Found Deceased TX - PFC Vanessa Guillen, 20, Fort Hood military base, items left behind, 22 Apr 2020 *arrests* #3

[GuyfromCanada]

An “extensive search” is underway for a 20-year-old soldier, who went missing earlier this week while stationed in Texas.

Private First Class Vanessa Guillen was last seen on Wednesday, April 22, at 1:00 p.m. local time in a parking lot at squadron headquarters in Fort Hood, army officials said in a press release, as they asked members of the public for help finding the missing soldier.

Afterward, several items belonging to Guillen were “found in the armory room,” where she had been working before her disappearance. The items included her car keys, ID and wallet.

More at Search Underway in Texas for Missing 20-Year-Old Soldier: 'Something Is Not Right,' Says Sister

Fort Hood soldier disappears; keys, ID card, wallet later found


TX - PFC Vanessa Guillen, 20, 22 Apr 2020 *MEDIA,MAPS,TIMELINE ONLY NO DISCUSSION

Vanessa Guillen -TX- by amanda reckonwith

Thread #1
Thread #2

 

[kaen]

I worry that the family of Ms. Guillen will never really get the justice they deserve. Her killer (most likely, the only person who killed her) is dead. His accomplice appears to be talking and will most likely get some sort of deal despite the heinous acts she committed, the lies she told and repeated acts to hide their actions. It appears that the issues present at Fort Hood will remain because even though there is talk of transparency little seems to have changed. The recent finding of Mr. Wedel-Morales in a shallow grave but the army refusing to change is classification from AWOL without proof of death 10 months ago and causing the grieving family to pay for his funeral until all of their conditions proven indicates that the Guillen family and others are treated with disrespect consistently. Too many soldiers are harmed at this base. It is almost laughable that the 2 star even expects that people will come forward. You can have policies and procedures but if you cultivate a fear that reporting will lead to retaliation people will not make complaints. The most poignant thing I have read is that Ms. Guillen's mother was willing to call and report the actions of those who were harassing her daughter. She wanted to protect her daughter. I know the Army would never have listened to her but it is clear she trusted her daughter's words and wanted to keep her safe.

I have such sadness for the Guillen family. I also have sadness that the soldiers who are willing to fight and die for this country have to keep quiet and/or live in fear from their own. There are numerous lists of many soldiers who have died at or near this base, with a fair amount listed as COD unknown to the compilers but a number of homicides. How hard can this be to fix?

 

[MichelleBlue]

I'm still trying to understand TM's comments on the NG show. He is criticizing Army CID, correct? But, since the remains & earlier evidence was located off base wouldn't local LE (& according to them FBI was involved from the beginning) be the ones collecting evidence? I'm confused about the jurisdiction. IMO

Anyway, although I hear & respect TM's frustration, I do wish he would've waited to speak out to the media until after the suspects were in custody. His comments that the remains were VG's and some description of the crime scene could have ultimately compromised the investigation resulting in AR realizing he was closed in & therefore fleeing & taking his own life. This is only my opinion & I know it will be an unpopular one, but if you look at the timeline of the discovery of the remains, TM spoke out that day saying it was VG, & gave some details about the scene. IMO

 

[MichelleBlue]

This article from June 30th at 5:06 pm, Army CID announced unidentified remains were located.

"The Army CID issued the following statement:
Due to extensive investigative work conducted by Special Agents from the U.S. Army Criminal Investigation Command, agents have returned to an area of interest close to the Leon River, Bell County, Texas for more investigative work in the search for PFC Vanessa Guillen. After receiving additional information, agents have discovered what has been described as partial human remains after analysis from a forensic anthropologist. Army CID agents are currently on scene with the Texas Rangers, the FBI and Bell County Sheriff's Department. No confirmation as to the identity of the remains has been made at this point and we ask for the media and public's understanding that the identification process can take time. Due to the ongoing criminal investigation, no further information will be released at this time."

So, who is TM referring to when he says "they" botched the investigation & didn't want to collect evidence? Army CID agents, Texas Rangers, the FBI and Bell County Sheriff's Department?



Human remains found during search for missing Fort Hood soldier Vanessa Guillen

 

[MsBetsy]

This article from June 30th at 5:06 pm, Army CID announced unidentified remains were located.

"The Army CID issued the following statement:
Due to extensive investigative work conducted by Special Agents from the U.S. Army Criminal Investigation Command, agents have returned to an area of interest close to the Leon River, Bell County, Texas for more investigative work in the search for PFC Vanessa Guillen. After receiving additional information, agents have discovered what has been described as partial human remains after analysis from a forensic anthropologist. Army CID agents are currently on scene with the Texas Rangers, the FBI and Bell County Sheriff's Department. No confirmation as to the identity of the remains has been made at this point and we ask for the media and public's understanding that the identification process can take time. Due to the ongoing criminal investigation, no further information will be released at this time."

So, who is TM referring to when he says "they" botched the investigation & didn't want to collect evidence? Army CID agents, Texas Rangers, the FBI and Bell County Sheriff's Department?



Human remains found during search for missing Fort Hood soldier Vanessa Guillen

He was apparently referring to army CID investigators. He said when he showed them the melted pelican lid they said they didn't think it was related, even though Robinson was seen carrying one and lifting it into a vehicle on the day Vanessa went missing.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

A knowledgeable member with military experience related that supply is an exception to any usual duty formats.

Ranking soldiers in supply, even if of low rank, can summon anybody in the unit at any time to account for a sensitive piece of equipment that they have been issued. That summons carries the same weight as if it were issued the unit commander.

The knowledgeable member also related that supply personnel have this authority because the commander has ultimately signed for every piece of sensitive equipment in the unit.

I suspect that an armorer can also be summoned by a more senior armorer at any time to assist in locating sensitive equipment, say a weapon. This yields a strong possibility that Robinson contacted VG and related that a weapon was unaccounted for.

He then summoned her to help in tracking it down. Or, related that Sgt. "S" had ordered her to be summoned etc. In either case, the victim responds as she is familiar with the summoning ability and knows that weapons are especially sensitive and must be accounted for immediately.

MOO the weapons summons was a ruse to get her in a vulnerable position.

And so strange that the first request back and forth was through phone text (where is link for that by the way as I've not seen, TIA)... and not military software????

 

[Noharg]

And so strange that the first request back and forth was through phone text (where is link for that by the way as I've not seen, TIA)... and not military software????

JMO, but I think it’s not uncommon for soldiers to use their personal phones to communicate about work related matters.

 

[Beltonian]

Mu husband who was NCO in the military for over 20 years and heard a lot about this case from me wanted to add this.

Everyone wants to blame Fort Hood and the command, but there are things you have to understand. The military is a combat force, they are not a law enforcement or an investigative entity. Even the military police are not crime investigators. Civilian law enforcement agencies investigate even on military bases. I served on a command team at Fort Hood when we had a soldiers who had committed felonies. We knew we had a criminals in the unit, but could not let those persons know we knew anything. We had to take one soldier to combat with his weapon while knowing what he was being investigated for. Only months later were we permitted to remove his weapon and turn him over once the agencies involved had gathered sufficient evidence to make a conviction.

This case is no different. The military cannot take action against someone that would ruin a criminal investigation. Nor can they comment on any knowledge about a crime unless the civilian agencies investigating permit the release of information. Often the information being released is tailored to assist the investigation and prevent the guilty parties from knowing they are suspects.

Everyone want to think Fort Hood or the unit are somehow complicit and must have known something sooner. Even if they had, the crime had already happened and all they could do is act in such a way to best assist the investigation, even if they caused stress to the family. Their responsibility was to assist in seeing that justice was served, not answering to the public's and families demands for action or information that would have jeopardized finding her body and apprehending the responsible parties.

Sexual harassment is a serious matter, I would say it is dealt with far more seriously within the military than in the civilian workforce. I have seen many soldiers careers ruined due to claims of sexual harassment even when the claims turned out to be false and malicious. What happened to this Vanessa is tragic. What is also tragic is that other soldiers that had nothing to do with this crime may have had their careers permanently damaged because people not involved with the investigation chose to name them by name when promoting unsupported theories of what might have happened.

The container used to move her body is a common item in the military and we use them to store our equipment or to pack for deployment. Armories often use them to store magazines, scopes, bayonets etc. Filled, these boxes often weigh easily over 100lbs so seeing someone moving a heavy tough box and putting it into a car is nothing unusual.

Had the leaders of Fort Hood handled this case in a fashion more palatable to the family or the public, Vanessa's body may never have been found and the person who killed her would not have been held accountable.

 

[irridescentmoon]

He could be the other suspect who was said to be in custody.

That’s what I thought. The one the Lawyer said in the PC. It seems all of what the lawyer and family have said, has been correct. If this TC is confirmed, those pics continue TC with a White suv. Jmo

 

[kay74]

I saw an interview with her sister and she said Vanessa reported the harassment to her mother and a friend. Did she not report this to an officer there???? If not, why?

 

[irridescentmoon]

Mu husband who was NCO in the military for over 20 years and heard a lot about this case from me wanted to add this.

Everyone wants to blame Fort Hood and the command, but there are things you have to understand. The military is a combat force, they are not a law enforcement or an investigative entity. Even the military police are not crime investigators. Civilian law enforcement agencies investigate even on military bases. I served on a command team at Fort Hood when we had a soldiers who had committed felonies. We knew we had a criminals in the unit, but could not let those persons know we knew anything. We had to take one soldier to combat with his weapon while knowing what he was being investigated for. Only months later were we permitted to remove his weapon and turn him over once the agencies involved had gathered sufficient evidence to make a conviction.

This case is no different. The military cannot take action against someone that would ruin a criminal investigation. Nor can they comment on any knowledge about a crime unless the civilian agencies investigating permit the release of information. Often the information being released is tailored to assist the investigation and prevent the guilty parties from knowing they are suspects.

Everyone want to think Fort Hood or the unit are somehow complicit and must have known something sooner. Even if they had, the crime had already happened and all they could do is act in such a way to best assist the investigation, even if they caused stress to the family. Their responsibility was to assist in seeing that justice was served, not answering to the public's and families demands for action or information that would have jeopardized finding her body and apprehending the responsible parties.

Sexual harassment is a serious matter, I would say it is dealt with far more seriously within the military than in the civilian workforce. I have seen many soldiers careers ruined due to claims of sexual harassment even when the claims turned out to be false and malicious. What happened to this Vanessa is tragic. What is also tragic is that other soldiers that had nothing to do with this crime may have had their careers permanently damaged because people not involved with the investigation chose to name them by name when promoting unsupported theories of what might have happened.

The container used to move her body is a common item in the military and we use them to store our equipment or to pack for deployment. Armories often use them to store magazines, scopes, bayonets etc. Filled, these boxes often weigh easily over 100lbs so seeing someone moving a heavy tough box and putting it into a car is nothing unusual.

Had the leaders of Fort Hood handled this case in a fashion more palatable to the family or the public, Vanessa's body may never have been found and the person who killed her would not have been held accountable.

Thank your husband for his service. This was well said. I know emotions run high during times like these. Please know that when I say “fort hood”, I don’t mean to say ALL of it. Of course it’s not. But it’s obvious to anyone with two eyes that Fort Hood has some major criminal activity. That comes with higher # of population. Yes. But this much? Prostitution rings? Burning vehicles? Bodies found? I completely understand that crime is higher than we think. I’ve seen it with my own eyes on base. I remember being so in shock of how much crime happens on base. I have a family member that was OSI for the AF. He told me we will never hear of the real crime that happens in military installations. That’s so scary!
I had to think, if we know about this, what do we not know about? Not that I have a right to know. I just think of my daughter, sisters, etc. I respect both sides. I sympathize with mom more Of course. If this were my daughter, I’d probably be in jail because I wouldn’t leave that parking lot until I received answers. In the end, it’s about finding answers so that VG can receive justice. All my respect! I think we all work together better with our different opinions, thoughts, feelings, etc. May VG rip. We need to nail these horrible human beings. JMO

 

[MsBetsy]

And so strange that the first request back and forth was through phone text (where is link for that by the way as I've not seen, TIA)... and not military software????

I asked earlier if it was normal to use personal cellphones to communicate that kind of information but I don't know if anyone with knowledge or experience had any opinions about that.

The affidavit is posted a few pages back or maybe in the last thread at this point.

 

[MsBetsy]

I saw an interview with her sister and she said Vanessa reported the harassment to her mother and a friend. Did she not report this to an officer there???? If not, why?

She said she was afraid to report him because he was her superior. Apparently other women had also been afraid to report such instances for fear of retaliation.

 

[Ajs1004]

I saw an interview with her sister and she said Vanessa reported the harassment to her mother and a friend. Did she not report this to an officer there???? If not, why?

Because unfortunately sometimes women aren’t taken seriously when they try to report sexual harassment.

 

[Falling Down]

She said she was afraid to report him because he was her superior. Apparently other women had also been afraid to report such instances for fear of retaliation.

I haven't see any confirmation she served under him.

Wouldn't surprise me he harassed other women, obviously this guy had psychological issues.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I'm still trying to understand TM's comments on the NG show. He is criticizing Army CID, correct? But, since the remains & earlier evidence was located off base wouldn't local LE (& according to them FBI was involved from the beginning) be the ones collecting evidence? I'm confused about the jurisdiction. IMO

Anyway, although I hear & respect TM's frustration, I do wish he would've waited to speak out to the media until after the suspects were in custody. His comments that the remains were VG's and some description of the crime scene could have ultimately compromised the investigation resulting in AR realizing he was closed in & therefore fleeing & taking his own life. This is only my opinion & I know it will be an unpopular one, but if you look at the timeline of the discovery of the remains, TM spoke out that day saying it was VG, & gave some details about the scene. IMO

In a way, I think long term may be a good thing? Think of it this was as a possibility for the positive? That if they took ALL the evidence, the Fort Hood folks would bury any and all investigation process. But if they left some... the "outside of Fort Hood" LE and FBI now have some evidence for their investigation which the military would have never ever shared?

Just looking for a silver lining on such a .....

 

[MichelleBlue]

While I'm sharing unpopular opinions, I just want to say that I'm not a fan of the family lawyer. IMO only. Its a sad case to reconcile because the family gets no justice in a sense, with the murderer taking the coward's way out.

 

[Texas68W]

True...that’s why I said it with sarcasm and that this case has stunk from the beginning. There was, MOO, a huge cover up going on from the very beginning. I, like many others on here, find it hard to believe that a military base in post 911 times doesn’t have cameras on every inch of space in that base...especially the armory. Were the cameras or the film tampered with? Who knows? If they were then it definitely goes beyond this guy. He probably would not have had access to security tapes. I have a sick feeling we’re going to be hearing from the military, after their ‘investigation’ is over, that the video from that day got mysteriously deleted or some such thing. I anxiously await the military’s investigation report. This is all my opinion only and speculation of course.

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but this just isn't the case; the buildings that 3CR occupies are old, to the tune of 30 years or so. There are no cameras in common areas, let alone the basement and arms rooms.

Where the Army does have cameras is in buildings that are currently being built; I know the new barracks for medics have cameras, and can be watched from the duty desk by the NCO on duty. I don't say this to be demeaning, but it seems like many people think cameras are wide-spread on military posts and that footage is readily available...unfortunately, it isn't. But believing that footage exists based on an opinion of how the Army works, then leads to angry thoughts of cover-ups and tampering, when in reality, there just isn't footage.

I say this just to ease your mind, as getting riled up right now in anticipation of the Army saying video was deleted does no good. If you know right off the bat that there aren't cameras, it can hopefully stop your mind from wandering down the path of how this investigation was botched or covered up. I lived and worked in these 3CR buildings; I assure you, there is no footage because there are no cameras installed in these buildings. That doesn't mean stop fighting the good fight and pressing for more answers, but this particular avenue leads you to a dead end.

 

[irridescentmoon]

While I'm sharing unpopular opinions, I just want to say that I'm not a fan of the family lawyer. IMO only. Its a sad case to reconcile because the family gets no justice in a sense, with the murderer taking the coward's way out.

Do you think she’s feeding too much on the emotions of the family? I can see that. I do think a congressional review needs to be conducted though. IMO

 

[Kb8la]

<removed quoted post>

Have you had a chance to read the stories on #iamvanessaguillen ? Hundreds of stories of military women that DID report sexual harassment/assault and what did it all gain them?
Retaliation. Told by superiors to keep it to themselves. Labeled a troublemaker. Many times ultimately discharged from the service.
And these are stories from women that are actually speaking out.