anthrobones
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Thanks for posting the site link. Glad it is up again.
UT UT - St George, Wht/NtvMale 15-17, 692UMUT, in cave, DOD 1914-1925, 13th rib, smoker, Dec'98
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Interesting remarks. Initially I also had the impression that this individual had been entombed, but the scene is more suggestive of a camp site than a crypt. I posit that it's possible that the individual had died of natural causes in the cave, was later discovered by someone who then piled rocks at the entrance so that the stranger's final resting place would not be disturbed. In the then sparsely populated southwest it wasn't that unusual to find dead bodies in the desert and more often than not the only action taken in such an occurrence was to bury the body, maybe leave a makeshift cross to mark the grave, and move on.gardenmom said:
Another, more cruel theory, is that the individual was suffering from a contagious disease (the lung infection, which may have been a consequence of the Spanish Flu) and was placed in this remote cave by townsfolk fearing contamination. Once sealed the existence of the cave faded from memory.
Bluecat
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It notes that he was mostly Caucasian with some Native features...if he did die, maybe he wanted to follow a Native burial custom? I know that the Navajo tradition is to take the person out into the desert and put them somewhere isolated, and then tell no one where the gravesite is located. The practice stems from a belief that, after death, all that remains is an evil spirit (the good part goes somewhere else). The practice keeps the evil ghost from coming after the family, etc. If he was working on a mine, or something like that and told someone his wishes - they may not have been carried out perfectly but only as well as the person could do so. I just have to think that if it was a camp, there would have been a canteen, which would not have disintegrated or blown away.
Excellent points Bluecat, imho so far this theory is the one that makes the most sense.
A few observations however: one is the absence of traditional Navajo artifacts at the site. In order to explain this one could theorize that some Navajos found the dead body in the desert and disposed of it in this fashion because it was their custom. This would make sense if the man had died a few decades earlier than his estimated time of of death but in the early 20th century the town of St.George was already developed and most likely if someone (Native or otherwise) had found a dead body lying that close to town that someone would have notified the local sheriff.
Another theory regarding the absence of Navajo artifacts could be that the man, while not considered a Navajo himself, could have been regarded by them as a next of kin because of his mixed parentage and as such would have been buried according to their ritual. But then again, why so close to town?
When I first read the story it reminded me of what I had read about the people who pioneered the so-called "Oregon Trail" in the 19th century. For those who don't know what the Oregon Trail was it was the route followed by early settlers travelling in oxen-pulled chuckwagons from the Mississippi valley to the west coast.
The jouney's death rate was horrendous and many of these settlers never made it to the Pacific. Some were killed by Indians but most of the casualties were the result of accidents and illness. Casualties were buried in shallow graves right beside the trail but sometimes when it became evident that an individual was nearing death and that being hauled in a crude wagon was only worsening the suffering, other members of the party would try to find a relatively comfortable spot where the person would be laid with a few blankets and left to await the inevitable, which usually came pretty swiftly. In many places water was scarce and precious to the living so none was left at the scene.
Gauged with modern ethics this may sound like a cruel and heartless practice, but it was dictated by the survival instinct. Stopping on the trail for a couple of days to wait for someone to pass away could mean getting caught by winter in the mountains. Ask the Donner party about it.
So my first fleeting impression was that something similar had happened to this young man but on second thought this made little sense considering that there was a town nearby and that by the time this man died wagon trails had long been replaced by coast-to-coast railroads.
So what's the story? Indian burial? Self entombment? Makeshift "clinic"? Innocent camper victim of a sudden and immediately fatal illness? Murder followed by (sucessful) attempt to hide the body? There also is the possibility that the rocks at the entrance of the cave may have been put in place some time after the man's death and that this factor is not directly related to the event.
It's more puzzling than it first appeared!
A few observations however: one is the absence of traditional Navajo artifacts at the site. In order to explain this one could theorize that some Navajos found the dead body in the desert and disposed of it in this fashion because it was their custom. This would make sense if the man had died a few decades earlier than his estimated time of of death but in the early 20th century the town of St.George was already developed and most likely if someone (Native or otherwise) had found a dead body lying that close to town that someone would have notified the local sheriff.
Another theory regarding the absence of Navajo artifacts could be that the man, while not considered a Navajo himself, could have been regarded by them as a next of kin because of his mixed parentage and as such would have been buried according to their ritual. But then again, why so close to town?
When I first read the story it reminded me of what I had read about the people who pioneered the so-called "Oregon Trail" in the 19th century. For those who don't know what the Oregon Trail was it was the route followed by early settlers travelling in oxen-pulled chuckwagons from the Mississippi valley to the west coast.
The jouney's death rate was horrendous and many of these settlers never made it to the Pacific. Some were killed by Indians but most of the casualties were the result of accidents and illness. Casualties were buried in shallow graves right beside the trail but sometimes when it became evident that an individual was nearing death and that being hauled in a crude wagon was only worsening the suffering, other members of the party would try to find a relatively comfortable spot where the person would be laid with a few blankets and left to await the inevitable, which usually came pretty swiftly. In many places water was scarce and precious to the living so none was left at the scene.
Gauged with modern ethics this may sound like a cruel and heartless practice, but it was dictated by the survival instinct. Stopping on the trail for a couple of days to wait for someone to pass away could mean getting caught by winter in the mountains. Ask the Donner party about it.
So my first fleeting impression was that something similar had happened to this young man but on second thought this made little sense considering that there was a town nearby and that by the time this man died wagon trails had long been replaced by coast-to-coast railroads.
So what's the story? Indian burial? Self entombment? Makeshift "clinic"? Innocent camper victim of a sudden and immediately fatal illness? Murder followed by (sucessful) attempt to hide the body? There also is the possibility that the rocks at the entrance of the cave may have been put in place some time after the man's death and that this factor is not directly related to the event.
It's more puzzling than it first appeared!
I have a question about anthropology and genetics that maybe someone here can answer for me. Bear with me here.
I have spent some of the last few years doing geneology research on my husband's paternal side. To look at my husband, he "looks" Italian, which is from his maternal grandmother's side of the family. He lived in AZ for a time, and it's been commented that his features appeared Native American--cheekbones and such.
Interestingly enough to this case, I was able to trace his family back to SWEDEN of all places! Those cheekbones were not Native American, but Nordic. Add to that, after his family came from Sweden, they settled in Utah.
When I saw the bust of the lost boy in the cave, I saw those same features that I see in my husband everyday. From what I understand, a lot of those families moved between Utah and the Illinois/Midwest area. My husband's family settled in Illinois and Wisconsin. That could explain the Marshall Field's connection---the boots could have been bought at an outpost, or brought from family members traveling from the midwest to Utah.
I learned that my husband's ancestors were Mormon. The LDS (Latter Day Saints) geneology site was a wealth of informtion for me. They are extremely conscious of tracking their ancestry.
So, what I'm wondering is . . . . .
1) Could the "Native American" features actually be Nordic?
and
2) I'm wondering if I can find on an LDS site that a family member, male, suddenly came up missing in the early part of the century.
The second one I'll have to work on as I can, but can anyone answer the first for me?
I have spent some of the last few years doing geneology research on my husband's paternal side. To look at my husband, he "looks" Italian, which is from his maternal grandmother's side of the family. He lived in AZ for a time, and it's been commented that his features appeared Native American--cheekbones and such.
Interestingly enough to this case, I was able to trace his family back to SWEDEN of all places! Those cheekbones were not Native American, but Nordic. Add to that, after his family came from Sweden, they settled in Utah.
When I saw the bust of the lost boy in the cave, I saw those same features that I see in my husband everyday. From what I understand, a lot of those families moved between Utah and the Illinois/Midwest area. My husband's family settled in Illinois and Wisconsin. That could explain the Marshall Field's connection---the boots could have been bought at an outpost, or brought from family members traveling from the midwest to Utah.
I learned that my husband's ancestors were Mormon. The LDS (Latter Day Saints) geneology site was a wealth of informtion for me. They are extremely conscious of tracking their ancestry.
So, what I'm wondering is . . . . .
1) Could the "Native American" features actually be Nordic?
and
2) I'm wondering if I can find on an LDS site that a family member, male, suddenly came up missing in the early part of the century.
The second one I'll have to work on as I can, but can anyone answer the first for me?
I highly doubt that this kids has been working too much on the oil rigs in the area. He's just way too small for that, and oil rigs would require the use of both arms, not just one. IMHO, this young man had been working at jobs (maybe without family to care for him) in order to maybe make it to someplace else, such as California. The use of only one arm would be more in line with use of somthing like a hammer, lasso, or tilling with mules or oxen (can be done with only one arm). He could have worked in the railroad building too, but that also required two strong arms.
I checked a map of Utah in 1890's (I am a historian also working on a degree in anthropology). There were no rail lines in the area (although I am sure that changed quickly afterward as one was planned at the time). However, the Spanish trail runs through or very close to St. George, and then out to Nevada and then California. If he was on horseback, he could have rode there in a week or ten days. He could have ridden from the east or north on a stage or rail, then gotten a horse and headed southwest.
My gut tells me that this was a kid north or east of Utah (pretty big range I know) that either new he was sick or had a doctor tell him he was sick. My guess would be from either the Midwest or central Plains -- places where farming or herding was common. If so, the common wisdom of the time was to go to the Southwest (and still is in some cases) to get out of the high humidity. He may have ordered his boots before hand, or kept them for "good" occasions. The same could be said of the other items found as well, if he didn't pick them up along the way.
It would also seem that this was a wintertime death (three blankets and a jacket wouldn't be needed otherwise). Perhaps he knew a snowstorm was coming or he got caught in it, and he huddled up in the cave with his horse nearby to let the storm pass. However, he died in the time between, and his horse could have gotten loose. I believe that there WAS food and such there at one time, or else his flesh would have been gone much faster -- and more bones would have been missing from animal scavaging (sorry to be gross). He appears to have been undisturbed, and at least some of his body had to be uncovered at some point because of the condition of the bones.
This is just my :twocents: , but I honestly don't think that he was working there at the time, he maybe didn't even know a town was close by. Perhaps he left his family to get well, but never made it to his destination. They may have assumed such and then never bothered to find him -- if they weren't sick as well.
I checked a map of Utah in 1890's (I am a historian also working on a degree in anthropology). There were no rail lines in the area (although I am sure that changed quickly afterward as one was planned at the time). However, the Spanish trail runs through or very close to St. George, and then out to Nevada and then California. If he was on horseback, he could have rode there in a week or ten days. He could have ridden from the east or north on a stage or rail, then gotten a horse and headed southwest.
My gut tells me that this was a kid north or east of Utah (pretty big range I know) that either new he was sick or had a doctor tell him he was sick. My guess would be from either the Midwest or central Plains -- places where farming or herding was common. If so, the common wisdom of the time was to go to the Southwest (and still is in some cases) to get out of the high humidity. He may have ordered his boots before hand, or kept them for "good" occasions. The same could be said of the other items found as well, if he didn't pick them up along the way.
It would also seem that this was a wintertime death (three blankets and a jacket wouldn't be needed otherwise). Perhaps he knew a snowstorm was coming or he got caught in it, and he huddled up in the cave with his horse nearby to let the storm pass. However, he died in the time between, and his horse could have gotten loose. I believe that there WAS food and such there at one time, or else his flesh would have been gone much faster -- and more bones would have been missing from animal scavaging (sorry to be gross). He appears to have been undisturbed, and at least some of his body had to be uncovered at some point because of the condition of the bones.
This is just my :twocents: , but I honestly don't think that he was working there at the time, he maybe didn't even know a town was close by. Perhaps he left his family to get well, but never made it to his destination. They may have assumed such and then never bothered to find him -- if they weren't sick as well.
Bumping this for a couple of questions (from anyone that might know, but I suspect Anthrobones would be the most likely):
1. How certain is the assumed years of death range? Could an assumed date of 1925 actually be something like 1934?
2. When determining age, who "sure" are they about this? Could someone be five or so years older -- especially since most of the info in the anthropolgy report states he was not fully developed?
3. What size shoes do you think the boots are? They look between a 8 and 11 to me, but I'm not a great judge of shoe size.
The reason I'm asking is because I found a very interesting case, one that might actually match. I was browsing around Charley Project when I found the case of Everett Ruess, a nature artist that was last known to be in the general area in 1934. My reasons for thinking this JD may be him are:
1. Pictures of Ruess and composites of JD look similar (especially nose, chin, and eye structure)
2. He was last known to be in the area and had some sort of illness that was bothering him (according to letters).
3. He was trying to get to Arizona for warmer weather and was apparently on foot when he left his camp and animals with provisions and art supplies. If it was him, he would have almost have made it -- just a few more miles out of the hill country. He had already made some money for his paintings, so he could have afforded to get the boots found on the victim.
4. Even though there were highways going through the area at the time of Ruess' disappearance, he would most likely have stayed of those trails in order to find things to paint and stay in nature.
The only two things that make this unlikely are the estimated dates of death and the age listed in the anthropology report. Does it seem possible? Maybe I'm placing too much on the circumstantial, but it was surprising to me to find it in the first place and to have so much of it match up.
1. How certain is the assumed years of death range? Could an assumed date of 1925 actually be something like 1934?
2. When determining age, who "sure" are they about this? Could someone be five or so years older -- especially since most of the info in the anthropolgy report states he was not fully developed?
3. What size shoes do you think the boots are? They look between a 8 and 11 to me, but I'm not a great judge of shoe size.
The reason I'm asking is because I found a very interesting case, one that might actually match. I was browsing around Charley Project when I found the case of Everett Ruess, a nature artist that was last known to be in the general area in 1934. My reasons for thinking this JD may be him are:
1. Pictures of Ruess and composites of JD look similar (especially nose, chin, and eye structure)
2. He was last known to be in the area and had some sort of illness that was bothering him (according to letters).
3. He was trying to get to Arizona for warmer weather and was apparently on foot when he left his camp and animals with provisions and art supplies. If it was him, he would have almost have made it -- just a few more miles out of the hill country. He had already made some money for his paintings, so he could have afforded to get the boots found on the victim.
4. Even though there were highways going through the area at the time of Ruess' disappearance, he would most likely have stayed of those trails in order to find things to paint and stay in nature.
The only two things that make this unlikely are the estimated dates of death and the age listed in the anthropology report. Does it seem possible? Maybe I'm placing too much on the circumstantial, but it was surprising to me to find it in the first place and to have so much of it match up.
If you consider cheekbones alone they could very well be from northern Europe. High cheekbones is a common feature among people of Celtic heritage and one needs not be from Scotland, Ireland, Wales or Brittany to claim Celtic ancestry since Celtic peoples were spread all over the northern half of Europe in ancient times. This feature by itself is not very useful to determine race but at least it's an indication that an individual had a triangular face rather than a round or square one.
MaryLiz
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[The reason I'm asking is because I found a very interesting case, one that might actually match. I was browsing around Charley Project when I found the case of Everett Ruess, a nature artist that was last known to be in the general area in 1934. My reasons for thinking this JD may be him are:
1. Pictures of Ruess and composites of JD look similar (especially nose, chin, and eye structure)
2. He was last known to be in the area and had some sort of illness that was bothering him (according to letters).
3. He was trying to get to Arizona for warmer weather and was apparently on foot when he left his camp and animals with provisions and art supplies. If it was him, he would have almost have made it -- just a few more miles out of the hill country. He had already made some money for his paintings, so he could have afforded to get the boots found on the victim.
4. Even though there were highways going through the area at the time of Ruess' disappearance, he would most likely have stayed of those trails in order to find things to paint and stay in nature.
The only two things that make this unlikely are the estimated dates of death and the age listed in the anthropology report. Does it seem possible? Maybe I'm placing too much on the circumstantial, but it was surprising to me to find it in the first place and to have so much of it match up.]
kygirl, I don't think a match with Everett Ruess is too far-fetched. They can't get the exact timeline of when death occurred when they find remains like that so long after the person died. It could easily be a 20 year range from 1914-1934, rather than 1914-1925. And as far as his age, he was only 4 years older than the stated 16 years of age. I'm familiar with Everett Ruess' case and when looking at his pictures again on Charley Project he looks very young, I think even younger than 20, with sort of a baby face. Also, I do think the reconstruction does resemble him somewhat. His boots also look to me to be between an 8-11 and Ruess wore size 9 boots. The only thing not matching is the height. The remains were determined to be between 5'4" and 5'6" and Ruess was 5'8".
Anyway, I can see the resemblance and I think it is a distinct possibility.
1. Pictures of Ruess and composites of JD look similar (especially nose, chin, and eye structure)
2. He was last known to be in the area and had some sort of illness that was bothering him (according to letters).
3. He was trying to get to Arizona for warmer weather and was apparently on foot when he left his camp and animals with provisions and art supplies. If it was him, he would have almost have made it -- just a few more miles out of the hill country. He had already made some money for his paintings, so he could have afforded to get the boots found on the victim.
4. Even though there were highways going through the area at the time of Ruess' disappearance, he would most likely have stayed of those trails in order to find things to paint and stay in nature.
The only two things that make this unlikely are the estimated dates of death and the age listed in the anthropology report. Does it seem possible? Maybe I'm placing too much on the circumstantial, but it was surprising to me to find it in the first place and to have so much of it match up.]
kygirl, I don't think a match with Everett Ruess is too far-fetched. They can't get the exact timeline of when death occurred when they find remains like that so long after the person died. It could easily be a 20 year range from 1914-1934, rather than 1914-1925. And as far as his age, he was only 4 years older than the stated 16 years of age. I'm familiar with Everett Ruess' case and when looking at his pictures again on Charley Project he looks very young, I think even younger than 20, with sort of a baby face. Also, I do think the reconstruction does resemble him somewhat. His boots also look to me to be between an 8-11 and Ruess wore size 9 boots. The only thing not matching is the height. The remains were determined to be between 5'4" and 5'6" and Ruess was 5'8".
Anyway, I can see the resemblance and I think it is a distinct possibility.
Thanks. It seems that it could be, but the forensic side of this is pretty convinced on the age (every article read states "exactly 15" and all evidence dates toward a "1917" date of death (guessing from clothing and such)).
I still think that there is a chance it might be Ruess. Things just line up and the JD looks very similar to Ruess' face. I just can't help but think it could be.
I tried pulling up the contacts on webbhill.org, but they sent me back to the .com site which is nothing but a bunch of links to other stuff now.
ETA: When you go to the webbhill.org site, and read the police report, you get a different story than the one on the anthropology report. It states that the boots appeared to be "30's or 40's" style and the JD was between "5'6" to 5'9"." If that were true, then this has a better chance of being Ruess.
I still think that there is a chance it might be Ruess. Things just line up and the JD looks very similar to Ruess' face. I just can't help but think it could be.
I tried pulling up the contacts on webbhill.org, but they sent me back to the .com site which is nothing but a bunch of links to other stuff now.
ETA: When you go to the webbhill.org site, and read the police report, you get a different story than the one on the anthropology report. It states that the boots appeared to be "30's or 40's" style and the JD was between "5'6" to 5'9"." If that were true, then this has a better chance of being Ruess.
MaryLiz
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Also in the police report at webbhill.org, after it gives the estimated height, they note that it is "probably an adult" which would put it closer to Ruess' age of 20 than 16. I wonder why most of the articles vary from what the actual police report says. Given the description in the police report, it could very easily be Ruess.
I finally found a link to the private investigator listed that worked and I left a message. I'm hoping that he will get back soon to let me know.
The reason all the reports say different is because the anthropology report by Dr. Root says that he was definitely 15 years old and was between 5'4" and 5'6". Since the P.I. is the one releasing most of the info (and he was the one who hired Root to investigate the body), they will use it as their guideline.
The reason all the reports say different is because the anthropology report by Dr. Root says that he was definitely 15 years old and was between 5'4" and 5'6". Since the P.I. is the one releasing most of the info (and he was the one who hired Root to investigate the body), they will use it as their guideline.
MaryLiz
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Good, I'm glad you were able to at least leave a message with someone. I know it's a long shot but this has got me really thinking about Everett Ruess again. I intend to do some more digging this weekend and re-read the stuff I read about him a couple years ago and see if I can match anything up that would make sense!
MaryLiz
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I checked the distance from where Everett Ruess disappeared to Webb Hill, which is 5 miles from St. George, Utah. Depending on which map I looked at, (Google or Yahoo), it still came out to be too far for him to have made it to the cave at Webb Hill. They are between 168-185 miles apart from each other. There is no way he could have made it especially without his provisions, which were missing when they found his burros near his last campsite. Also, when reading the newspaper articles on the webbhill.org site, someone else apparently thought that it could have been Ruess but they said that 1934 was too late and 20 years of age was too old for the skeleton. Here's the link to that article.
http://www.webbhill.org/media/Salt_Lake_Tribune_January_26_1999.htm
I still wish someone in his family would check it out for sure. He had a brother, Waldo, who was still alive in 2004 and Waldo has a son named Brian, so he still has some family living.
http://www.webbhill.org/media/Salt_Lake_Tribune_January_26_1999.htm
I still wish someone in his family would check it out for sure. He had a brother, Waldo, who was still alive in 2004 and Waldo has a son named Brian, so he still has some family living.
Thanks for that info. I've gotten a reply and they said that it was ruled out by DNA several years ago and that he was definitely too old/tall to be the JD.
Well, it was worth a shot anyway. Still not convinced that he was working on the oil rig, but one can only guess that if he had been missing that the company he was working for would have record of him leaving or a stoppage of pay on someone. They don't just leave such things blank.
Well, it was worth a shot anyway. Still not convinced that he was working on the oil rig, but one can only guess that if he had been missing that the company he was working for would have record of him leaving or a stoppage of pay on someone. They don't just leave such things blank.
Judging by some of Ruess's photos it seems like he was a bit of a daredevil prone to ignore danger like most guys his age are (I know I was) so it's no big surprise he vanished. They'd be much greater chances of finding his body near his campsite at the foot of a cliff or a tree than in a cave almost 200 miles away. Bones would have been scattered long ago. Hundreds of people got lost in the desert never to be heard from again in the early 20th century, even today some still manage to perish there. The chances the body in the cave is Ruess were very slim to start with, and almost null according to forensic evidence. If that weren't enough the distance between the cave and Ruess's campsite makes it even more unlikely, I don't think Ruess would have gotten lost to the point of not being able to find his campsite. He may have taken foolish chances but despite his young age he was an experienced desert navigator.
MaryLiz
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I knew it was somewhat of a long shot but was still hopeful..until I checked the distance from where Ruess disappeared to where the remains were found. I'm glad they responded to you, kygirl, to let you know about the DNA. Thanks for the info!
anthrobones
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Bumping Up post
anthrobones
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Bumping up
anthrobones
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New website address: http://www.webbhill.net/