thur. 9-2-10 Amber Costello...Mostly clear/ a few clouds...Wind South, gusts to 17mph....No Moonrise....set at 3:12pm

source: wunderground

Link to DB thread

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-Daytona-Beach-(Ridgwood-Ave-corridor)/page20

Update on Stacy Gage: Apparently the above date is the date she was found. According to TKS episode 4 the video of Stacy at the supermarket on 12-10-07 was shortly before she disappeared so I checked the weather archives for that date............

Mon 12-10-07 Stacy Gage Mostly clear/some clouds...Wind NE gusts to 15 mph....New Moon...dark night.

:bump: Thank you Waltzingmatilda for all your help!

:welcome3:​

I live about 30 mins north of Daytona Beach. I remember these murders clearly. I also work in the Daytona Beach area, and frequently pass all of the areas the victims were found in. I hope something comes of this being put back in the spotlight on the show.

and

I'm new and this is my first post. I'm. It sure if this is where it goes but after watching episodes 3 & 4 tonight, I started really looking at the dr. I thought about the wiki edits in episode 1 and looked at them tonight. There are edits from an IP address numerous times, including tonight, that goes back to ft Meyers Florida. The dr moved to ft Meyers Florida. I think PD really dropped the ball on this guy. I suspect that he had a deep belief that he could medically "cure" these girls of their ways and when he couldn't, he would put them in a "suitable" place to examine his case work.

Nice of you to join Websleuths and share your thoughts on the cases and "The Killing Season" with us. Thank you and I look forward to more of what you think and your reactions. I share your hopes KalamatiKay and find your ideas on the Florida cases very interesting, lookingaroundli, as morbid as it all is to consider. Thank you, too. I hope you both keep participating.

~

‘The Killing Season': Rachel Mills & Joshua Zeman on A&E’s True-Crime Series and Alex Gibney
BY CHRISTINA RADISH, COLLIDER
11/19

A great detailed interview about "The Killing Season" well worth reading.

 

[Docfroid]

I'm new and this is my first post. I'm. It sure if this is where it goes but after watching episodes 3 & 4 tonight, I started really looking at the dr. I thought about the wiki edits in episode 1 and looked at them tonight. There are edits from an IP address numerous times, including tonight, that goes back to ft Meyers Florida. The dr moved to ft Meyers Florida. I think PD really dropped the ball on this guy. I suspect that he had a deep belief that he could medically "cure" these girls of their ways and when he couldn't, he would put them in a "suitable" place to examine his case work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

im new as well and have followed this case since the 10 bodies were discovered years back. To this day I do not know how people just cross off the doctor, Mr Hackett, as being a suspect. Forget about what we think of him when he has been on camera which has led many t say he doesn't fit the profile and let's consider what does fit the profile...and please someone answer the blanks I currently have below:

#1- the night of Shannan Gilbert's death he admittedly medicated Shannan and let her out of his home
- who brought her to his home and what was the timeline of this encounter as it relates to her 911 call?? I heard it was her client that night who brought her to him...

- No matter, but first who hires a prostitute and then when she is acting crazy takes her to a local guy to medicate her. You'd just make her leave. 2nd, what doctor would medicate a woman in his house and let her leave his house.

#2 - Then he somehow got her mom's phone number and decided to call her when Shannan wasn't with him anymore.
- this is the strongest link to LISK considering 2 of the victim's friend or relatives got contacted by LISK after they got abducted. Being compelled to make contact with victim's family is part of his profile.

- how did Hackett get her moms number? Why did he decide to call only after she wasn't with him? When did Hackett call Shannan's mom - was it that evening or days after? Was Hackett's wife with him at the time of this? And what was said on the call is just odd...

- why doesn't Josh or Rachel have the people that heard lisk over the phone listen to Dr Hackett's voice?

My theory, and there are many holes to fill, is Hackett's intention was to drug and kill Shannan. She escaped, and if she ended up getting out of there he was afraid she'd tell someone that she got drugged by Hackett and he was going to kill her. So he proactively called Shannan's mom and provided an alibi. Maybe Shannan did die on her own that night, maybe after his call he actually found her and killed her. Don't think we'll ever know.

Whichever, we can't deny how odd his actions were. Maybe it is all coincidence. But to have all the above happen, and then to find all the other bodies close to that area, it's just too crazy to think that way.

As as a side note I don't think the AC4 have anything to do with GB4. Shoes missing is not part of the GB4 killers MO, from what I understand. All 4 facing east is also not necessarily intentional. If thrown in there the same way, for example holding a person horizontally in your arms with their head hanging over your left arm while walking east, and tossing them in front of you eastward, their head would likely only face one direction due to the force of the throw. East. All this tells us is it was likely the same person who disposed of all 4. Which now begs the question, were all 4 bodies found east of room 101?

 

[Jax49]

I'd like to offer two gut feelings, without any facts to back them up. Just based on following serial killers and the hunt for them since Bundy was active.

Dr. Hackett gives me the willies. Something more than being a strange nut job who likes to insert himself in news stories.

Regarding the Daytona murders, I can't see any connection to LINK. It don't feel like the women match the New York victims.

Moo, moo, and more moo

 

[Really?]

Hackett definitely has the background for this type of crime....

I remember reading about Shannon running off from a John in either the daily news or the post. Can't remember which. Then .......

Some days Iater I read that some dr called the mom and said he " ran a half wayish house....etc etc....blah blah blah.....treated her and is she home ?

Then the bodies started turning up.

One thing I have been curious about and maybe a more knowledgeable person can chime in......

Of all the summer traffic going by the girls placed out off the road. Windows down.........why was there no smell ? Any smell of death ?........even in Hackett's backyard with Shannon decomposing ......no scent of death......buzzards....whiffs. Why?

 

[ChefHazmat]

IMO Dr. Hackett needs to be looked at some more. There seems to be more to him other than him wanting to be in the spotlight. Also like someone else said how did he get the number if Shannon's mom. To me it sounds like he searched her phone and got the number, but as of now that's just speculation.

 

[thefragile7393]

I'm new and this is my first post. I'm. It sure if this is where it goes but after watching episodes 3 & 4 tonight, I started really looking at the dr. I thought about the wiki edits in episode 1 and looked at them tonight. There are edits from an IP address numerous times, including tonight, that goes back to ft Meyers Florida. The dr moved to ft Meyers Florida. I think PD really dropped the ball on this guy. I suspect that he had a deep belief that he could medically "cure" these girls of their ways and when he couldn't, he would put them in a "suitable" place to examine his case work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

"I thought about the wiki edits in episode 1 and looked at them tonight. There are edits from an IP address numerous times, including tonight, that goes back to ft Meyers Florida. The dr moved to ft Meyers Florida. I think PD really dropped the ball on this guy"
Oh. Wow. Just wow

 

[Rngirl5131]

So reference to PH moving to Fort Myers/Sanibel, Florida...I have asked before if anyone thinks that LISK is killing just females. Reason being seven years ago eight male skeletons were found in Lee County Florida. Dated over a period of time. Three have been identified. Drug addicts/drifters. And what a coincidence it's the same County that he moved to. Wonder if he was familiar or visited there in the past?

 

[AC_Lucky1]

I was wondering the same thing? The 8 skeletons were found in Fort Myers

So reference to PH moving to Fort Myers/Sanibel, Florida...I have asked before if anyone thinks that LISK is killing just females. Reason being seven years ago eight male skeletons were found in Lee County Florida. Dated over a period of time. Three have been identified. Drug addicts/drifters. And what a coincidence it's the same County that he moved to. Wonder if he was familiar or visited there in the past?

 

[Rngirl5131]

I was wondering the same thing? The 8 skeletons were found in Fort Myers

There were male, but I'm wondering how long PH has visited/vacationed the Lee County area in the previous years. I used to live around there in the 90's. Where the bodies were found is only about 20 min from the FM/Sanibel area he supposedly moved to. There are not many details released about the crime scene. Chances are slim it's the same person, especially since they are male, but what a coincidence it's the same exact County he moved to. I also saw in another thread where someone took a map of the east coast from AC and drew a line south which goes just north of Lee County. Those bodies were found in north FM, just south of Port Charlotte.

 

[Claudette]

I can see why so many wonder if LISK, Atlantic City and Daytona Beach are related. But the three cases are so different, and Daytona Beach is a particular outlier. Daytona Beach, IMO, is a disorganized lust killer. LISK and Atlantic City are organized. While a SKs MO can absolutely change, I don't think this is an example of that.

I stopped following LISK a little after Shannan was found. It was becoming too much to keep up with, admittedly I am pretty unfamiliar with Atlantic City and this episode was the first time I heard about Daytona Beach. So I have yet to get thole whole picture, so keep that in mind with the following.

IMO LISK is a missionary killer. I believe this because he has taunted family and friends of the victims - he doesn't see them as human, or sees them as a subclass of human that deserves what they got. A missionary SK is one that feels he is doing the world a favor by getting rid of "deplorables". Atlantic City is organized lust, and Daytona Beach is disorganized lust.

These are all very different types, and IMO they are all different perps. Now, how many LISK is comprised of, THAT is the million dollar question. I do think that it is possible that is one SK (with maybe one or two non serial killer murderes on the side - IE the asian male), despite the change in MO. I do think it's possible that he has changed over time as he learned.

 

[forensicsguy76]

IMO LISK is a missionary killer. I believe this because he has taunted family and friends of the victims - he doesn't see them as human, or sees them as a subclass of human that deserves what they got. A missionary SK is one that feels he is doing the world a favor by getting rid of "deplorables". Atlantic City is organized lust, and Daytona Beach is disorganized lust.

I can see the arguement for LISK as a mission killer, but to me the way the bodies are laid out in alignment suggests some feeling of connection to the victims, which would go against him believing they are worthless to him. IMO.

 

[Claudette]

I can see the arguement for LISK as a mission killer, but to me the way the bodies are laid out in alignment suggests some feeling of connection to the victims, which would go against him believing they are worthless to him. IMO.

I think this is more of a sign that he is an organized killer as opposed to an unorganized. IE Bundy vs Dahmer. Smart, sociable and calculated vs less intelligent, a loaner, and disorganized in his planning and placement of victims.

 

[kindacurious]

I know this is way out there but has anybody thought of this serial killer could be a carnival worker? The only reason I bring this up is because carnivals go to Florida for the colder months and in March is when they start their routes ( traveling to different cities and states) Also Carney's tend to move from one show to another. I was a carny at one time many years ago. I was on a lot of different shows. I have meet plenty of sickos while working there. I hope no one thinks I'm crazy for thinking this way and not all carnival workers are bad people or low lives. I guess I'm just trying to think outside the box.

 

[trigger]

Hackett definitely has the background for this type of crime....

I remember reading about Shannon running off from a John in either the daily news or the post. Can't remember which. Then .......

Some days Iater I read that some dr called the mom and said he " ran a half wayish house....etc etc....blah blah blah.....treated her and is she home ?

Then the bodies started turning up.

One thing I have been curious about and maybe a more knowledgeable person can chime in......

Of all the summer traffic going by the girls placed out off the road. Windows down.........why was there no smell ? Any smell of death ?........even in Hackett's backyard with Shannon decomposing ......no scent of death......buzzards....whiffs. Why?

Low tied is very smelly. We would go to the Seaford Shack in Tobay Beach (the restaurant is now called Salsa Shack it just opened this summer) and if it was low tied I would not go. The green flies are there and they bite and the gnats are all ove your foid...Seagulls are everywhere from people fishing.

 

[forensicsguy76]

No doubt he is organized. And you may be right about the mission killer. That would definitely explain him referring to them as *advertiser censored* and degrading them to the one victims sister, but that could also be just another way to elicit fear, giving him more control.

But you could definitely be right. I need to research a little more one here about the case.

 

[FindHG]

I know this is way out there but has anybody thought of this serial killer could be a carnival worker? The only reason I bring this up is because carnivals go to Florida for the colder months and in March is when they start their routes ( traveling to different cities and states) Also Carney's tend to move from one show to another. I was a carny at one time many years ago. I was on a lot of different shows. I have meet plenty of sickos while working there. I hope no one thinks I'm crazy for thinking this way and not all carnival workers are bad people or low lives. I guess I'm just trying to think outside the box.

:welcome:​

Thank you for joining WS, kindacurious. I do believe this may have come up before, IIRC, there may even have been some discussion of more details on what carnival and whom. I don't know enough to help you more than that, but another sleuther may pitch in.

No doubt he is organized. And you may be right about the mission killer. That would definitely explain him referring to them as *advertiser censored* and degrading them to the one victims sister, but that could also be just another way to elicit fear, giving him more control.

But you could definitely be right. I need to research a little more one here about the case.

:welcome6:​

Forensicguy, thank you so much for joining and letting WS benefit from your well thought out ideas on the LISK thread.

im new as well and have followed this case since the 10 bodies were discovered years back. To this day I do not know how people just cross off the doctor, Mr Hackett, as being a suspect. Forget about what we think of him when he has been on camera which has led many t say he doesn't fit the profile and let's consider what does fit the profile...and please someone answer the blanks I currently have below:

#1- the night of Shannan Gilbert's death he admittedly medicated Shannan and let her out of his home
- who brought her to his home and what was the timeline of this encounter as it relates to her 911 call?? I heard it was her client that night who brought her to him...

- No matter, but first who hires a prostitute and then when she is acting crazy takes her to a local guy to medicate her. You'd just make her leave. 2nd, what doctor would medicate a woman in his house and let her leave his house.

#2 - Then he somehow got her mom's phone number and decided to call her when Shannan wasn't with him anymore.
- this is the strongest link to LISK considering 2 of the victim's friend or relatives got contacted by LISK after they got abducted. Being compelled to make contact with victim's family is part of his profile.

- how did Hackett get her moms number? Why did he decide to call only after she wasn't with him? When did Hackett call Shannan's mom - was it that evening or days after? Was Hackett's wife with him at the time of this? And what was said on the call is just odd...

- why doesn't Josh or Rachel have the people that heard lisk over the phone listen to Dr Hackett's voice?

My theory, and there are many holes to fill, is Hackett's intention was to drug and kill Shannan. She escaped, and if she ended up getting out of there he was afraid she'd tell someone that she got drugged by Hackett and he was going to kill her. So he proactively called Shannan's mom and provided an alibi. Maybe Shannan did die on her own that night, maybe after his call he actually found her and killed her. Don't think we'll ever know.

Whichever, we can't deny how odd his actions were. Maybe it is all coincidence. But to have all the above happen, and then to find all the other bodies close to that area, it's just too crazy to think that way.

As as a side note I don't think the AC4 have anything to do with GB4. Shoes missing is not part of the GB4 killers MO, from what I understand. All 4 facing east is also not necessarily intentional. If thrown in there the same way, for example holding a person horizontally in your arms with their head hanging over your left arm while walking east, and tossing them in front of you eastward, their head would likely only face one direction due to the force of the throw. East. All this tells us is it was likely the same person who disposed of all 4. Which now begs the question, were all 4 bodies found east of room 101?

:welcome:​

Thank you for joining Websleuths. Wonderful how familiar you are with the information. I hope you had a chance the hear Websleuths Radio's panel tonight, as there was much discussion of many of points you bring up. I hope you continue to participate.

 

[forensicsguy76]

I missed the radio show. Is it posted somewhere?