GUILTY UK - Jordan Burling, 18, Died Weighing Less Than 6 Stone, Body Of Baby Also Found, Leeds, June 2016

[Tortoise]

Ok, I’ve gotten myself a bit confused here. When are they saying this all started? How long before he died?

I think the first reports of him losing about 2 stone (28 pounds) was in around November. I don't think anyone outside the family saw him after Christmas and he died on 30th June, four days before what would have been his 19th birthday.

 

[Tortoise]

16:15
The day of Jordan's death
Mr Kealey then went over the day leading up to Jordan’s death.
She said she was at work at Poundworld from 6pm until 10.45pm and she then caught the last bus home.
She said she didn’t see him eat that day but he probably drank as he had ‘his Yazoo drinks’.
She claims that when she got home from work she changed him and her mother said he had eaten MacDonalds that day.
She said she then stayed up with Jordan and she slept ‘for a couple of hours’ on the sofa next to him in the living room, as she usually did.
‘We were talking,’ she said, ‘I remember wrestling being on.’
She added: ‘I remember him going to sleep and then ended up ringing 999 because he was making a noise.
She said it was ‘like a moaning sound’ and he had definitely not made that noise before.
She then told the court that he was ‘not responsive’ and that she thought he had been asleep until she heard ‘this noise coming out of him’.

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house - updates

 

[Tortoise]

16:19
'I didn't feel ready to talk'
Dawn Cranston was asked why the room Jordan was in was so cluttered and she said ‘we were concentrated on Jordan, we didn’t have time to do other stuff.’
She was then asked why she said ‘no comment’ throughout her first police interview.
‘I took the advice of the people around me,’ she said, ‘At that point I thought it was the right thing. I didn’t feel I was ready to talk as much as I can now.’
Mr Kealey has moved on to ask about the baby.

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house - updates

 

[Tortoise]

16:32
Dawn gave birth alone in her bedroom
Dawn Cranston said she fell pregnant ‘about 2002/2003’ after having sex with her ex-partner Stephen.
However, she said she didn’t not realise she was pregnant until she gave birth as her periods are ‘erratic’ and she sometimes goes months without having one.

She told the court that she gave birth alone in her bedroom, on a blanket on the floor while her mother, father, Carl, Jordan and Abigail were in other rooms of the house


‘It was late at night and they were still downstairs,’

‘It (the labour) was quicker than previous times. It didn’t feel no longer than half an hour . It was a lot, a lot quicker than previous labours I had before.’


She added: ‘If I remember I was on the floor and I’m pretty sure I put sheets underneath me.’
Dawn was then asked why she didn’t tell anyone she had given birth.
She said ‘I think I started to panic, I was the only person that knew I’d given birth. There was nobody else upstairs apart from Carl, who was in his room and he didn’t know nothing.’

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house - updates

 

[Tortoise]

16:35
Dawn 'quickly realised baby was dead'
Dawn then told the court that she quickly realised the baby was dead.


‘There were no signs of life at all,’

‘If I remember, I don’t think his eyes were open. I heard no noise, no nothing. There were no signs at all.’


Mr Kealey asked her if she was certain the baby was dead.
‘Absolutely, 100 per cent’ she said.

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house - updates

 

[Aescwynn]

This is all so heartbreaking.

Sadly, I'm not sure I can believe anything she says about the baby.

 

[Tortoise]

16:57
Dawn Cranston hoped to bury the baby's body
Dawn then told the court:

“I put it into a rucksack. I cant remember about the bags or how many were used. I was panicking.”

She then said she thought about burying the body in a nearby park but decided it would look ‘a bit suspicious’ so she put it in a wardrobe.

“I was hoping to probably bury it, but I never got around to doing it, because there’s always somebody in the house.”

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house

 

[Tortoise]

16:59
'I started to shut down'
She added:

“At that point I started to shut down. I started to think I was the only person that knew and I didn’t want to worry nobody else.”

She insisted that she thought about the child ‘everyday’ but admitted that if police had not found it when they searched the house after Jordan’s death then ‘it probably would have stayed there’.

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house

 

[Tortoise]

17:02
Trial adjourned for the day
At that point Mr Kealey concluded his questioning and the judge decided to finish for the day.
The case will resume tomorrow at 10.15am, when Dawn Cranston is due to be cross examined.

We’ll be back tomorrow morning with more live coverage.

Family on trial after dead teen and baby found in Leeds house

 

[Tortoise]

This is all so heartbreaking.

Sadly, I'm not sure I can believe anything she says about the baby.

Hopefully the jury will be able to gauge whether she is lying or not.

 

[beatrixpotter]

Wow. I just don't know what to make of this woman. I really don't. I can somehow buy they didn't really grasp the gravity of the situation with Jordan. The fact that he was on a mattress in the living room and not hidden away seems to indicate to me that they were still trying to include him in their lives and not just shoving him aside to die. I think people become immune to their environment and don't recognize how strange and off it is after a while. In their mind, "Jordan's poorly but he'll get better eventually." But having a baby alone, panicking and then sticking him in a rucksack...I don't know. I guess it goes hand in hand.

I have to admit I'm always inclined to be sympathetic to almost everyone who is supposed to be guilty. Even when they are clearly horrible people I find myself feeling sorry for them for some reason or another. I've wondered about this...why I seem to be more sympathetic than is typical to everyone I read about on here. While there are so many others who are always so confident about how horrible and guilty those people are. This thread in particular stands out to me because most people on here aren't talking about how horrible and evil the family is and how they know their evil motivations for it all.

Just thinking out loud here. After following so many cases for so long I find myself thinking about them so often and wondering about things...

 

[Tortoise]

Concealing the birth of a child (which she has pleaded guilty to) Offences Against the Person Act 1861

Another case of a woman who concealed four stillbirths Woman admits concealing four stillborn babies for over 20 years

 

[Tortoise]

I was trying to work out why this article was dated 22nd June (tomorrow) but then I realised it was 1918 (100 years ago!)

This kind of offence had been too prevalent in recent years, much too prevalent. Having regard to the circumstances, he should pass the very lenient sentence of 3 months’ imprisonment in the second division.

On hearing the sentence, the prisoner screamed, threw up her hands, and was carried out of Court in a fainting condition.

Trying to conceal the body of a new-born is a serious offence

 

[Tortoise]

Wow. I just don't know what to make of this woman. I really don't. I can somehow buy they didn't really grasp the gravity of the situation with Jordan. The fact that he was on a mattress in the living room and not hidden away seems to indicate to me that they were still trying to include him in their lives and not just shoving him aside to die. I think people become immune to their environment and don't recognize how strange and off it is after a while. In their mind, "Jordan's poorly but he'll get better eventually." But having a baby alone, panicking and then sticking him in a rucksack...I don't know. I guess it goes hand in hand.

I have to admit I'm always inclined to be sympathetic to almost everyone who is supposed to be guilty. Even when they are clearly horrible people I find myself feeling sorry for them for some reason or another. I've wondered about this...why I seem to be more sympathetic than is typical to everyone I read about on here. While there are so many others who are always so confident about how horrible and guilty those people are. This thread in particular stands out to me because most people on here aren't talking about how horrible and evil the family is and how they know their evil motivations for it all.

Just thinking out loud here. After following so many cases for so long I find myself thinking about them so often and wondering about things...

I think intention is everything. In a nutshell.

ETA - except in the cases of drunk driving, and texting while driving etc.

 

[SugarQueen]

The lies, I can’t believe the lies! While they do seem to be slow at the very least wth is up with the lies? It’s stuck in my head that if they are that mentally “ off” they wouldn’t be lying. I think while they are not quite right mentally they know/ knew on some level what they were doing was horribly wrong. They don’t seem like the typical evil monsters we see here. They just seem like they couldn’t be bothered?

 

[Sooty]

The lies, I can’t believe the lies! While they do seem to be slow at the very least wth is up with the lies? It’s stuck in my head that if they are that mentally “ off” they wouldn’t be lying. I think while they are not quite right mentally they know/ knew on some level what they were doing was horribly wrong. They don’t seem like the typical evil monsters we see here. They just seem like they couldn’t be bothered?

It's odd Sugarqueen but I can't really see that they are lying as such - maybe thats just me. Having been involved with someone who became very isolated, paranoid and anxious the rationale is different. That doesn't make it right, but it is just different. Sorry, just my opinion - and I know yours makes more sense.

 

[SugarQueen]

I do wonder how they would react if a few of the obvious lies were pointed out to them. I mean what would they say if it was pointed out that he couldn’t possibly play football the night before he died? Would that even connect in their mind?
I really can’t figure these folks out.

 

[SugarQueen]

My iPad is freaking out so please excuse the multiple posts.
Maybe I’m just more sensitive to the lies because it all sounds like things my BIL and his kids would say. When caught in a stupid, senseless lie I asked why he lied. He simply said he lies sometime, sometimes a lot, no real reason.

 

[Sooty]

I do wonder how they would react if a few of the obvious lies were pointed out to them. I mean what would they say if it was pointed out that he couldn’t possibly play football the night before he died? Would that even connect in their mind?
I really can’t figure these folks out.

I was really, in the main, referring and reacting to Dawn's given evidence today. Sorry I did not make myself clear. The statement evidence (about playing football) from Abigail was corrected by her in a subsequent statement I believe. I'm sure they will be examined in more detail when she takes the stand, if she does.

 

[beatrixpotter]

I was trying to work out why this article was dated 22nd June (tomorrow) but then I realised it was 1918 (100 years ago!)

This kind of offence had been too prevalent in recent years, much too prevalent. Having regard to the circumstances, he should pass the very lenient sentence of 3 months’ imprisonment in the second division.

On hearing the sentence, the prisoner screamed, threw up her hands, and was carried out of Court in a fainting condition.

Trying to conceal the body of a new-born is a serious offence

Wow. 3 months is indeed a very light sentence. None of it addresses whether the baby was alive when born either.

I have to admit, regarding the article linked above for the women with 4 babies she concealed, I just find it impossible to believe she had 4 stillborn babies. I knew women who had unassisted pregnancies and births for many children. It is not remotely normal to have 4 children with congenital defects that die before birth like that. Even without medical care or assistance the overwhelming majority of babies survive birth. Or in the case or alcoholics kids are often born with FAS. But FOUR children developed enough to make it near term BUT die before birth AND she has no apparent complications during labor and delivery carrying and delivering dead babies?? It's just way too far fetched for me....