UK UK - Richard Okorogheye, 19, Oxford Student, Ladbroke Grove, West London, 24 March 2021

Discussion in 'Missing Persons Discussion' started by lalalemon, Mar 29, 2021.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Coconutty

    Coconutty Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    632
    Trophy Points:
    83
    As a CEV group 4 person RO would have received his first vaccination and very likely to have by now received his second one too. I have friends in that area who are under 50 with no health issues who had theirs a couple of weeks ago as they are ahead on them.

    He might not feel at risk from covid anymore so that might not be his motivation to get an Uber/ cab. MOO.
     


  2. Commoner

    Commoner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,490
    Trophy Points:
    93
    This is the letter with the advice given to clinically extremely vulnerable people (wef 1 April)

    https://assets.publishing.service.g...y_vulnerable_letter__guidance_from_010421.pdf

    Yes, he'd have had the jab and his second one would be falling die about now. But irrespective if vaccination, the advice was not to alter your behaviour and to continue with social distancing, and to meet as few people as possible. Good ventilation is specifically mentioned.

    Now, he can get away during his mother's shifts without her knowing. He may have done this before? But he might not have wanted to break all the guidance under which he has been living.

    It's not quite like a healthy person getting their vaccine and deciding to ignore the guidance for them, something which is already considerably more expansive than for the deshielded.

    But of course this is all just speculation. I agree that it's entirely possible that he had a different reason for travelling this way.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
    dotr, NorthernSoul, tedtink and 5 others like this.
  3. Skigh

    Skigh Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,624
    Likes Received:
    20,025
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Thanks very much for the detailed information about the position of cameras in the area. If Richard did meet someone ,their arrival should be captured on one of the cameras too.
     
    Al Ka, Legally Bland, dotr and 7 others like this.
  4. Ironside

    Ironside Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,958
    Likes Received:
    3,510
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It seems far too complicated a journey for a bit of weed and it doesn’t explain why there has been no sign of him since. It’s incredibly easy to get weed online these days people sell it on Instagram etc. so a journey to a forest doesn’t make any sense.

    I think sadly that he intentionally went to the forest to harm himself and that’s why there has been no sign of him since. I hope his parent’s get answers soon.
     
  5. JuicyLucy

    JuicyLucy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    223
    Likes Received:
    1,987
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I think the previous poster meant that he might have avoided public transport because, as a young black guy, he was statistically more likely than average to get stopped and searched, and if he were to be carrying something more than ibuprofen that would possibly lead to complications he might not be able to hide from his mother and his night-time wanderings might have to stop. All hypothetical of course.

    The point is that taking a taxi instead of a tube, while on the face of it nonsensical, might have had a fairly simple explanation.
     
    Al Ka, Sundried, dotr and 9 others like this.
  6. tedtink

    tedtink Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,316
    Likes Received:
    11,384
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Agree.
    Public transport is much quieter now during covid, which draws more attention to those who MAY be going OT or making their way to a trap house, taxi's are apparently being used to outwit LE.
    Not saying this is the case with RO - Just speculating as he'd still be a victim imo
    JMO
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
  7. Pimlipo

    Pimlipo Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    49
    Likes Received:
    416
    Trophy Points:
    53
    For what it’s worth I agree with you, sadly. Just thinking of a possible other reason, in hope maybe.
     
    Al Ka, Marg from Oz, dotr and 2 others like this.
  8. Tortoise

    Tortoise Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    17,479
    Likes Received:
    67,899
    Trophy Points:
    113
    There are other entrances to the forest before Loughton. It seems to be too specific a location for me to think he chose that particular destination as a random place to self harm. If he was trying to avoid cctv he didn't seem to be looking out for any on the pub where he was caught on cctv. Also he would know his taxi fare would show up on his bank account. I think it seems more likely it was a meeting point, either in the forest close to the drop off point, or at a house very close by.
     
  9. mrazda71

    mrazda71 Human bean

    Messages:
    2,781
    Likes Received:
    8,831
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Suicide was my initial thought too but ... despite drones, dogs and horses, he's still not been found so ... that leaves me wondering.
     
    Sundried, V347, MrsWatson and 9 others like this.
  10. annpats

    annpats Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    299
    Likes Received:
    1,725
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Exactly my thoughts too.
     
    sundaaaay, Marg from Oz, dotr and 4 others like this.
  11. tedtink

    tedtink Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,316
    Likes Received:
    11,384
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'm sure there's so much info not being released as per the norm.

    If he had been doing a drop one would have thought that the taxi would have waited and RO would have returned to it after a few minutes?
    Perhaps he didn't or he's gone into a house nearby, which would make sense too.
    Usually locals would have an inkling if there's a trap house nearby, although most do go under the radar.
    Even Air BnB's are used now for a couple of days for more sophisticated set ups.
    It'd be interesting to know what info the "Taxi driver" gave - if the taxi is genuine and not one specifically set up for going OT.


    I can't help but think RO has been manipulated or forced into something bigger than himself, sadly, after listening to his Ma and Pa again, but I could be totally wrong on the above.

    JMO
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
    sundaaaay, Marg from Oz, dotr and 3 others like this.
  12. Sarahlou

    Sarahlou Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,514
    Likes Received:
    8,451
    Trophy Points:
    113
    They used dogs and drones to search the woods for Richard Morris and he still wasn't found until 4 months later. So you can never be sure.
     
    easynic150, Al Ka, Ironside and 12 others like this.
  13. Commoner

    Commoner Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,490
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Al Ka, elliefant, sundaaaay and 2 others like this.
  14. infinit

    infinit Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    398
    Likes Received:
    2,211
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I think the lack of other confirmed sightings says a lot, he didn't exactly go into the forest with a 100L rucksack on his back well equipped to spend a few weeks living rough - He'd need food and would have had to have visited somewhere for supplies etc by now. It's been a bank holiday and it has been dry so people have been in the forest alongside the Police - I'm almost comfortable saying he is not alive in that forest at this point.

    It doesn't appear he could get out of the immediate area without being picked up. This logically to me suggests one of:
    1. He didn't enter the forest and entered a local property
    2. He passed through the forest towards the M25 or Enfield
    3. He went into the forest and is deceased
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
    Ironside, Sundried, Kasmeer and 11 others like this.
  15. ApparentlyInDenial

    ApparentlyInDenial Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    371
    Likes Received:
    2,267
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I feel like the whole county lines/"going cunch" idea has been missing from much of our discussion. So without further evidence, a lot of this post is just MOO and hypothetical, but worth thinking about.

    Some latest stats on county lines targetting trends:
    SOURCE Rescue and Response County Lines Project, London Government (https://www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/rescue_recovery_year_2_sa_-_sept_2020.pdf)

    - 82% male
    - 45.9% black
    - 61% no prior gang involvement
    - 10% at least 1 disability (gangs known to target disabilities)
    - 63 people in Royal Borough of Kensington & Chelsea (RBKC), wher RO lives, with suspected link to county lines operations
    - Recruitment has shifted to West from South London in last year

    Biggest (relevant) destinations *:

    - Cambridge the 2nd biggest
    - Ipswich the 7th biggest
    - Northampton the 9th biggest

    Overall:

    - If arrested/leave early there is a concept of debt bondage
    - CL missing people are away for longer periods during lockdown, due to demands and nature of drug market
    - Violence/threats of violence against the individual and family are used to enforce "bondage" and keep them working
    - Primary use of Wickr & Telegram to communicate operations, Snapchat & Instagram for online recruitment
    - Local recruitment more prevalent than previous, gangs and estates in the area where gang leaders are based, friends from former schools, etc.
    - All of the areas of contextual safeguarding from exploitation for RO seemed weak of late - family, peers, school, neighbourhood (as for many of us but possibly hardest for young adults and teenagers)
    - Services like Uber are provided regularly to county lines runners, as is food from takeaway delivery services, etc. This is noted by many polices forces, charities, newspapers.

    (NOTE I have some training on geographic targeting, and the psychology of geography. The following is JMO but also just my professional opinion)

    * These cities are relevant because RO was last seen close to the M11 in a geographically relevant way. If he was meeting someone to go to Hertfordshire or Buckinghamshire county lines, the pickup place would have likely been Barnet or Watford areas. If he was going for south county lines, Brighton etc., the pickup would have more likely been the wider Croydon area, or possibly Richmond.

    It wouldn't make sense for someone picking him up to travel around the M25 to junction 27 then switch to the M11 then off into the Loughton area. If someone does that regularly they are noticed, and anyway the county lines operations tend to operate in relatively straight lines.

    If this theory is correct, the towns that RO - or a hypothetical person in a similar situation - would currently be operating in or around are:

    - Cambridge, Ipswich, Peterborough, Norwich
    - Harlow, Chelmsford, Colchester.

    If hypothetically RO has gone for county lines, these are the towns the police should be looking into.


    Remember that stat above - Cambridge and Ipswich are both in the top ten destinations for county lines operations. Cambridge is no. 2 nationwide.

    Epping Forest area is widely known in law enforcement as a county lines hot zone. Just two years ago there was a huge police operation that ended with 24 arrests. That's one example. It's a gateway in and out of London because of the motorway exit points, the public transport from central London, the easy roads from central London, the quiet and dark. It's a perfect place for sophisticated criminality.

    ---

    A few interesting MSM articles about what it's like in a county lines op, and what happens if you try to leave:

    "At the start of last year, a 16-year-old north Londoner, Boy X, found himself in a terrifying situation. He owed a drug dealer £55 and did not have the funds to pay off the debt.

    He was told the cannabis debt would double – and keep doubling – if he failed to pay. But the teenager was offered a way out: he could work for the dealer and his associates.

    Boy X was informed by the dealer he was going to be driven somewhere and packed some clothes and a games console into his bag.

    I thought I’d be with him around London,” he said. “I got in the car and he said, ‘You’re going to be going somewhere far,’ but he wasn’t telling me where. I said, ‘My mum and dad don’t know’ and he said, ‘I don’t care, you have to go.’ I wasn’t really asking questions."

    ‘I agreed because I was scared’: boy, 16, on county lines ordeal

    "Young people are being provided with taxis via apps (such as Uber, Bolt and Kapten) in order to make longer journeys."
    https://www.safeguardingchildren.co.../08/County-Lines-after-COVID-a-new-threat.pdf

    "A string of suspected drug dealing gangs have been shut down by Essex Police with the arrest of 24 people during a day of action in Epping Forest District."
    Five gangs targeted and 24 arrested in dawn drug raids

    "Drugs and weapons including two crossbows have been seized and five arrests made in the latest police crackdown on county lines and criminal exploitation."
    Drugs and weapons seized in the latest police crackdown on county lines and criminal exploitation

    "County Lines: More than 4,000 Londoners identified in drugs gangs"
    County Lines: More than 4,000 Londoners identified in drugs gangs

    "County lines: Teenage drug dealers posed as key workers during lockdown" 30 Sep 2020
    County lines: Teenage drug dealers posed as key workers during lockdown

    "Mum's warning as son tortured by drugs gang has boiling water poured on hands

    Ben McCloughlin's mum Louise shared injury pictures to warn other parents of the dangers of county lines drug gangs, after her 20-year-old was kidnapped for wanting to leave the group he joined just two weeks before"

    Mum's warning as son tortured by drugs gang has boiling water poured on hands

    "Now aged 19, Kate became involved in county lines dealing when she was 14, dealing heroin and crack. Excluded from school, she ended up in a pupil referral unit, where she says she learned more about “going cunch” or “OT” (out there), as county lines dealing is known

    She says she ran drugs all over the UK, from London to Basingstoke, or Cambridge and Oxford. She would be driven out to the countryside and left to operate from someone’s house while she dealt drugs – a practice known as “cuckooing”."

    ‘Once you get in, it’s hard to get out’: county lines drug dealer on how she almost died
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
  16. tedtink

    tedtink Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,316
    Likes Received:
    11,384
    Trophy Points:
    113
    [/QUOTE]


    I'd like to add the runners and those who work in the bando's are victims..........

    County lines gangsters are buying taxis to deal drugs in bid to outwit police during lockdown


    County lines gangsters are buying taxis to deal drugs in bid to outwit police during lockdown

    "The successes were the result of new tactics and the coronavirus lockdown prompting criminals to switch to riskier tactics, because child drug runners travelling from the capital could no longer blend into the crowd on busy trains and coaches.

    Country lines is a model of distributing drugs, sending them from bigger cities to smaller towns and rural areas. Users call a mobile phone and order their drugs. Drug dealers often believe the use of anonymous pay-as-you-go mobile phones, which do not have to be registered, protects them from detection."

    Met police hails success in county lines drugs crackdown



    "Pinkney has seen Instagram posts telling young people if they have accounts with three specific banks to message them their bank details to make “easy money”. They are told they will get a £10,000 cheque in their bank, a gift amount that does not have to be declared to HMRC, and they get to keep about £3,000"
    Airbnb and a free lunch: how county lines drug gangs lure teenagers
     
  17. proclee

    proclee Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    49
    Likes Received:
    337
    Trophy Points:
    53
    The county lines aspect doesn’t seem feasible at all. If he’s been shielding for a year and never gone missing before it’s highly unlikely that he’d manage to get himself into that scenario at this point in the pandemic and at this point in his life in general.
    Also Richards disappearance has created a fair bit of media attention especially in the last 4/5 days, the person in control of that “county line” would of got him out of there days ago! The last thing they would want is the police managing to track him all the way to where they’re running their “business” he would of been told to go home, say he was at a friends and likely threatened to not mention them or the truth. JMO
     
  18. ApparentlyInDenial

    ApparentlyInDenial Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    371
    Likes Received:
    2,267
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Oh my lord. And if it's a young kid in particular they're relatively easy prey.
     
  19. ApparentlyInDenial

    ApparentlyInDenial Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    371
    Likes Received:
    2,267
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Points taken, though I'd say one thing. When shielding ended last year, then restarted again, a lot of shielders didn't take it as seriously as the first time round. JMO based on what I've seen people I know do.
     
  20. tedtink

    tedtink Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,316
    Likes Received:
    11,384
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Fair point, but we don't know that he hasn't left his room at night before.

    These gangs are ruthless, do you think they'd really let him go alive?

    JMO
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice