UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon & Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #2 *Arrest*

[dotr]

Juicy Lucy that was my exact reaction to those quotes too.

Okay, the shifty baseball cap bit was an eyerolling moment, the looking strangely at the baby part, not quite so much, imo.

Wondering if he brought his ''walking club/stick'' into the Food bank, also wondering if LE inspected it, iykwim?

 

[Doughy]

I wondered if they had got baby supplies or not from the food bank, as they often have them

It says in the article they didn't.

 

[LovesPeace2]

This is awful and just sad, I really hope that they supply LE with where the baby is. It's kinda hard to be positive after seeing so much evil being done to littles by their sperm and egg donors I have a hard calling them parentals . I'm stuck between the little being buried somewhere or being sold I hate that my mind goes to that right away. I really hope now that they are separated cm will talk maybe they can make some sort of deal with her for babies wearabouts for a call or info about my. But I doubt it jmoo

 

[Haveyoufedthecat]

Juicy Lucy that was my exact reaction to those quotes too.

Yup, I found that disturbing too.

 

[rockthecasbah]

It says in the article they didn't.

Yes I mean I had wondered before this further detail came out

 

[Amonet]

It seems to me the police went to great lengths to not paint them as convicts. For all we read between the lines, all of the police messaging was about finding them to make sure they and the baby were alright. They were portrayed by the police as missing persons the whole time, not criminals.

The information about MGs sex offender past didn't hit the press until about two weeks after they went missing, and you have to imagine the press were told to hold back because it was found by people on here long before that. MG and CMs (probable) other social service involvement has also never been reported in mainstream news. You might even argue this strategy led to many people who might have seen them thinking they were being unjustly hunted.

I think MG and CM had their course of action - to avoid social services and authorities taking this baby at all costs - set before police and the public even became aware of them and their pregnancy. If the burning car fire and backseat birth followed by a national appeal didn't dissuade them, I don't think any strategy of the police or other services would have worked IMO.

At the end of the day, in the circumstances that police became aware of the couple and baby, they really had no choice but to track them down as fast as possible - perhaps if it was just the two of them they could have been left to it, but there was a vulnerable newborn involved. It would have been the height of negligence not to ensure its welfare. As we seem to be sadly finding out.

I totally agree. The burning car wasn't in the first police appeals, that was something people online figured out. Only after that was the burning car confirmed by police.

A female officer also made several appeals to CM in particular, talking only about medical and safety concerns for baby and CM and trying to encourage them to come forward for medical checks. That's when I saw some people online saying "it's none of the police's business where or how she gave birth" and "if SHE had any concerns about baby's health then SURELY she would see a doctor THEREFORE she and baby are fine and police and SS should leave the family alone"

Police then put out a statement that they were not seeking to break up the family unit, that they just wanted health checks to ensure baby was okay.

But there was a public perception that police were treating this like a 'manhunt', and I think that's true in some ways, but from that perhaps people felt the couple were being treated as criminals, when all the public knew was that CM gave birth outside of a hospital. People even assumed she probably had a doula or someone similar with her, or they felt that women have given birth unaided for thousands of years and that, in itself, is not a crime...true enough. But I think most people felt that could not be the sole reason that police wanted to find the family and get baby, at the least, seen by a doctor. From that point, then the family could have stopped being 'on the run' and got the baby into a proper home with proper hygiene, warmth etc.

 

[ellabella]

Personally I think CM is just as bad as MG, she just doesn't have the conviction. I don't think she'll speak up, and if she does, it will be to benefit herself only.

 

[CriLondon]

The only just-about-somewhat-remotely "acceptable" reason , in my view, to be keeping quiet on the whereabout and welfare of the baby , is if the baby is currently safe and being looked after by someone .
Any other hypothesis , allow me to struggle to reconcile .

 

[JuicyLucy]

This is awful and just sad, I really hope that they supply LE with where the baby is. It's kinda hard to be positive after seeing so much evil being done to littles by their sperm and egg donors I have a hard calling them parentals . I'm stuck between the little being buried somewhere or being sold I hate that my mind goes to that right away. I really hope now that they are separated cm will talk maybe they can make some sort of deal with her for babies wearabouts for a call or info about my. But I doubt it jmoo

Honestly, I think you can put the idea of the baby being sold out of your mind, if it helps. Whatever one thinks of CM and MG, they have been through incredible physical feats of endurance to avoid being separated from that baby. They're not going to sell it imo.

 

[wizardizzo76]

Anyone else feel like it is quite telling that all these "sightings" (whether real or imaginary or over-dramatised) are very recent? If they are prone to walking around shouting at each other, you'd have thought they would have been spotted before now. I am wondering whether they have sort of "given up" in the past week or so, which may be because the baby has recently passed away so they don't feel the need to hide so much. Pure speculation, but they have suddenly appeared in technicolour and shouting each others' names in the street when they have been on the front cover of the newspapers for a couple of months.

 

[Maltesepuppy]

So, no loss of appetite? speculation.

Constance & partner seen at food bank without baby days before arrest

RUNAWAY aristocrat Constance Marten and her rapist lover used a foodbank days before their arrest – but did not ask for nappies which were available. Volunteers at the site screamed in …

www.thesun.co.uk

''RUNAWAY aristocrat Constance Marten and her rapist lover used a foodbank days before their arrest - but did not ask for nappies which were available.

Volunteers at the site screamed in horror after realising they had given goods to Marten and her partner Mark Gordon last week.''

“The baby was not with them. We have supplies here but they didn’t ask for anything for a baby.


“But they came asking for help for themselves. She did the talking and the man looked shifty at the back with his hood up.

“She asked for help. She was wearing a lot of layers and looking back she looked like she’d been outside for a while.''

He looked shifty. He was checking the area.

“He stood back and would not make eye contact.

“She did the talking. We didn’t take any details, we just gave them food because we thought they needed help.

“He was wearing a baseball cap. It was very shifty.”

He told The Sun: “She was wrapped up in a coat, possibly had a scarf on, and I think her hair was brown. She was slightly underdressed for the weather too.''

“She looked scruffy. I didn’t really pay that much attention because I didn’t think much of it at the time.

“I was with my baby and I smiled at the woman but she didn’t smile back.

“I remember thinking it was weird she didn’t smile, and she looked at my baby in a strange way.

No items requested for the baby. That's so worrying.

 

[rockthecasbah]

Anyone else feel like it is quite telling that all these "sightings" (whether real or imaginary or over-dramatised) are very recent? If they are prone to walking around shouting at each other, you'd have thought they would have been spotted before now. I am wondering whether they have sort of "given up" in the past week or so, which may be because the baby has recently passed away so they don't feel the need to hide so much. Pure speculation, but they have suddenly appeared in technicolour and shouting each others' names in the street when they have been on the front cover of the newspapers for a couple of months.

That makes sense, Constance is a pretty unusual name so very noticeable if you are being looked for

 

[LovesPeace2]

Honestly, I think you can put the idea of the baby being sold out of your mind, if it helps. Whatever one thinks of CM and MG, they have been through incredible physical feats of endurance to avoid being separated from that baby. They're not going to sell it imo.

Ya I know just ughh was the best outcome I could think of. I hate that my mind goes to no longer with us first. I honestly can't see either of them saying anything about baby I really hope I'm wrong that little deserves a proper send off if baby is passed on. Some of these cases I just don't understand the why.just my very honest opinion

 

[PlanningPerson]

This is what I think. Maybe the silence is not silence, but more, “there was no baby.” Medical professionals haven’t seen/heard of a baby, nobody has actually SEEN a baby, etc. Movement and crying, yes - but no eyes on the baby.

I hate to even think this, but given that nobody seems to have seen a baby, can the possibility of a multiple birth be completely ruled out? I guess they would need to be 100% sure that there was only ever one placenta and that it was in good enough condition to be able to rule out e.g. monochorionic twins?

Just my own thought

 

[rockthecasbah]

So, no loss of appetite? speculation.

Constance & partner seen at food bank without baby days before arrest

RUNAWAY aristocrat Constance Marten and her rapist lover used a foodbank days before their arrest – but did not ask for nappies which were available. Volunteers at the site screamed in …

www.thesun.co.uk

''RUNAWAY aristocrat Constance Marten and her rapist lover used a foodbank days before their arrest - but did not ask for nappies which were available.

Volunteers at the site screamed in horror after realising they had given goods to Marten and her partner Mark Gordon last week.''

“The baby was not with them. We have supplies here but they didn’t ask for anything for a baby.


“But they came asking for help for themselves. She did the talking and the man looked shifty at the back with his hood up.

“She asked for help. She was wearing a lot of layers and looking back she looked like she’d been outside for a while.''

He looked shifty. He was checking the area.

“He stood back and would not make eye contact.

“She did the talking. We didn’t take any details, we just gave them food because we thought they needed help.

“He was wearing a baseball cap. It was very shifty.”

He told The Sun: “She was wrapped up in a coat, possibly had a scarf on, and I think her hair was brown. She was slightly underdressed for the weather too.''

“She looked scruffy. I didn’t really pay that much attention because I didn’t think much of it at the time.

“I was with my baby and I smiled at the woman but she didn’t smile back.

“I remember thinking it was weird she didn’t smile, and she looked at my baby in a strange way.

Also says what they bought in local shop. Food bank gave them pasta and rice so must have been cooking somehow (unless a standard food parcel).

 

[iamshadow21]

No items requested for the baby. That's so worrying.

That, and the fact that they've been looking at burnt areas.

I know that they may just be campfires, but fire as a disposal method hadn't occurred to me until now, and now I can't stop thinking about it.

MOO

 

[Nikynoo]

No. They're still guilty of child neglect and it's possible to go forward with charging them for manslaughter without a body. They're unlikely to get out on bail because of their clear history of running away.

I’m not so sure on either ending up with a charge tbh, but I’m sure the police will find something to charge them with.

 

[wizardizzo76]

Also says what they bought in local shop. Food bank gave them pasta and rice so must have been cooking somehow (unless a standard food parcel).

Somewhere else it says tinned pasta and rice (I'm assuming rice pudding, which is the no 1 food requested by food banks, apparently).

 

[Amonet]

Honestly, I think you can put the idea of the baby being sold out of your mind, if it helps. Whatever one thinks of CM and MG, they have been through incredible physical feats of endurance to avoid being separated from that baby. They're not going to sell it imo.

I think they'd be more likely to give someone who they considered a kindred spirit (distrust of SS) money to look after baby than to sell the baby.

 

[Droosie]

I sincerely doubt the baby has been given to anyone, far more likely the baby was born addicted to whatever substances have been used during pregnancy and died because they have t been bothered to get the medical help it needed. Scumbags both of them….throw away the key.