Found Deceased UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #10

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by tesni, Mar 5, 2021.

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  1. Miss_French

    Miss_French Well-Known Member

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    If an off duty police officer shows their warrant card and declares they are a police officer, they are then on duty. They don't have to be in uniform or on shift to be on duty.
     
  2. ApparentlyInDenial

    ApparentlyInDenial Well-Known Member

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  3. MancGuy Uk

    MancGuy Uk Well-Known Member

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    with the doors open though she could still shout and scream it's horrific to think all this happened 3 minutes after she was insight of a police car cam footage
     
  4. Tothemoon22

    Tothemoon22 Active Member

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    Whether she lived alone or not, support bubble or not, it is not against any rules to be walking outside at any time.
     
  5. sundaaaay

    sundaaaay Well-Known Member

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    I suppose it depends if he stopped on Poynders road or Rodenhurst. Poynders would require hazard lights because it’s busier but Rodenhurdt not so much. I happen to think the hazard lights is significant and there being no reason to draw attention to himself so is likely part of a ploy to get her to sit in the car.
     
  6. wackyw

    wackyw Well-Known Member

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    I'm a bloke and I wouldn't put myself in a vulnerable position with someone who just flashes a warrant card, I don't even know what a real one looks like never mind a fake one. Even a lone policeman in uniform I would be more than wary.
     
  7. davidattenborough

    davidattenborough Well-Known Member

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    Found it:

    'His charge sheet alleges he "unlawfully and by force took or carried away Sarah Everard against her will".' - it's from the Daily Mirror's account of court proceedings today. The fact it's in quotation marks suggests it's a direct transcription of the charge sheet. As a reminder, UK definition of kidnap is "to take by force or by fraud" - the fact the charge sheet specifically states she was taken "by force" seems to me to rule out that she was taken by fraud - ie, she wasn't coerced or tricked into getting into the car - she was physically forced into it.

    This makes sense to me. He's a bulky, muscular guy, and she's a slight woman - he'd have no need to come up with some detailed plan about how to convince her to get in the car - much easier, and quicker, just to physically force her in there. As someone else has pointed out, it'd be over in seconds. As they say, the simplest explanations are usually the correct ones.

    To me that fully answers the question of how she got in the car - he put her there.

    Link: Police officer accused of abducting and murdering Sarah Everard appears in court
     
  8. asyousay

    asyousay Well-Known Member

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    As I have proven already you can legally be stopped and questioned if the police believe you are breaking lock down laws. Prove me wrong if you can as you can’t. The rules are quite clear on this matter.
     
  9. Herat

    Herat Way out West

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    Am I correct that the bus camera that caught the footage of the car with the two door open would have been in the front of the bus, facing the way the driver faces - correct?

    She is walking east on Poynder and it seems most logical that she is on the north side of the street. I'm not really seeing too many homes that would appear to have doorbell cams on the north side, they tend to be more on the south side. And it would be difficult to have a really clear view of her from across the street, especially with scattered passing cars. I guess it would be her green jacket, dark pants, and green shoes that might be more identifiable.

    It appears most likely he is also traveling east on Poynder, which would mean he is traveling parallel (or behind her). There is a wide driveway without a curb exactly at the Poyner Court bin enclosure that was intensely searched this week, and he could have fully pulled the car out of the street onto that driveway, not in the traffic lane.

    A bus going east down Poynder would catch the vehicle from behind, and the license plate would be possible to read, as well as the two open doors. She would have been to the left of the vehicle, and camera might have been able to see the top of her green jacket.

    If the bus was going west, the opposite way, it would be farther from the car, and it might have been a bit more difficult to be sure the passenger door was open.

    On the opposite side of the street, there is no curb-cut or driveway to divert the vehicle into without impinging on the street. Both open doors would probably impeded traffic, including a following bus.

    I think that whatever happened did happen at that driveway and bin enclosure on the north side of the street.

    So why did LE keep going back to Agnes Riley park across the street, at least 3 times before doing the big search across the street?
     
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  10. arrogantcat

    arrogantcat Well-Known Member

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    ah yes, but who’s committing those crimes against the 60% of male victims? Other men.

    If the common denominator in so many crimes was a profession (eg policing) or even a race, I feel like people would be much quicker to name the problem.

    The vast, vast majority of all violent crime is committed by men, and we have zero policies, processes, educational programmes or tools designed to actually try and address that fact.
     
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  11. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    But then he's holding the badge, and he'd hardly want to drop that while he grabs her. And she's watching him, so not taken by surprise.

    To me, it's more likely she was grabbed just as she had walked past, and had her back to him.

    The builders bag could have sat open on the back seat: throw her on it and pull tight.

    The side door open because he's doing something inside, on that side of the car.
     
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  12. Lincolnshirelad

    Lincolnshirelad Well-Known Member

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    In London you get all kinds of unmarked / uncover police. I have friends who have worked like this - usually around the time a big event is on or they have intel on something happening.

    I used to install large video screens in shopping centres - I dont need to go into big details but we triggered an alarm going into the wrong service yard and within minutes I was pinned to the floor by 2 officers in plain clothes. I always remember this because most attending officers were in plain clothes. Similar time we also drove down one of the restricted roads (with full authority to do so) and the car that pulled us over was unmarked and plain clothed officers that showed their badge.

    Its not uncommon to see them.
     
  13. Juliet B

    Juliet B Well-Known Member

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    Most of social media claiming it was a peaceful gathering until the police decided to start dispersing people. No matter who was in the wrong, the images of male police officers being physically aggressive towards women at a gathering to mark violence against a woman by a male police officer are shocking.
    I think Cressida Dick will lose her job over this.
     
  14. JosieJo

    JosieJo Well-Known Member

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    Although I do not think she got into the car willingly ..even for a few seconds..the charge kidnap by force does not rule it out.

    We would not know at what point the "by force" occurred
     
  15. sundaaaay

    sundaaaay Well-Known Member

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    Now that I think about it, another thing that could have occurred is that he deliberately drove into the kerb near her and she stopped to see if he was ok. Could explain the interest in the forensics on the kerb. He could also then be apologetic and offer a lift home. Just MOO
     
  16. MariaMac

    MariaMac Active Member

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    That’s a really good reminder of the language used. Thank you. Changes my speculation about possible use of something like a taser in the car. Perhaps if there is doorcam footage (edited to add that am not sure there was door cam footage as haven’t seen it mentioned again) this might show she did try to get help and was pulled away.
     
  17. davidattenborough

    davidattenborough Well-Known Member

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    With respect to Sarah's friend, and to you, I disagree. Of course the person who murdered SE is the only one responsible for it, that goes without saying. But the culture in which that murderer lives, the culture and society in which women don't feel safe to walk the streets, or go for a night out, or walk to their cars alone, or take their dogs for a walk after dark, or walk to the end of their drive at 10pm to put the bins out, or turn down a stranger's advances, or to be impolite to a strange man, or to travel on public transport alone, or to trust somebody who says they're a policeman - that's a different matter entirely.
     
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  18. JosieJo

    JosieJo Well-Known Member

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    Why would an officer believe she was breaking a rule in this instance?
     
  19. PomPom123

    PomPom123 Well-Known Member

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    Are you referring to (an) unsolved murder(s) in East Sussex?
     
  20. Lancs1234

    Lancs1234 New Member

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    What was totally inappropriate, was the police's handling of a peaceful vigil in Sarah’s memory.
     
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