Recovered/Located UK - Cardiff - 3 Women & 2 Men Missing, leaving nightclub approx 2am, Newport, 4 March 2023

But when it was reported on here, we knew there was a group of 5 people who had gone missing after they were last known to be driving to Trecco bay. The police didn't have that information straight away, they were reported missing individually, and they didn't know the girls had been in a car with the boys at that time, so I don't see how they could have possibly guessed what had happened at the point of the first missing persons report. JMO.
 
.. as it emerged the five revellers may have driven 85 miles in the hours before the tragedy.

While the exact route the group drove is not known, a direct journey would have taken them approximately 85 miles in total.


It bothers me so much that they’re referred to as “revellers”. I’m in the US so maybe it’s seen differently here, but I think it’s insulting that that’s how DM decided to identify them. They had lives and families and jobs. It’s upsetting that they’re being labeled as basically just partiers.

JMO.

(Also JennieM, this is not directed at you — it’s directed at the article)
 
But when it was reported on here, we knew there was a group of 5 people who had gone missing after they were last known to be driving to Trecco bay. The police didn't have that information straight away, they were reported missing individually, and they didn't know the girls had been in a car with the boys at that time, so I don't see how they could have possibly guessed what had happened at the point of the first missing persons report. JMO.
They didn't have the information straightaway, but that isn't the point. It took them roughly 30 hours to find the car even after they did have the information, and it seems like law enforcement's blasé attitude towards the victims delayed any sort of vigorous search. It doesn't seem like any real effort was made until the press got ahold of the story and public pressure forced law enforcement to act. IMO, it's highly likely that all four victims would have died before the car was found if the press had not run with the story.
 
They were found 30 hours after the first girl was reported missing. They were reported missing to Gwent police Saturday evening. Only one of the men was reported missing as far as I know, and that wasn't until Sunday morning, and the report was made to South Wales police (two separate forces). So to place the group together, in a car, would have taken time. When they realised that there were 5 of them missing, they put out appeals and got the helicopter out. With hindsight, obviously things should have moved faster, but I can completely understand why it wasn't. MOO.
 
The girls had known each other since they were little, so at some point I’d have thought their families and other friends would’ve realised all three were missing and, crucially, not using their phones. That in itself would be enough to raise a huge red flag, for me.
 
Crystal ball? Nonsense. Two different police officers might have two different opinions on a risk grading, with the same set of facts. You don't need to be psychic; it all comes down to who's doing the grading, and what psychological blindspots they might have, what unconscious prejudice might be present.

What a lot of the talk around this can be summed up as is: 20-year old women don't deserve to be seen as high-risk missing if their missing-ness begins on a night out. How utterly awful.
No?

A 20 year old woman doesn't become automatically high risk missing if there is no evidence of foul play, suicidal intention, accident, medical emergency etc.

A 20 year old woman is what we call an adult. Who is fully within her rights to stay out all night and the next morning if she pleases. She's not a child to be delivered back to her parents by police on their say so. Absence of other concerning information, she's low risk, as would any of us be if we didn't pick up mum's calls after a hard night out.

Now as time goes on and there is no contact, she doesn't turn up, the other girls are reported missing, etc etc then yes the grading should go up in a timely manner. However we are seeing this through the lense of the sad but extremely rare, outcome, instead of from the perspective of what was known to police/loved ones at any one point in time.

- even if they had graded it high risk and put 200 boots on the ground at the first missing report (the next morning) they would have still had significant difficulties locating them. This appears to have been a spontaneous trip with strangers to a random caravan park. So first you got to track their night out. Then dig up hungover witness and owners with CCTV etc to work out who they left with. Then you have to identify them their car, where they went, where/when/why they left, what potential route they took, where they were going. Who was in the car. - and after all that you still don't know what happened to them. You can't just assume a car crash with no evidence, did they head to another party? Get followed after the altercation? Did the guys attack the girls somewhere and have fled? Add to that the fact the car was invisible to the road and you have miles and miles of country roads and endless possibilities to try and narrow down. All that takes time, hours and hours, even with a lot of resources and getting reasonable lucky on clues.

The circumstances will be fully examined, the information provided, the reasoning behind risk gradings, re-gradings and reactions to new information will be put under a microscope. So I am sure we will get the opportunity to judge police action in detail with time.
 
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The girls had known each other since they were little, so at some point I’d have thought their families and other friends would’ve realised all three were missing and, crucially, not using their phones. That in itself would be enough to raise a huge red flag, for me.
Of course. One of the first things the parents would do is contact the other families to see if their daughter had come home and if so if she knew where their own daughter was.
 
Crystal ball? Nonsense. Two different police officers might have two different opinions on a risk grading, with the same set of facts. You don't need to be psychic; it all comes down to who's doing the grading, and what psychological blindspots they might have, what unconscious prejudice might be present.

What a lot of the talk around this can be summed up as is: 20-year old women don't deserve to be seen as high-risk missing if their missing-ness begins on a night out. How utterly awful.
I don't think that's entirely fair. I do support police making inquiries and visiting the last known location, and things like that, but context does matter. It does matter if someone didn't return/call in from a night time walk or a trip to the shop around the corner compared to not returning/calling home after a night out.

This has nothing to do with what anyone deserves, it's about appropriate use of police resources and trying to target them to situations that are higher risk.

At what point in this case could police have reasonably said that a car crash that had gone unspotted, or another danger to life event could well have occurred? And when you do make that assessment, where do you start looking? Do you ask all police vehicles to watch out for possible cars that have gone off the road on that stretch from Trecco Bay back to Newport? Maybe visit the bar they were known to be at that night and ask for information? Contact hospitals to see if anyone of the missing person's appearance has been brought in? Send up a helicopter? Where would you set the helicopter to focus on looking? Surely it's only as more information came in that there was a better idea for where to send the helicopter?
 
Latest Police Statement.....
About the only new news is that the accident is deemed to have occurred at 02:03am Saturday
Cardiff car crash: Sixth rider who left tells police his last moments

This article seems to have conflicting information.

‘Joel left the car at around 2am in nearby Pentwyn, around two miles from the tragedy.’
That wouldn’t fit with the 2:03am crash time if that’s correct. But the article also says
‘…aboard the white Volkswagen Tiguan was Joel Lia, 27, who was dropped off only hours before the incident’

I’m not sure but I don’t think ‘hours’ fits in with the timings of the night either though? Hmm
 
I thought the call about one of the males didn't come in to police until about 5pm on the Sunday? And after that, which may have contained info about the vehicle and led to the knowledge about the later part of the route, it took about 7 hours for the vehicle to be located, apparently almost simultaneously by volunteers, police, and helicopter.

I would question whether information in the later missing person report might have given key information in where to search for a possible vehicle that had gone off the road and was clearly quite well hidden, because if it hadn't been well hidden it would have been called in much earlier. And the fact it was so well hidden is no one's fault, but does seem to be the major factor in the length of time it took to find the vehicle and people in it.
 
BBC News - Cardiff crash: Police say victims were not found for 46 hours


Police said CCTV was studied and number plate recognition cameras used to establish the crash happened at 02:03 GMT on Saturday, 4 March.

It was not until 46 hours later the victims were found, just after midnight on Monday morning.


--

A sixth person, who had been with the five who were in the crash, had been dropped at home earlier.

The three women, from Newport, had gone to The Muffler club in the city's Maesglas area late on Friday.

They then travelled 36 miles (58km) to Trecco Bay Caravan Park, in Porthcawl, Bridgend county, with the two men, both from Cardiff.

A first missing person report was made to Gwent Police at 19:34 GMT on Saturday, with further missing person reports made to the same force at 19:43 GMT and 21:32 GMT on Saturday.

A further missing person report was made to South Wales Police at 17:37 GMT on Sunday
.

.....

A timeline is slowly coming out. So it seems the fist MP report came to police 17 hours after the crash. Explains why she wasn't much looked for on Saturday.

-oof I don't even want to imagine those poor girls ordeal

Though, it would probably be less than that in terms of 'initial concern' i.e, parents expected her home by morning (or even assumed at first she went to work.)

Those string of other MP reports Saturday night. I wonder if they are all separate people or not or family calling back? I would imagine the parents of the OG MP report would be calling her friends and those close to them to see if their kid was crashing somewhere, only for them to realise that nobody heard from any of them.
 
Was it Lauren’s mum who kept calling police Sat afternoon and was told not to worry? And Eve’s mum who somehow ended up in possession of Eve’s bag and phone?

The sinking feeling those parents must have had when they started putting 2+2 together, probably contacting Darcy’s family and other friends too. And then hearing their daughters had last been seen going off with three unknown blokes, it is every parents worst nightmare. What an unimaginable wait to find their fears came true, my heart goes out to them so much.
 
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Cardiff car crash: Sixth rider who left tells police his last moments

This article seems to have conflicting information.

‘Joel left the car at around 2am in nearby Pentwyn, around two miles from the tragedy.’
That wouldn’t fit with the 2:03am crash time if that’s correct. But the article also says
‘…aboard the white Volkswagen Tiguan was Joel Lia, 27, who was dropped off only hours before the incident’

I’m not sure but I don’t think ‘hours’ fits in with the timings of the night either though? Hmm
"Hours" is clearly a mistake, probably due to hasty editing.
Being dropped off "around 2 am" is consistent with the crash timing of 2.03 am. He's only given an approximation of the time, he probably didn't know the exact time.
 
Timeline as far as I can tell

FRIDAY 3rd

- Group of girls, all from NEWPORT, ES + DR + SR go to THE MUFFLER in MAESGLAS (Newport) - ES apparently drove at least herself as her car remained parked outside nightclub.
- Meet two males RJ + SL + M3:JL in the nightclub - Unknown to them previously
- Group of 6 get in White Volkswagan TIGUAN (possibly around 11:00-12:00)
- Travelled to TRECCO BAY caravan park in TRECCO (25-40ish miles) where SL has a caravan
- Some sort of altercation (some reports call it a noise complaint made to park security) - group left in car


SATURDAY 4th

02:00ish
- Drives back to NEWPORT through CARDIFF and drops off JL in PENTWYN (2.5m from crash site) - JL states they went to fill car with petrol and take ES + DR + SR home (to NEWPORT)
02:03 - Crash occures A48(M) St Mellons area of Cardiff

Time that Elapses 17.5 Hours

19:34 - First Missing Report (GWENT POLICE)
19:43
- Second Missing Report (GWENT POLICE)
20:55
- Sister of ES starts posting on FB asking for info on all three girls
21:08 - Sister of ES asks for info males in girls snapchats
21:51 - Sister of ES has identified RJ and SL and is asking for contact info
21:32 - Third Missing Report (GWENT POLICE)


SUNDAY 5th

07:07 -
Sister of ES posts on FN asking for info on the TIGUAN with numberplate (multiple posts through day)
07:30 - Sister of CM posts now include that "Car last seen on the M4 coming from porthcall to Cardiff There have been NO face to face or social media contact for all 5 and the whereabouts of the car is unknown. Police have ANPR trace on car, Police are tracking phones and Social media"

Media states there were 'hundred of searchers' over Sunday, both police and volenteers have been mentioned in large numbers.

13:10 - Sister of ES posts that 'all five are reported missing and are offically missing people'
17:37 - Fourth Missing Report (SOUTH WALES POLICE)
19:53
- Sister of ES posts that "Car last seen on the M4 coming from porthcall to Cardiff"
23:00 - SWP and GP issue joint police statement confirming they are looking for five MPs and a Volkswagan TIGUAN ES + DR + SR
23:50 - Police Helicopter searches wooded area off A48


MONDAY 6th

12:02 -
Car spotted by 'officers on the ground'
12:15 - Car found/ log entry made (Statments mention helicopter was up)
That police found car first has been disputed by friends of MPs who state they spotted tyre tracks near police search area. Police dispute this strongly.

Compilation of many many MSM sources + Police and IOPC statements so expect some inaccuracies

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68482927-11836241-image-a-19_1678309116576.jpg


Many Many Sources

 
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Has it been Explained why are ES apparently left her bag with her Mum or left it behind in the pub? I can’t think why you would do that.
 

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