UK - Five Bamber family members dead at White House Farm, Essex, 1986

missacorah

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A very interesting case where Jeremy Bamber was jailed for killing his mother,father, sister and her twin sons at a remote farm house. He blames his sister who was having some mental problems at the time. He has always maintained his innocence but few have believed him until this!!

Bamber 'innocent' says lie test


April 20, 2007



COMMENT ON THIS STORY




CONVICTED mass murderer Jeremy Bamber took a lie detector test yesterday in a bid to prove his innocence — and his lawyer said he passed.

Bamber, 45, jailed in 1986 for killing his adoptive parents, his sister and her twin sons at the family’s farmhouse, was hooked up to a polygraph in his cell.
His lawyer Giovanni Di Stefano said Bamber was asked 12 questions, including if he had carried out the five killings and if he had paid a hitman to kill them.
To both questions, he replied “No” and Mr Di Stefano said he passed the test “conclusively”.
Expert Terry Mullins carried out the test — thought to be the first of its kind in a British jail — at Full Sutton prison, near York.
Bamber maintains that his schizophrenic sister Sheila Caffell, a model dubbed Bambi, killed parents Neville and June, her six-year-old sons Nicholas and Daniel, and herself in Tolleshunt D’Arcy, Essex, in 1985.
The case is currently before the Criminal Case Review Commission.

A very interesting case!
 

KarlK

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I guess the outcome depends on the faith British courts have in the lie detector test, which is probably not much. As far as I know most countries outside the US do not rely on the device because there is no scientific evidence of its validity. Even here the polygraph is not as widely used by the justice system as TV shows and movies would lead to believe. It's often used as a PR tool though.
 

Taximom

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I think if you lie enough in your lifetime about something, your body and brain eventually accepts it as truth...and you could easily pass a lie detector test at that point.

I'm not saying that's the case here, but that's what I believe in general.

I'd sure like to read more about this case!
 

joe jones

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I think it also depends on the examiner,

polygraphs are subjective, one person can read a pass into it, others can read a fail,

and surely after that many years of denying he did it he really must have convinced himself he didn't,

so passing a polygraph administered by his defence team proves nothing really,
 

missacorah

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He is supposed to be a fantastic 'fibber'. Definitely worth reading up on this one!
 

gaia227

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I just recently heard of Jeremy Bamber who was convicted in 1986 of the murders of his adoptive parents, his sister and her two 6 yr old sons. Prosecution claims he did it for the $500,000 inheritance. He has vigorously maintained his innocence and has had 3 appeals since his convictions - all have been denied. He is in the news again because he filed another appeal yesterday submitting new crime scene photos and entries from police logbooks which were never submitted in court. Alot of things were not submitted in court during his original trial.......

I have to admit that when reviewing the police investigation and the forensics it adds up to a puzzling affair. His sister Sheila was found clutching a rifle and had a bible closeby. She was a paranoid schiztophrenic who had not been taking her medicine. She had made comments before about getting the evil out of her mother and made comments about killing herself and her children. She had had violent outbursts before. Jeremy received a call from his father that night alleging his father said "Shelia has gone crazy, come quick." Jeremy called the police immediately and headed out to his families estate. A tactile force finally entered the home and found the bodies.
Originally they thought it was a murder suicide on the part of Sheila but through-out the investigation began to change their minds.

Jeremy's ex-girlfriend to LE that Jeremy had been planning to kill his family and told her the night it happened that it was time. She is not exactly credible because she had accused him of things in the past upon them breaking up that were not true. However, she testified at the trial and was very convincing.

The biggest piece of evidence the prosecution had was three days after the murders they found a silencer downstairs with blood in it. Of course, this is before DNA testing and it was somehow established the blood was Sheila's or was a mixture of Sheila's and her parents blood. So, if she was the killer then how was Sheila's blood in the silencer downstairs when she is dead up stairs? This was what the prosecution hinged their case on and it worked. However, after DNA the blood was retested and it turns out the blood was Jeremy and Sheila's mothers DNA mixed with the DNA of an unknown maile. Jeremy appealed based on this evidence and lost.
There is also the issue of Sheila's injuries and blood flow which does not jive with time of death.

Oh yes and the mysterious figure police at the time logged seeing in the house which is why they got a tactile unit together before they went in - those accounts are now denied and ignored. Over fifty crime scene photos were not submitted to trial, the bit about the bicycle, etc, etc the list goes on and on. You just have to sort through this on your own to get the whole picture.

This is a good starting place:

http://www.libertarian.co.uk/lapubs/legan/legan042.htm


http://jeremybamber.com/ (Jeremy's website)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...nts-new-evidence-in-bid-for-third-appeal.html (his newest appeal made in March 2009)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/october/28/newsid_2477000/2477857.stm

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/mar/15/jeremy-bamber-appeal-murder (more about his appeal filed yesterday)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Bamber

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...r-of-his-family-but-was-he-guilty-687102.html
 

fran

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Wow! I wonder if they have anything like the innocence project there? A group like that could surely find the 'evidence' to free this man, if it exists.

I'm beginning to wonder how many people are behind bars, convicted because of LE withholding exculpatory evidence. :(

JMHO
fran
 

T-Rex

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Oh--I remember reading about that a while ago--that's a wild story!
I didn't remember the part about his sister having mental problems, but I do remember the police seeing someone moving about in the house--after they had it surrounded, before they broke in to find everyone dead.
 

fran

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If you just go by what we see right now, the accused's side of the story, he definitely looks innocent to me. I'd have to see all the evidence, though, to make an honest decision.

I've been involved in discussion of a case for the past few months that I strongly feel the accused is innocent. But for various reasons, the accused has plead guilty to a lessor charge. I still have hopes, some way, the wrong will be righted, but who knows.

The recent case I've been following, has shown me a whole different side of LE and the pros office. I'm very concerned with how many innocent people could be behind bars.

seriously,
fran
 

Indianagirl

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my only question is, how did Jeremy's blood end up on the silencer?
 

JaneInOz

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Yes I looked long and hard at this case for some time

The whole adoptive child - killer issue - being my interest :rolleyes:

I got to a point where I was SO convinced he was innocent I started to write a letter !
But thought better of it.
Just cant expose my self and family to doing that.

There is a HUGE issue...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...nts-new-evidence-in-bid-for-third-appeal.html

Where are the missing photos ?

Why was ANY evidence moved ?

And lets face it if the prosecution is so convinced that the showing of the photo where the gun was moved is going to prove more that Sheila , the sister was murdered rather than committed suicide then WHAT do they have to be afraid of ? why arent they showing it ....!!!

Bamber was convicted of shooting his adoptive parents, June and Nevill, his sister Miss Caffell, and her twin sons Daniel and Nicholas, in a 1985 massacre at White House Farm in Tolleshunt D'Arcy.

It initially appeared that Miss Caffell, a model nicknamed "Bambi" who had a history of schizophrenia, had murdered the family then committed suicide.

But suspicion turned to Bamber when his girlfriend revealed he had previously bragged of his intention to kill his parents and collect an inheritance of nearly £500,000.

In 1986 a jury at Chelmsford Crown Court decided by a majority of 10 to two that he had committed the murders to obtain the money.

The latest police photographs uncovered by Bamber's lawyers suggest that the weapon used in the killings, a silenced .22 semi-automatic rifle, was moved from Miss Caffell's body.

They claim moving the rifle would have strengthened the suggestion that she was murdered instead of committing suicide.

Speaking last year Bamber claimed: "There are 58 missing photos of the crime scene - the key ones that show Sheila's body was restaged. I still believe that I will die a free man."
 

JaneInOz

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my only question is, how did Jeremy's blood end up on the silencer?

http://www.jeremybamber.com/index.php?q=Daily-Mail-190507_Jeremy_is_.innocent

It was Sheilas but not 100percent

No one could even be sure that the blood in the silencer was Sheila's. The blood tests available at that time were basic. All that could be done was blood grouping.

The prosecution later conceded that Sheila's blood group matched that of Robert Boutflour, Jeremy's uncle, who was present when the silencer was found.

There is a lot more on the link
 

JaneInOz

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When you look at the drugs that Sheila was taking it really does make it more likely that she committed this crime

Sheila was adopted, her children were in real threat of being removed from her and put into foster care...To someone who is adopted, that has issues , coupled with all the drugs legal and illegal - thats a ticking time bomb

However, Dr Hugh Ferguson, consultant psychiatrist at St Andrew's hospital in Northampton where she was treated, reported that she was "caught up with the idea that the Devil had taken her over and given her the power to project evil on to others, including her sons".

When she was discharged from hospital in September 1983, Ferguson wrote that she had thoughts that she was "capable of murdering her own children".

He made a "firm diagnosis" of schizophrenia, prescribing the antipsychotic drug Stelazine.

She was re-admitted in March 1985 and received injections of another anti-psychotic drug, Haloperidol.

The drug was found in her bloodstream when she died (as was cannabis).

As the appeal court judges said, "She had a psychotic illness requiring in-patient treatment. She had severe mood disturbances (schizophrenia) and she used cannabis and cocaine."

Learning of the killings, Dr Ferguson initially said that such violence was incongruous with his view of Sheila.

Yet, when told that it had been suggested that her children be taken into foster care, he said that this could have had "a catastrophic effect".
 

Indianagirl

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http://www.jeremybamber.com/index.php?q=Daily-Mail-190507_Jeremy_is_.innocent

It was Sheilas but not 100percent



There is a lot more on the link

Gaia's post indicates his DNA was found on the silencer after DNA testing became available (see below snip from gaia's post). IF he had nothing to do with it, how did his DNA get on the silencer? Was it ever concluded that the silencer was used in the murders?

"The biggest piece of evidence the prosecution had was three days after the murders they found a silencer downstairs with blood in it. Of course, this is before DNA testing and it was somehow established the blood was Sheila's or was a mixture of Sheila's and her parents blood. So, if she was the killer then how was Sheila's blood in the silencer downstairs when she is dead up stairs? This was what the prosecution hinged their case on and it worked. However, after DNA the blood was retested and it turns out the blood was Jeremy and Sheila's mothers DNA mixed with the DNA of an unknown maile. Jeremy appealed based on this evidence and lost."


ETA: I just reread that and maybe I am reading it wrong. When it says Jeremy and Sheila's mothers DNA, does that mean singular as in their mother's blood or both Jeremy AND his mother's blood was found on the silencer?
 

JaneInOz

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Gaia's post indicates his DNA was found on the silencer after DNA testing became available (see below snip from gaia's post). IF he had nothing to do with it, how did his DNA get on the silencer? Was it ever concluded that the silencer was used in the murders?

"The biggest piece of evidence the prosecution had was three days after the murders they found a silencer downstairs with blood in it. Of course, this is before DNA testing and it was somehow established the blood was Sheila's or was a mixture of Sheila's and her parents blood. So, if she was the killer then how was Sheila's blood in the silencer downstairs when she is dead up stairs? This was what the prosecution hinged their case on and it worked. However, after DNA the blood was retested and it turns out the blood was Jeremy and Sheila's mothers DNA mixed with the DNA of an unknown maile. Jeremy appealed based on this evidence and lost."

Yes well an unknown Make is not Jeremy then is it ?
 

JaneInOz

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Also from the above link I gave it states

The Criminal Cases Review Commission referred the case to appeal in March 2001. The appeal began in October the following year.

By then, as much scientific testing as possible had been carried out.

The appeal court judges determined that June Bamber's DNA - but not necessarily Sheila's - was in the silencer. They added, however, that they believed there had been significant contamination of the samples and the results were meaningless.


What you have quoted is not from any site but rather Gaia's interpretation of what she has read.
 

Indianagirl

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I just reread that and maybe I am reading it wrong. When it says Jeremy and Sheila's mothers DNA, does that mean singular as in just their mother's blood or both Jeremy AND his mother's blood was found on the silencer?
 
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