TX - Uvalde; Robb Elementary, 19 children and 3 adults killed, shooter dead, 24 MAY 2022

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WingsOverTX

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I am sure there are many more stories of his demented behavior. Could someone along the way have done something to get him help? Maybe the school he dropped out of? Maybe a co-worker or his former boss? Maybe his parents or grandparents? It's just my opinion this didn't happen overnight. One thing that could come out of this tragedy is parents and those in positions of authority in peoples lives recognize signs early on and try to get help for that individual. I wonder if any calls were ever made on his behalf?

It's also my opinion that someone so determined to do this degree of harm would have found a way to do it. He was on a mission.
My belief? The adults in his lives at some point gave up on trying to help him. At one time he was a 10-year-old probably not unlike the ones he murdered.

Now everyone is wondering, "Why?" I think if they are honest, his family, his school, his community knows why - but it's a very complicated why. And the truths need to be addressed - whether parental guidance missing due to drug use, bullying at school, bouncing between his mother & grandmother, dropping out of school, harassing texts to the young women he worked with, cutting himself....the list could go on and on.

This is not a person who acted on spur of the moment rage. He planned. At some point, he came to the conclusion that he could behave any way he wanted because no one was going to connect with him in a meaningful supportive way.

To me, the part missing with these young male killers is an analysis of the construct in which they live. Killer Crumbley's parents' behavior was aggregious enough that they face trial.

SR was 10 once. What happened to that child to create the 18-year-old who acted as if there are no boundaries on his behavior?

It is unsettling to place blame on his family, school and community. Why? Because we then have to confront very painful truths that many (if not most) of us personally avoid. I think nature & nurture both contribute to the lost souls who become mass murderers.

Everything that happens before the weapons are assembled and final action is taken is systemic in my view. Taking the guns away doesn't solve it. The weapons are a symptom of not a cause of "Why?"

I'm not against better regulation of firearms and what types are readily available for purchase. But that is, to me, only a small part of the solution.

If I saw an innocent-looking picture of SR at 10 years old & thought about his home, school & community influences then, what would worry me about his future?

MY OPINION ONLY
 

sds71

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“A video, posted to a parent’s Facebook account and reviewed by The Washington Post, shows that families waiting outside Robb Elementary School were frustrated by the police response and wanted to attempt to enter the building themselves”

Security experts are questioning whether the standard protocol in responding to a school shooting was followed. Guidelines developed in the aftermath of the 1999 Columbine massacre instruct officers to immediately target the gunman. Kenneth Trump, a national school security expert, said that any delay in going inside will be hard to explain. McCraw has defended the response, saying officers saved lives.

 
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Kristin Esq.

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That gun would need to be accessed and unlocked by a frantic teacher amid 20+ frantic children while trying to decide if she should order them to run, hide, or fight.

If you are suggesting that one teacher should corral 25 panicked kids and another should lock the door, turn off the lights, pull the shades, and retrieve and ready the gun - all in time to prevent bloodshed - I kindly suggest you volunteer in a classroom.

Well said!!!!
 

bestill

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My belief? The adults in his lives at some point gave up on trying to help him. At one time he was a 10-year-old probably not unlike the ones he murdered.

Now everyone is wondering, "Why?" I think if they are honest, his family, his school, his community knows why - but it's a very complicated why. And the truths need to be addressed - whether parental guidance missing due to drug use, bullying at school, bouncing between his mother & grandmother, dropping out of school, harassing texts to the young women he worked with, cutting himself....the list could go on and on.

This is not a person who acted on spur of the moment rage. He planned. At some point, he came to the conclusion that he could behave any way he wanted because no one was going to connect with him in a meaningful supportive way.

To me, the part missing with these young male killers is an analysis of the construct in which they live. Killer Crumbley's parents' behavior was aggregious enough that they face trial.

SR was 10 once. What happened to that child to create the 18-year-old who acted as if there are no boundaries on his behavior?

It is unsettling to place blame on his family, school and community. Why? Because we then have to confront very painful truths that many (if not most) of us personally avoid. I think nature & nurture both contribute to the lost souls who become mass murderers.

Everything that happens before the weapons are assembled and final action is taken is systemic in my view. Taking the guns away doesn't solve it. The weapons are a symptom of not a cause of "Why?"

I'm not against better regulation of firearms and what types are readily available for purchase. But that is, to me, only a small part of the solution.

If I saw an innocent-looking picture of SR at 10 years old & thought about his home, school & community influences then, what would worry me about his future?

MY OPINION ONLY
Thank you so much for your thoughtful post. I agree with so much of what you said!
 

IceIce9

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That gun would need to be accessed and unlocked by a frantic teacher amid 20+ frantic children while trying to decide if she should order them to run, hide, or fight.

If you are suggesting that one teacher should corral 25 panicked kids and another should lock the door, turn off the lights, pull the shades, and retrieve and ready the gun - all in time to prevent bloodshed - I kindly suggest you volunteer in a classroom.
I am not saying it is a good idea or bad idea. But I know in many states teachers are allowed to carry at school. And I have heard school board discussions on the subject, both pro and con.
 

Facinatingtimes

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My belief? The adults in his lives at some point gave up on trying to help him. At one time he was a 10-year-old probably not unlike the ones he murdered.

Now everyone is wondering, "Why?" I think if they are honest, his family, his school, his community knows why - but it's a very complicated why. And the truths need to be addressed - whether parental guidance missing due to drug use, bullying at school, bouncing between his mother & grandmother, dropping out of school, harassing texts to the young women he worked with, cutting himself....the list could go on and on.

This is not a person who acted on spur of the moment rage. He planned. At some point, he came to the conclusion that he could behave any way he wanted because no one was going to connect with him in a meaningful supportive way.

To me, the part missing with these young male killers is an analysis of the construct in which they live. Killer Crumbley's parents' behavior was aggregious enough that they face trial.

SR was 10 once. What happened to that child to create the 18-year-old who acted as if there are no boundaries on his behavior?

It is unsettling to place blame on his family, school and community. Why? Because we then have to confront very painful truths that many (if not most) of us personally avoid. I think nature & nurture both contribute to the lost souls who become mass murderers.

Everything that happens before the weapons are assembled and final action is taken is systemic in my view. Taking the guns away doesn't solve it. The weapons are a symptom of not a cause of "Why?"

I'm not against better regulation of firearms and what types are readily available for purchase. But that is, to me, only a small part of the solution.

If I saw an innocent-looking picture of SR at 10 years old & thought about his home, school & community influences then, what would worry me about his future?

MY OPINION ONLY
Great post - totally agree. It’s tough work to help someone. If SR was really in his room all the time, a loner, angry - then he needed help. He was a kid after all, and would perhaps not seek mental health support on his own. Maybe the adults in his life fought tooth and nail to help him? Or maybe they just gave up. Or maybe they didn’t pay enough attention.
 

formerlyme

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In my opinion more mental health treatment is not the answer, more mental health screening is. If you had to do some type of personality/psychological test prior to purchasing a weapon some of these folks may be able to be guided to help. It seems to me often that "there is no history of mental health issues" is what is said.... A lot of folks are not in the system who may be suffering from severe mental health issues.
Just my Opinion.
 
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white rabbit

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question for texans/gun owners/retail workers (i've never bought nor sold a gun in texas)...understanding that gun laws are pretty lax there, wouldn't anyone that came into a store to buy an assault weapon raise a red flag? i realize gun sellers/owners come in all shapes sizes and colors but if a pimply 18 year old walks into your store and orders up a daniel defense, wouldn't you at least say to yourself "hmmm"?. not in any way placing blame, the person behind the counter was just doing his/her job. but in my experience, even with the most detailed google research, walking into a sporting goods store to buy my first gun i'd at least chat with the experts. like, "which long range rifle is best for big game?" or "can you direct me to the best for sporting clays?". maybe i'm naive. slapping down a few hundred or thousand for my very first firearm, an ASSAULT weapon, you'd think someone would've said "hmmm"...or is it THAT common for AK-15's to be sold daily.

honest question, not looking for any debate.
 

x_files

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My belief? The adults in his lives at some point gave up on trying to help him. At one time he was a 10-year-old probably not unlike the ones he murdered.

Now everyone is wondering, "Why?" I think if they are honest, his family, his school, his community knows why - but it's a very complicated why. And the truths need to be addressed - whether parental guidance missing due to drug use, bullying at school, bouncing between his mother & grandmother, dropping out of school, harassing texts to the young women he worked with, cutting himself....the list could go on and on.

This is not a person who acted on spur of the moment rage. He planned. At some point, he came to the conclusion that he could behave any way he wanted because no one was going to connect with him in a meaningful supportive way.

To me, the part missing with these young male killers is an analysis of the construct in which they live. Killer Crumbley's parents' behavior was aggregious enough that they face trial.

SR was 10 once. What happened to that child to create the 18-year-old who acted as if there are no boundaries on his behavior?

It is unsettling to place blame on his family, school and community. Why? Because we then have to confront very painful truths that many (if not most) of us personally avoid. I think nature & nurture both contribute to the lost souls who become mass murderers.

Everything that happens before the weapons are assembled and final action is taken is systemic in my view. Taking the guns away doesn't solve it. The weapons are a symptom of not a cause of "Why?"

I'm not against better regulation of firearms and what types are readily available for purchase. But that is, to me, only a small part of the solution.

If I saw an innocent-looking picture of SR at 10 years old & thought about his home, school & community influences then, what would worry me about his future?

MY OPINION ONLY

It's sad to think they gave up but it takes a professional mental healthcare worker to help. Sometimes the parents' love isn't enough to help overcome disorders and mental illnesses.
At one time there was a window of opportunity to intervene.
So we need preventative measures along with safety measures to prevent the next mass shooter.
 

x_files

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Not everyone is capable of firing a gun. I wouldn't, certainly not if I had 20+ scared children under my responsability and looking at me. I couldn't be a teacher in this climate. This is not normal.

It takes training in order to stay calm with 20 kids panicking. The teachers would need hardcore every weekend training not everyone is cut out for this level of intense stress. I really do feel for teachers all they wanna do is teach these sweet young ones. Teaching is an honorable profession I wish our society held them in higher regard.
 

x_files

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In my opinion more mental health treatment is not the answer, more mental health screening is. If you had to do some type of personality/psychological test prior to purchasing a weapon some of these folks may be able to be guided to help. It seems to me often that "there is no history of mental health issues" is what is said.... A lot of folks are not in the system who may be suffering from severe mental health issues.
Just my Opinion.

What about both? Affordable/free mental healthcare available and then mental health screening before buying a gun?
I like your idea.
 

rhino

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Not everyone is capable of firing a gun. I wouldn't, certainly not if I had 20+ scared children under my responsability and looking at me. I couldn't be a teacher in this climate. This is not normal.
Yeah, I don’t know about others, but if I’d wanted to shoot people I’d have joined the military. Instead, I wanted to nurture and educate little minds :confused:
 

formerlyme

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What about both? Affordable/free mental healthcare available and then mental health screening before buying a gun?
I like your idea.
I worked in behavioral health here for 10 years, with an SMI (seriously mentally ill) population. A huge thing I noticed is it is very hard for family members to get someone help, especially if they are an adult. Once people were in the system they were able to get the care free or affordable. We need to get the stigma of mental help and getting help to go away and maybe more will reach out. BUT yes, affordable/free and ACCESIBLE would be a huge help.
 

Lusitana

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It takes training in order to stay calm with 20 kids panicking. The teachers would need hardcore every weekend training not everyone is cut out for this level of intense stress. I really do feel for teachers all they wanna do is teach these sweet young ones. Teaching is an honorable profession I wish our society held them in higher regard.
And who's going to pay for that? What happens when a teacher simply can't deal with that?

Yeah, I don’t know about others, but if I’d wanted to shoot people I’d have joined the military. Instead, I wanted to nurture and educate little minds :confused:

Exactly, I didn't sign up for any of this. I'm there to teach, I'm not there to shoot anyone and to have to die and see my students die because someone with a gun decided it would be a great idea to murder a bunch of innocent people.
 

BayouBelle_LA

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sds71

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@tplohetski

Authorities now confirm they are examining the response of police in Uvalde in the shooting of 19 children amid conflicting witness statements, including what steps they took to stop the gunman. Part of the review will include a timeline based on radio traffic.

Officials also are analyzing ballistics to learn who fired and when. Sources say these types of reviews are standard after major incidents but are intensified in this case because of discrepancies in statements and gravity of the matter. Uvalde’s chief could not be reached.

Officials first said a school officer and the gunman exchanged fire. On Wednesday night, they said they could no longer confirm that initial report. We will stay with this to fully understand what happened.
 

x_files

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And who's going to pay for that? What happens when a teacher simply can't deal with that?



Exactly, I didn't sign up for any of this. I'm there to teach, I'm not there to shoot anyone and to have to die and see my students die because someone with a gun decided it would be a great idea to murder a bunch of innocent people.

I understand. I don't think a teacher should be expected to be a military-trained marksman and be an excellent teacher on top of it. It would have to be provided by the school. That's extra funding.
I don't think it's right for Ted Cruz to expect teachers to be all armed and only one locked door at each school. But I digress. You shouldn't have to teach in a warzone. I fear many great teachers are going to leave to teach in private schools or private tutoring.
I worked in behavioral health here for 10 years, with an SMI (seriously mentally ill) population. A huge thing I noticed is it is very hard for family members to get someone help, especially if they are an adult. Once people were in the system they were able to get the care free or affordable. We need to get the stigma of mental help and getting help to go away and maybe more will reach out. BUT yes, affordable/free and ACCESIBLE would be a huge help.

Unfortunately, the stigma scares a lot of folks away, I hope that changes soon.
true as soon as he turned 18 he was a legal adult. I wish the age to buy a gun was 21, maybe could cut down on some of the mass shootings.
 
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