UK UK - Suzy Lamplugh, 25, Fulham, 28 Jul 1986 #2

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I thought it might be interesting to see where everyone is with SJL actually being at Shorrolds road.
1. Who believes she went there?
2. Who believes she never went there?
 
I thought it might be interesting to see where everyone is with SJL actually being at Shorrolds road.
1. Who believes she went there?
2. Who believes she never went there?
I have strong doubts that she went to Shorrolds Road, a large part due to the fact I am far from convinced that it was her who made the relevant diary entry as I think that there is a handwriting style discrepancy between that entry and the one lower down the page, the fact that apparently there was no regular estate agency card written out for this appointment and the seemingly baffling choice of client name if Suzy was trying to cover an against-the-rules absence from the office.
 
I have strong doubts that she went to Shorrolds Road, a large part due to the fact I am far from convinced that it was her who made the relevant diary entry as I think that there is a handwriting style discrepancy between that entry and the one lower down the page, the fact that apparently there was no regular estate agency card written out for this appointment and the seemingly baffling choice of client name if Suzy was trying to cover an against-the-rules absence from the office.
I recall recently seeing a new member whose area of expertise is handwriting, if they’re reading this maybe they’d like to help?
 
Yes thats correct

Andrew Stephens Book 'The Suzy Lamplugh Story' is also a must read.
Ive just finished reading, very interesting, the question to be asked is why not search the POW, I know it could be answered with compelling evidence needed etc, but was there any for the searches of the former home of JD's mother, no evidence led them there .
 
An innocent person wouldn’t try to cover up an accident or death though, surely?
Not unless there was something weird going on in their heads, like thinking 'oops, there goes my career in pub management'. While bizarre, it isn't all that more bizarre than a spontaneous sex attack.

What DV has not established is whether the pub was actually closed at 1pm. If it were, it adds credibility to the idea that something happened there. CV was bar staff, KF was kitchen staff, and there was a cellarman; that was it. If it was open, and there were people in the bar drinking, there's nobody there at liberty to assault anyone. CV would have been behind the bar.
I thought it might be interesting to see where everyone is with SJL actually being at Shorrolds road.
1. Who believes she went there?
2. Who believes she never went there?

I am more at 90% she did not go there. She was not sighted there by HR, who just said he had a 5-second glance at the back of a blonde woman's head. There is considerable doubt as to how blonde she was. We have a photo of what she looked like the previous Saturday night; even allowing for lighting, how 'blonde' was that?


She's blonder here, but the rest of the family are gingery blonde, and it's an old photo:


All subsequent sightings were after the police had stated she went there and appealed for "further" sightings of her.

If the police had said she was seen outside 37SR with Ronald McDonald, and had anybody seen that, something similar would have happened. There would have been witnesses who claimed to have seen her being bundled into the Noddy Car by a tall man with a ginger wig, red nose, stripy blue trousers and long red shoes.

The first exaggerated report of imagined events seems to have happened the very same day with the MG/HR account of her seen being bundled into a van. This was sheepishly withdrawn.
 
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I think that there is a handwriting style discrepancy between that entry and the one lower down the page

Interesting, but other things could explain that innocently. My handwriting changes if I'm sitting down at a desk, versus standing up writing, with a phone in the other hand. It also changes if my hand is resting on the middle of the page versus hanging off the bottom.
 
I have strong doubts that she went to Shorrolds Road, a large part due to the fact I am far from convinced that it was her who made the relevant diary entry as I think that there is a handwriting style discrepancy between that entry and the one lower down the page, the fact that apparently there was no regular estate agency card written out for this appointment and the seemingly baffling choice of client name if Suzy was trying to cover an against-the-rules absence from the office.

Try and have a look at the line directly above the Kipper entry. I am interested if you can make out what it says.
Im not too concerned if its an impression from a previous page as in my opinion that would make it a Saturday entry.
 
One thing I am finding fustrating is not having Google street walk and satellite for the year of the crime.

Detectives said no one saw her after she walked out of Sturgis door. It made me think did the office have a back door?


Satellite images only appear to go back to 2008
 
A couple was seen standing outside 37 Shorrolds Road, and a couple was seen sitting in Bishops Park. Where were the other sightings of a couple?
 
A couple was seen standing outside 37 Shorrolds Road, and a couple was seen sitting in Bishops Park. Where were the other sightings of a couple?
Off the top of my head (and I’m already forgetting stuff):

BW sighting in the Fiesta on Fulham Palace Road
MJ sighting outside the house (123?) on Stevenage Road
Jogger sighting arguing/laughing in BMW near Bishop’s Park
James Galway ‘right ruck’ sighting

Any more?
 
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I have strong doubts that she went to Shorrolds Road, a large part due to the fact I am far from convinced that it was her who made the relevant diary entry as I think that there is a handwriting style discrepancy between that entry and the one lower down the page, the fact that apparently there was no regular estate agency card written out for this appointment and the seemingly baffling choice of client name if Suzy was trying to cover an against-the-rules absence from the office.
Handwriting very much looks the same. Compare the formation of individual letters.

I think it is important to have valid reasons for discounting the evidence that does exist.

It's all very well suggesting other hypotheses for what may have happened, but it is essential to have some evidence that supports it, if is to be considered a legitimate line of enquiry.

We can all think up pie in the sky possibilities but if nothing gives it any credibility then we are just on a fishing trip without a rod or bait.

There was a diary entry, there was 'witness' evidence, much of which is likely to be unreliable, and there is a SJL's found car. Potential suspects have been ruled out, except for one, JC....and the circumstantial evidence is significant.....but is is limited in the public domain.

IMO the only way of possibly solving this case is to find SJL and that will need very good cause to go searching somewhere.
 
What DV has not established is whether the pub was actually closed at 1pm. If it were, it adds credibility to the idea that something happened there. CV was bar staff, KF was kitchen staff, and there was a cellarman; that was it. If it was open, and there were people in the bar drinking, there's nobody there at liberty to assault anyone. CV would have been behind the bar.
This is the problem I have - the info from the stocktaker and ZH in the DV book both suggest that it was open. The stocktaker makes the point that they would go in early so as to be finished before twelve for the pub to open as normal at lunchtime - otherwise the brewery/pubco is losing revenue.
 
Off the top of my head (and I’m already forgetting stuff):

BW sighting in the Fiesta on Fulham Palace Road
MJ sighting outside the house (123?) on Stevenage Road
Jogger sighting arguing/laughing in BMW near Bishop’s Park
James Galway ‘right ruck’ sighting

Any more?

A van driver said he has to swerve to avoid a car coming straight towards him with an arguing couple in it.

Ive been searching for the video I saw this in, Im sure it was in a reconstruction but Im darned if I can find it. From memory it didnt say which road or time, but Ive noticed on a reconstruction that there is a white van double parked a door or 2 up from 37 shorrolds its also visible when one of the witnesses (cellar man or jeweller) was crossing the road and passes the female and champagne carrying man. I wondered if the vehicle had some significance but the police were choosing not to disclose it.
 
Off the top of my head (and I’m already forgetting stuff):

BW sighting in the Fiesta on Fulham Palace Road
MJ sighting outside the house (123?) on Stevenage Road
Jogger sighting arguing/laughing in BMW near Bishop’s Park
James Galway ‘right ruck’ sighting

Any more?
l guess the couple was looking for SJL - Shorrolds Rd, Bishops Park and heading towards Putney before heading along Fulham Palace Rd and Stevenage Rd for something
 
What are your thoughts on offering a reward... a big one?
Rewards are a useful for encouraging information from people 'in the know', when seeking critical information about current high profile serious offences and on the basis that it leads to arrest and conviction.

I don't think for one moment that a reward to find Suzy, after so long, when the offender most likely worked alone, would achieve anything tangible and only succeed in encouraging a lot of well-meaning and some slightly off-the-wall individuals who give locations with little or no basis for their assertions.
 
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Rewards are a useful for encouraging information from people 'in the know', when seeking critical information about current high profile serious offences and on the basis that it leads to arrest and conviction.

I don't think for one moment that a reward to find Suzy, after so long, when the offender most likely worked alone, would achieve anything tangible and only succeed in encouraging a lot of well-meaning and some slightly off-the-wall individuals who give locations with little or no basis for their assertions.

The police aren't going to to go digging holes unless they have corroborating evidence and if they have absolute confidence in the evidence they have gathered they aren't going to let anyone send them on a wild goose chase.

I don't see they have anything to loose by offering a reward.
I don't think it will happen as we all know they think they have their man and as DL said 'They arent looking for anyone else'

It will probably be a considerable number of years into the future before what really happened comes to light.

I am 100% convinced that the the answers to SJL disappearance lies on evidence gathered in the early days and is documented on the card index system which are now in storage.
 
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Off the top of my head (and I’m already forgetting stuff):

BW sighting in the Fiesta on Fulham Palace Road
MJ sighting outside the house (123?) on Stevenage Road
Jogger sighting arguing/laughing in BMW near Bishop’s Park

James Galway ‘right ruck’ sighting

Any more?
The MJ was of a man only I think. The jogger sighting came in fourteen years later, IIRC.

The James Galway sighting is the only one of a woman being seen near where SJL's car was found. It's also at second-hand because of course it was a cabbie who reported James Galway who reported a couple arguing, and James Galway never came forward.

With sightings of SJL's car I am inclined to work back from its definite final whereabouts. The remoter from that time the sighting, the less reliable it may be. So the 5pm sighting by the garage owner seems quite reliable, because he came in from work and presumably followed a routine that enabled him to say when he saw it. The 4pm "non-sighting" from the BT workers mullers this, but may just bespeak a lack of observation. WJ's supposed 12.45 sighting I tend to group with the schoolboy's 12 noon sighting as indicating these were a different but similar vehicle, as both are sightings before she left the office. BW's 2.45 sighting is for me undermined by the claim to have been able to see the hat on the back parcel shelf - from in front of the car, on the opposite side of the road.

As has been said before this disappearance is like trying to complete a jigsaw puzzle where many bits are missing, others from other jigsaws are mixed and you don't have the box lid.
 
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