TX TX - Huntsville, 'Walker County Jane Doe', WhtFem 14-16, 91UFTX, Nov'80 #2 *NAME NOT RELEASED*

[MadMcGoo]

I know this sounds way off, but what if she was with a relative (similar to the Anjelica Castillo case)? If it wasn’t the first kill, maybe he killed his family.

I don’t think any ideas are way off! Weirder things happen everyday, so there isn’t much I rule out unless it CAN be ruled out!

I actually ran this story by my mom today, and ironically, she ran away when she was 15...in 1980! (I’ll never tell her age though! ) So she was trying to help me understand a little bit about how things were back then and what a girl her age may have been thinking. Her first question “was she a prostitute?”. No, it’s not likely, so she said that it could have been a similar situation to hers. My mom lived a very sheltered life in a small town, grew up in a devout Christian family, and at the time had begun going to church study groups at different family’s houses and realized she was “missing out” on normal teenage activities. So, she left home. She said at the time, she probably would have responded the same way as WCJD when asked about her parents, “who cares?”. And my mother maintained a good relationship with her parents, so. She said she thought that she had to have somehow met someone in prison and tried to make her way to where she thought he was, and ran into trouble. She was very interested in the shoes that were found (and had a long story about how if you did NOT have these back then, you weren’t ‘cool’) but she called them “YoYos”...and then I remembered working at a costume shop and one of our most rented costume was Sandy’s leather pant outfit from Grease. And we had a pair of vintage leather sandals, made by Candies...which my mother agreed was a popular brand also. She was confused about the inverted nipple detail, and quite disturbed at the details of her death, but that was the best opinion she had. Also, that she was very young, 14-16 was actually what she guessed. We both agreed that something may have happened to her family and she had become a ward of the state or placed in another home and she may have wanted to address the person responsible...which I know had been mentioned before, but we know a 14 year old who was adopted after a horrific crime involving his family and we could absolutely imagine him wanting to ask questions (unfortunately it was a parent who committed the crime).

I also remembered something when it was suggested that WCJD and OS May have been killed by a woman...I went back and read about RBR’s arrest, and wondered if maybe he DID have a female accomplice. Just the circumstances of how he was caught seemed a little brazzen even for an overly confident killer who had gone 15 years without being caught. Just some more food for thought. FWIW

I will have to look into the Castillo, McGuff and Green names that were mentioned...I don’t believe I’m familiar with those.

•MMcG•

 

[MadMcGoo]

Hey there! I’m doing well! Hope you had a good holiday! I spend at least a couple of days browsing through missing sites and even newspaper articles from the area, I’ve come up with quite a list of girls that are not on the ruleout list, but I’m slowly going back and dwindling that list down. But I agree with you, this may be one to be solved with science! My second hope was that IF a suspect in another similar case were caught, they’d do what some of the others do and admit to committing this murder. I honestly feel those are the two most likely scenarios! But I have seen many great things happen in the cold case department lately that NOTHING would surprise me!!!

I just recently read about an agency who had exhumed a body three times, I can’t remember if it was a Doe or if there was a question as to the manner of death, but I do remember them saying it was brutal for all involved. I’m sure it is a possibility just not one that most want to entertain. I wonder what ever became of the testing they did on her shoes? I’ve not heard anything about that.

I’ve often thought about helping fund extensive DNA testing, if it’s a possibility, so I would definitely assist in contributing and know a few who others who would probably help as well!

•MMcG•

ETA: Texas Panhandle, here!

E(again)TA: the victim/woman with RBR’s when he was arrested had bitten him on his should!

 

[Mockturtle22]

Here is her full story (also in detail what happened to her, so be warned) and rule outs (I'm not sure if all the ruleouts are on that list)

http://www.theinfolist.com/php/SummaryGet.php?FindGo=Walker_County_Jane_Doe

Great link! Thanks!

Eventually, I may cover her on my podcast. I recently lost my co-host and am starting over. The good thing about that is that I don't have to consult with anyone really about what I want to do or the style of show I feel up to producing.

For anyone afraid to click, there are no Post mortems.

I've seen the PM's for this Doe... and I think that in some ways, Carl K did a beautiful job with the recreations. The most recent one in particular but I still feel like some times it's better to look at the PM photos when comparing against missing people, vs the composites.


I really want this girl to be identified.... Seems as though no one cared about her enough to even report her though, so far. Which means we may never know... unless somehow they can match up genealogy

 

[TmmEye]

I don’t think any ideas are way off! Weirder things happen everyday, so there isn’t much I rule out unless it CAN be ruled out!

I actually ran this story by my mom today, and ironically, she ran away when she was 15...in 1980! (I’ll never tell her age though! ) So she was trying to help me understand a little bit about how things were back then and what a girl her age may have been thinking. Her first question “was she a prostitute?”. No, it’s not likely, so she said that it could have been a similar situation to hers. My mom lived a very sheltered life in a small town, grew up in a devout Christian family, and at the time had begun going to church study groups at different family’s houses and realized she was “missing out” on normal teenage activities. So, she left home. She said at the time, she probably would have responded the same way as WCJD when asked about her parents, “who cares?”. And my mother maintained a good relationship with her parents, so. She said she thought that she had to have somehow met someone in prison and tried to make her way to where she thought he was, and ran into trouble. She was very interested in the shoes that were found (and had a long story about how if you did NOT have these back then, you weren’t ‘cool’) but she called them “YoYos”...and then I remembered working at a costume shop and one of our most rented costume was Sandy’s leather pant outfit from Grease. And we had a pair of vintage leather sandals, made by Candies...which my mother agreed was a popular brand also. She was confused about the inverted nipple detail, and quite disturbed at the details of her death, but that was the best opinion she had. Also, that she was very young, 14-16 was actually what she guessed. We both agreed that something may have happened to her family and she had become a ward of the state or placed in another home and she may have wanted to address the person responsible...which I know had been mentioned before, but we know a 14 year old who was adopted after a horrific crime involving his family and we could absolutely imagine him wanting to ask questions (unfortunately it was a parent who committed the crime).

I also remembered something when it was suggested that WCJD and OS May have been killed by a woman...I went back and read about RBR’s arrest, and wondered if maybe he DID have a female accomplice. Just the circumstances of how he was caught seemed a little brazzen even for an overly confident killer who had gone 15 years without being caught. Just some more food for thought. FWIW

I will have to look into the Castillo, McGuff and Green names that were mentioned...I don’t believe I’m familiar with those.

•MMcG•

Thanks for the information! I think this might suggest a “school” type - one in the crowd of fame.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Could it be that at the time of the murder, the decedent was so unrecognizable due to the beating and post mortem effects that This significantly effected ability to identify her?

Hers is one of the saddest post mortems (along with Buckskin girl), that I have ever seen. The suffering and pain all over her face; such a young child.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Adrian_Almost_Sleuth]

Is there a reason why The DNA Doe Project hasn't taken her case on? For just a high profile case in the pantheon of unidentified persons you'd think she's be on the top of the list.

 

[Suglo]

Is there a reason why The DNA Doe Project hasn't taken her case on? For just a high profile case in the pantheon of unidentified persons you'd think she's be on the top of the list.

The local LE agency has to formally request that DDP take on the project. DDP knows about it but their hands are tied until contacted.

 

[Mockturtle22]

Could it be that at the time of the murder, the decedent was so unrecognizable due to the beating and post mortem effects that This significantly effected ability to identify her?

Hers is one of the saddest post mortems (along with Buckskin girl), that I have ever seen. The suffering and pain all over her face; such a young child.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I've viewed photos of Walker JD's PM. It's always hard to look at those, but I don't think that she was beaten so bad she would be recognizable. She looked like she was a very pretty young girl too..

 

[rosesfromangels]

I've viewed photos of Walker JD's PM. It's always hard to look at those, but I don't think that she was beaten so bad she would be recognizable. She looked like she was a very pretty young girl too..

And that is what is baffling. Pretty young girls are accounted for, sought. How is it that no one was looking for her? Or is this simply bad communication between LE departments given the year and manual processes?

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[CarlK90245]

Is there a reason why The DNA Doe Project hasn't taken her case on? For just a high profile case in the pantheon of unidentified persons you'd think she's be on the top of the list.

The WCSO sent her mandible to DNA Solutions in Oklahoma. They said they were unable to get enough DNA from it for a genetic profile. There are other labs that specialize in difficult extractions, but it remains to be seen whether they are willing to go that route.

DDP would love to take this case. They were able to solve the Annie Doe case with a very degraded DNA profile to work with. And they are working on several other similarly challenging cases - Orange Socks being one of them.

 

[detective24-7]

I’ve often thought about helping fund extensive DNA testing, if it’s a possibility, so I would definitely assist in contributing and know a few who others who would probably help as well!

I would definitely donate and contribute money to put towards extensive DNA testing or anything with this case.

 

[Jdart14]

Is there a reason why The DNA Doe Project hasn't taken her case on? For just a high profile case in the pantheon of unidentified persons you'd think she's be on the top of the list.

It is my understanding that LE no longer has sufficient DNA to advance research.

 

[carbuff]

It is my understanding that LE no longer has sufficient DNA to advance research.

Sometimes that happens...

 

[Craelius]

Hello everyone, this is my first post. I've been rather obsessed with this case for the last couple of weeks, which is a very small amount of time compared to the years some of you have spent on it. I applaud all of your efforts and look forward to the day this girl is identified.

Not long ago someone noticed a girl in a video singing in a choir, some thought she looked a lot like WCJD, and some of the circumstances seemed to be in line with what we know. Has there been any follow-up on this, has the choir girl been identified?

 

[Jdart14]

Welcome Craelius. There has been follow up on the girl in the video here and there over time. I have always felt like that was one of the more credible leads, so many details behind the story line up. Almost too many to just be a coincidence. A possible name for the girl in question was brought forward by others who had attended the school at the time. That name was Angie Roca. I very much put that out there with an emphasis on "Possible" because no further information has been given or discovered in research on the name.

Where are you from and how did you stumble upon the WCJD story?? There have been several new posters here recently and I always think its great and interesting to see how people are hearing more about her. That means the word is getting out!!

 

[Jdart14]

I would definitely donate and contribute money to put towards extensive DNA testing or anything with this case.

Me too!!!

 

[GJKJR]

Regarding the "Angie Roca" lead:

Using Ancestry, I found an Angela L Roca who was born in 1965 in Bexar County and got married in 1994. Could this be the "Angie Roca" in the pictures from Rebekah Christian School? (Attached is a photo of the records from Ancestry).

There seems to be only results from outside the U.S. when I search Angie Roca.

 

[Bit of hope]

Regarding the "Angie Roca" lead:

Using Ancestry, I found an Angela L Roca who was born in 1965 in Bexar County and got married in 1994. Could this be the "Angie Roca" in the pictures from Rebekah Christian School? (Attached is a photo of the records from Ancestry).

There seems to be only results from outside the U.S. when I search Angie Roca.

If she got married in 1994 this would be impossible.....but some other files might be interesting.

 

[TmmEye]

I think Angie’s alive if it is her.

 

[Craelius]

I found out about this case while reading about unresolved mysteries on reddit. I am not from Texas, I grew up in Phoenix. Not sure why this one really caught my attention, other than Walker County Jane Doe would be about the same age as me, and her pictures remind me of a friend in high school (who is still alive). There are a lot of details from that time period that someone from a different generation might not "get" but they resound with me. We each see the world from different perspectives, and maybe that is one of the great things about being here: all the different eyes looking at the same case.

Of all the faces I've looked at, the Girl in the Choir is the only one that really looks like the victim to me. I found the video online and stepped through it and took screenshots at different intervals. As she is reciting the Psalm, she blinks for a moment, and comparing that picture to the postmortem photo (the one that is almost completely from the front view) the resemblance is striking. It appears the girl in the choir has eyebrows that are not symmetrical, the right one being considerably narrower than the left, pretty much exactly like those of WCJD. All of their facial features are extremely similar: hairline, distance between eyebrows, nose, full lips, and philtrum, which is the indentation above the top lip. (Okay so I had to look that word up.) I cropped the PM photo so that her jaw does not show, as I can't bear to look at it. But we all know what she looks like and her lips are very similar to the Girl in the Choir.