UK - Canonbie, Scotland, WhtMale, 40-60, bald, w/ Italian newspaper, Dec'10

Discussion in 'The Unidentified' started by Ironside, Sep 16, 2015.

  1. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    This unidentified case really haunts me. Someone somewhere must be wondering where this poor man is and I'm hoping us websleuths can help identify him. There are a number of clues available such as clothing and teeth.

    [​IMG]

    http://www.missingpersons.police.uk/en/case/11-000105

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-south-scotland-14636853

    http://www.itv.com/news/border/update/2012-12-20/canonbie-body-mystery-full-report/

    Based on the newspaper found near to him I'd say there is a good chance of him being italian or at least from mainland europe. His gloves looked very fancy and not something a british man would tend to wear. Receipts from a shop in London were found on him so maybe he was from europe but lived in London for a number of years.

    I wonder why he was in the area - Canonbie is very remote. Police have done a number of appeals but nobody knows who he was, the furthest they got was confirmation he stayed in a guest house nearby.

    The newspaper makes me wonder was there something in it about him/someone he knew? I wish I spoke italian so I could get a copy of it and read it to see if there are any clues.

    Does anyone have any thoughts on how we can help identify this man?
     
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  3. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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    I wonder why he had a July newspaper if he hung himself sometime around October/November.

    A clue within the newspaper perhaps? Why else would he keep it? Unless he'd been hanging there since July and the police/coroner have the dates way round, unlikely though.

    (PS Thanks, Ironside, for putting in the UK cases thread!)
     
  4. SarahR

    SarahR New Member

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  5. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    I think the time of death would be accurate enough - police confirmed he stayed in a B&B nearby which narrowed down dates. Plus had he been there since July I think his clothes would have been pretty messed up. I found an archived link where you view the pictures of his clothes and they look ok. The winter of 2010 was freezing so he was probably more preserved than most bodies found.

    http://www.webarchive.org.uk/waybac...y.police.uk/news/highProfile/canonbieBody.htm


    Police statement -

    Dumfries and Galloway Constabulary have launched a poster appeal to help identify a body that was discovered in Canonbie in 2010. World wide investigations have yet to reveal the identification of the male and officers hope that the additional information in the poster will bring a breakthrough in the enquiry.

    The body of the male was discovered on 20 December 2010 at Burnside Plantation, Canonbie, Dumfries and Galloway. The male is described as being:

    40 - 60 years, White Male
    Between (5’8” to 5’9”) or (172.72cm to 175.26cm) in height,
    bald head (areas of short hair visible),
    He would appear normally to be clean shaven however there is grey stubble visible on the face
    There appears to a small scar to the area of his lower right abdomen
    He has six teeth missing. There is evidence that his upper left first premolar socket has not fully healed which indicates that he had this tooth extracted possibly within the last 6 months
    He was wearing an olive green safari type hat, brown tanned coloured cord style jacket (till receipts from a shop premises in London which were dated 1991 have been recovered from the pockets of this item of clothing), black trousers, light coloured gloves and grey ankle boots (UK size between 6 – 8)
    Recovered near to the body of the deceased was a La Repubblica newspaper dated 22 July 2010, this is a daily Italian newspaper.

    It has been established that the male may have been within Burnside Plantation since late November 2010.

    Enquiries have now been undertaken Locally, Regionally, Nationally and Internationally, however the male still remains unidentified.

    Dumfries and Galloway Constabulary have now released further photographs of the clothing worn by the male and are appealing for any witnesses who have seen this male or can identify his clothing or facial image to contact them on 0845 600 5701 or any police officer.

    Information can also be left anonymously with Crimestoppers on 0800 555 111.
     
  6. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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    So the newspaper MUST yield a clue. Why else carry a 3 month old newspaper around?

    And I reckon the jacket was probably bought from a charity shop.
     
  7. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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  8. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    I think they are only released if the teeth are distinctive, a run of the mill crown would not be that memorable to a dentist.

    Charity shop jacket is a good theory but don't they usually check the pockets before selling something?

    I'd like to know what brands of clothes he was wearing when he was found. And did the police look into what was published in the newspaper that day?
     
  9. shadowdancer

    shadowdancer Active Member

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    Could he have been a migrant from northern Africa who entered the EU via Italy as so many do?
     
  10. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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    They can DNA test now to find out where someone has been living or where they originated from. I wonder if that's been done.

    But going back to the newspaper, it has got to have significance, maybe there are archived copies of it.
     
  11. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    Doubt he was a migrant from africa as he was white.

    I've tried to find an online archive of the paper but can't seem to find anything, there probably is one but not speaking italian is hindering me.
     
  12. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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    Wouldn't it make sense for the police to open up their case files in cases like this? I have seen at least one thread on here where the police have been directly involved - and posting - and letting us put the man hours into research. It wouldn't be appropriate in most cases, granted, but there are ones like this where crowd-sleuthing could get a result.
     
  13. shadowdancer

    shadowdancer Active Member

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    No, I said Northern Africa. He wouldn't be black if he was for example from Libya or Egypt, which many of the migrants coming through Italy are.
     
  14. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    I like your thinking outside the box but he was found nearly five years ago which was before the migrant crisis/egyptian crisis/civil war in Libya began.

    I think if this guy had the olive skin of northern africans he wouldn't be classed by police as a white european.
     
  15. shadowdancer

    shadowdancer Active Member

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    People have been coming through Italy for many years before those events for a better life in Europe - decades!!

    Its worth considering. You might be surprised at how light-skinned people from Northern Africa often are. One of my sons is friends with an Egyptian boy and his skin tone is hardly different from ours. Same goes for an ex colleague's husband from Northern Africa.

    The main thing that makes them stand out against 'Europeans' is the dark/black hair, but this chap didn't have any, so we don't know what colour it would have been.

    I wonder whether there are farms near where he was found. He may have travelled there having been told he might find work there.

    Him being Italian doesn't seem to make sense. Why would an Italian man come to Scotland and end up like this chap having seemingly not been reported missing (I'm sure the police checked Italian missing persons)? Its possible of course, but it doesn't seem to add up in my mind.

    The only possibility I can think of that makes sense is that he may have been on the run for a crime or something. Mafia?
     
  16. shadowdancer

    shadowdancer Active Member

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    Depends, in the charity shop I help in we are supposed to do this, but some volunteers are more thorough than others.

    I once bought a coat in a charity shop that turned out to have a ten pound note in the pocket!!

    I did go back to the shop and put the money in the collection box.
     
  17. Ironside

    Ironside Active Member

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    He did have a small amount of hair so I'd assume they figured he was white based on the hair colour.

    There are farms in the area but police did make local enquiries but got nowhere. Casual farm work is seasonal. There wouldn't be that much work going in November and I don't think his clothes look like a labourers. He must have had other possessions, a bag or suitcase, and ditched them somewhere so maybe he was a farm worker and got "dressed up".

    Mafia is something I considered which is why I think there could be a clue in the newspaper.

    I wonder was he in North England but crossed into Scotland to end his life, it is very close to the border. I hope police made enquiries with the cumbrian and northumberland police.
     
  18. Ragamuffin

    Ragamuffin New Member

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  19. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    Wondering why the UID was wearing white gloves?
    It seems an unusual choice given the dark colours of his other apparel and not a colour most men, and perhaps women, would choose for gloves, imo.

    According to this link, several occupations may be associated with a preference for white gloves.
    Not necessarily relevant in this case, as the UID, may have worn whatever pair came his way, but perhaps it might spark some thought concerning this person's identity, fwiw, imo.


    http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/201.../#.VhK7iSvSkg8

    "White gloves are perhaps most strongly associated with people who drive for a living, including taxi drivers, bus drivers, pilots and railway engineers. For drivers, the original attraction was visibility; before trains and automobiles had automatic signals, those at the controls had to use their hands to signal their moves, and white gloves make the hands easier to see. While drivers no longer need to stick their hands out of windows to signal, the preference for white gloves persists. “I feel more professional when I’m wearing white gloves,” one taxi driver told me. “It looks smarter too.” A bus driver said he wears white gloves because they look “clean” and “trustworthy.”

    White is indeed associated with cleanliness, which is one reason many workers in the package-delivery industry wear white gloves. “Gloves reduce wear and tear on the hands,” one of my local delivery guys told me. “But we also wear white gloves because many of our customers are concerned about dirt and germs. They don’t want their packages to come into contact with anyone’s bare hands.” The association between white gloves and honesty is also why politicians wear white gloves on the campaign trail."
     
  20. squish

    squish New Member

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    It's worth bearing in mind that 2% of Scotland's population is of Italian descent; there has been a strong connection since the 1800's, when Italians would go over there to work for the winter. Many of them permanently emigrated, and established communities. It's not so random to find an Italian in rural Scotland.

    I agree that the jacket could have been a charity shop job. It is bizarre that receipts could have stayed readable in the pockets for 19 years. Was the jacket not washed in all that time? How do they know the receipts relate to the jacket?
     
  21. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Active Member

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    Michael Jackson fan?

    Too soon?
     

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