TX TX - Amber Hagerman, 9, Arlington, 17 Jan 1996

Discussion in 'Cold Cases' started by TCMom, Jul 19, 2007.

  1. FusilliJerry

    FusilliJerry New Member

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    This may be a dead end, but has anyone ever looked into Willie Randolph? He was 19 at the time and apparently went to the same technical school as Donna. He was also present at the wake for Amber. The AP quoted him saying "I just wanted to see her and feel the grief that her family is feeling". It struck me as an odd thing to say..
     


  2. FusilliJerry

    FusilliJerry New Member

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    This may be a dead end, but has anyone ever looked into Willie Randolph? He was 19 at the time and apparently went to the same technical school as Donna. He was also present at the wake for Amber. The AP quoted him saying "I just wanted to see her and feel the grief that her family is feeling". It struck me as an odd thing to say..
     
  3. Ozoner

    Ozoner On Time Out

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    It might be odd, but being odd doesn't make someone a child killer.
     
  4. FusilliJerry

    FusilliJerry New Member

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    Totally fair point! But in a case like this with little to work with by those of us here, why not just look into everything we do know? I’ve seen quite a lot of speculation with ambers case, and many others like it. If I’m looking at the profile of the killer provided by authorities, then this would be someone fairly younger and quite new to murder. I’m not saying Willie should be doxed or harassed, just wanted to know if his name had been brought up before as a person of interest. Hope that helps to clarify! :)
     
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  5. swedeheart

    swedeheart Well-Known Member

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    starts at about 48:00:

     
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  6. SmallDetail

    SmallDetail New Member

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    Someone would of had to have known her or been watching her. To do that in broad daylight and given where it took place, for all they knew, her parents were nearby or her house was across the way where she could have been seen (ex how the witness had been watching her) awfully risky. He would of needed a place nearby to take her So as to not be on the road long and where he could keep her. She was a screamer/fighter...how did he keep her quiet and contained inside the vehicle just himself and keep her from messing with the locks if he went far? Chloroform? More likely a second person inside the vehicle or a weapon, if a knife and not a gun, given the ease of access to them...perhaps they had a record? Someone who has done this before? Someone who knows guns leave more forensic evidence? There’s a number of creek beds and lakes even in the area where the body would be less likely to be found, but he chose an area near an apartment, not far from busy streets where people would of been stoping or at least looking for a vehicle that matched the description... also high risk unless you’re familiar with the area. I think for them to get close enough to her to grab her if they were solo he would of had to have spoken English fluently, I don’t think it was tied to any undocumented individuals, and I believe they tried to coax her at first, maybe he asked if she had any girls scout cookies? Something someone who sort of knew her would have said...did any of the women in her GS troupe have a bf or husband with a record or who drove a vehicle matching that description? Or perhaps the grandparents had a handyman over recently? Did anyone check to see if the laundry mat had anyone drop off a girl scout uniform or sash earlier that day? Again, it would tie in with someone perhaps with a daughter or step child in her troupe being a POI. The apartments over that way are super thin wall wise, no way she was kept there, it would of had to have been either a home nearby or a motel maybe but I’d look for any that had complaints of noise or TV being up loud or individuals who could have known her whose spouses or gf were out of town at the time or who lived alone. Wouldn’t be surprised if the possible perp could even see the crime scene from their home or injected themselves into the investigation somehow. I do find it odd that some 70 something year old man is just standing outside in his backyard watching her...why not yell out to the guy when she screams? And why did this guy not look to see if she was being watched and notice the old guy staring? That parts a little hinky imo and if his eyes aren’t that great it’s possible the vehicle could have been dark grey, brown or green...

    I just know I wish they’d find her Killer, I grew up in Arlington and was very young at the time but a brownie scout myself and my mom was haunted by this case, she really kept a tight reign on us girls after the word got out that she was killed and assaulted. I still think broad daylight, a girl struggling, and a single cab short bed...had to be auto locks and either dark or mirrored tint or someone else was in there otherwise how did they keep her from getting out or flagging down other cars or struggling where everyone could see while they just drove off? Unless they were parked there for a while tying her up and in that case, why didn’t the old man rush over or yell if they didn’t just speed off? Again, really odd and it doesn’t feel right, especially since the bike was left and not thrown into the bed of the truck.
     
  7. SAMS

    SAMS TC Writer

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    @SmallDetail I believe the perp used either chloroform or knocked her unconscious right away. She managed to get a scream out and the neighbor overheard. His home was behind the Winn Dixie, but not directly behind so his view wasn’t clear enough, and his age would’ve factored in as to what he was witnessing as well. There was a bit of distance and I believe a fence separating the yards, so I don’t see him running to help her. LE has stated they believe her body was dumped along the creek and floated down with the torrential rain the area saw over those few days, ending up behind the apts. You’ve made some great points. IMO this was an opportunistic abduction/murder and he was on the hunt for a child. I don’t believe he was watching her or knew her at all. MOO
     
  8. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    Not so much on the hunt as the opportunity presented itself and he acted i dont beleive this individual was out looking for a victim , as they usually arent its usually wrong place wrong time for the victim

    The only triggering factor for these types is almost always the victim being alone

    if you were to ask them why they did it you usually get 1 of 3 things

    1) Silence or protest

    2) They dont know why but theyll usually say they didnt intent to kill the victim just wanted them for sexual purposes
    Or
    3) The sociopathic types will say “why not”
     
  9. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    Also one thing to note as im reading replies here regarding Laura Smither and Amber Hagerman and a possible resemblance

    its exceedingly rare (almost non existent) that a victim is selected based on physical characteristics or appearance

    They are usually targeted because they are away from any adults

    Even in cases where there are groups of children together (Jacob Wetterling for ex) sometimes wont thwart an abduction attempt if the individual has committed to the action
     
  10. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    Also given that this was most likely an opportunity grab, I doubt anything such as chloroform was used to subdue a small 9 yo, many kids have been abducted by force the sheer gravity of what's happening, fear, shock and the uncertainty surrounding what is actually happening is often enough

    Offenders will often lie to the victim, telling them that if they're quiet and do what they tell the victim they'll be fine .

    ESPECIALLY, and I cant stress this ENOUGH, if the child has not been taught how to react to someone trying to take them. TEACH YOUR KIDS HOW TO REACT !!!!!!!!

    Even though in Ambers case, she was simply overpowered , there are things you can teach your kids to help them escape or prevent them from being removed

    If I could impart one single piece of advice here, from one parent to others...98% of all abduction cases, involved the use of a vehicle , teach your kids to NEVER approach a vehicle , and to try to get out of them at all costs and to never stop trying to escape it if put into one !
     
  11. SAMS

    SAMS TC Writer

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    Ty for sharing your insight/expertise here.
     
  12. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    Very welcome feel free to ask questions if you like
     
  13. sds71

    sds71 Well-Known Member

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    Jan. 13 marks 25 years since 9-year-old Amber Hagerman was kidnapped and killed in Arlington, inspiring the nationwide AMBER Alert system for missing and endangered children, but no one has ever been arrested.

    Police still working the case decades later announced plans Wednesday to submit items of evidence originally obtained in the investigation to new forensic testing that may yield a more complete DNA profile of the killer.

    "Because the technology is new and it's advanced we are excited that this year, hopefully by February, we will submit this new evidence to see if we can get an enhanced DNA profile," said Arlington Assistant Police Chief Kevin Kolbye.

    Officials did not reveal what the evidence was or how long it will take for the evidence to be tested.
    Detectives Hope New DNA Technology Can Break Cold Case That Inspired ‘Amber Alerts’ – NBC Connecticut
     
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  14. imstilla.grandma

    imstilla.grandma Well-Known Member

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  15. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    I second this , advances in DNA analysis have closed many cases, sooner or later theyll get a hit, and this son of a b!tch will face the state of Texas.........and I cant think of a WORSE place to commit a horrific crime because that state does not PLAY when it comes to capital punishment

    I may fly to Texas once this offender is brought in just to see his face, because in 96 THIS was the case, that began my studies into crimes against children

    Its also possible this DNA may link other cases,

    Sorry for the rant
     
  16. SAMS

    SAMS TC Writer

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    24 years ago, today, little Amber was riding her bicycle with her little brother, Ricky. She was smiling and happy on that Saturday afternoon, riding behind the abandoned grocery store. It would be her last ride. Her last smile. Her last happiness on this earth. A monster took her away from her family, her mom, her BF Ricky. Amber deserved a full life. Let’s at least bring her justice-Rest In Power, Amber. Because of you, so many little ones have been able to grow old and smile again. MOO
     
  17. SAMS

    SAMS TC Writer

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    Just saw the news!!! Omg yess!! Praying for justice! MOO
     
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  18. SAMS

    SAMS TC Writer

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    [QUOTE="Kell1, post: 16563515, member: 99212" this son of a b!tch will face the state of Texas.........and I cant think of a WORSE place to commit a horrific crime because that state does not PLAY when it comes to capital punishment

    I may fly to Texas once this offender is brought in just to see his face, because in 96 THIS was the case, that began my studies into crimes against children

    [/QUOTE]
    !!!!!!!!!! & Can’t wait. Rooting for APD!
     
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  19. imstilla.grandma

    imstilla.grandma Well-Known Member

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  20. imstilla.grandma

    imstilla.grandma Well-Known Member

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    !!!!!!!!!! & Can’t wait. Rooting for APD![/QUOTE]
    @Kell1 Your post gives me new life. Your spirit jumps off the page. The Detective’s words and emotions also are doing this for me. I can almost hear his heart trembling as he speaks. Wow, I’m getting emotional. Oh, I’m trying to hold the tears in. I can’t.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2021
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