VA - 12 Dead including shooter, VA Beach Municipal Center, 31 May 2019

Discussion in 'Rampage Killings and Terrorist Attacks' started by Elley Mae, May 31, 2019.

  1. katydid23

    katydid23 Verified Juanette

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    So he hadn't been fired?
    [​IMG]
     
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  2. katydid23

    katydid23 Verified Juanette

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    Apparently not.
     
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  3. Tssiemer

    Tssiemer Well-Known Member

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    I’m not gonna lie. I was a little surprised.
     
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  4. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    A common misconception is that being in the military - ANY military organization - implies a certain degree of proficiency with weapons. I had over 28 years and my only mandatory requirement was to shoot 30 rounds with a handgun in my initial training. That is not nearly enough for the average person to obtain any degree of proficiency. It requires the average person hours and possibly hundreds of rounds of shooting. And proficiency with a rifle doesn't translate to proficiency with a handgun which is more difficult to become proficient. I once worked with an O-4 who received no training on any weapon in boot camp as an enlisted because the gun range was being repaired. Later as an officer he was ill when they shot the handguns and they waived his shooting requirement. He bragged that he would do over 20 years in the military and NEVER shoot a gun. He did and that included a year of enlisted time in Da Nang during the Vietnam War. I had an Army master sergeant who reported to me in a joint command and he stated he had not fired a weapon in over 10 years at that time. Outside of the Marines, your average military person doesn't receive much training with firearms.
     
  5. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    You were going with the odds. I was surprised, too.
     
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  6. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

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    I’m not surprised anymore, He is one of the ones that falls into my, expect the unexpected from the unsuspected.
     
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  7. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
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  8. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    Several neighbors interviewed said his wife left him "some time ago".

    Neighbors said he's a loner. Never saw him even carry in groceries. Doesn't smile or talk to neighbors.

    Works out a lot. "Ripped." Drops "heavy" things in condo in the middle of the night. (Weight lifting?)

    The caliber of his handgun used, the magazines ("extended"), and that a "silencer" or "suppressor" was used came out BEFORE the shooter's name or picture was public. How many other mass shootings has the caliber and model of gun been released so quickly? Before the name and picture of the gunman? Think hard.

    Most MSM doesn't seem to feel any of that is relevant, but focuses on his National Guard training in OK years ago.
     
  9. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    Wow! You're even more cynical than me. I didn't think that was possible. :D
     
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  10. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    What I take home from all the coverage of mass shootings in the past couple of years is that the msm cannot be trusted to report anything truthfully, other than the number of victims and where the massacre happened.

    The msm reporting literally rushes to slant every other piece of information in a particular ideological direction that supports their bias.

    The victims quickly become props.
     
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  11. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    <modsnip: quoted post was removed>

    And next we might be hearing an inference from "ripped", "jacked" and "works out" that maybe he was on steroids. Between things like this and the false rumor of his being fired (on CNN) and his military experience I can see the possibility for more media stories. And I haven't even touched the fact that you point out that the weapons "information" came out before his name.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 1, 2019
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  12. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    It seems like the ability to shoot without people realizing that there was a shooting is a huge issue.

    The quiet aspect is even more terrifying to me.
     
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  13. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    Usually it takes quite a while for the name to come out, doesn’t it?
     
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  14. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    Quiet?!? Media personnel heard gunfire in the parking lot.
     
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  15. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    Who was firing?Police? Did he have something to suppress the sound or not?
     
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  16. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    There is a vast difference between a suppressor, and a silencer. Smoke "suppressors" are legal. Silencers are legal only in limited circumstances. Silencers DO NOT silence gunfire. It is most likely that he was using a smoke suppressor, but it's possible he had a silencer. The feds will know this right away, as all silencers have to be licensed. (Unless, of course, it's a homemade silencer made from something like an oil filter-- which would be obvious, and really only work once before it disintegrated.)

    Any kind of silencer, or suppressor, on a 45 caliber was for the benefit of the gunman, to obscure the muzzle smoke, and to somewhat muffle the sound so he could keep shooting. Was the gunman wearing earmuffs or plugs?

    In no way will a 45 caliber with a silencer, or smoke suppressor, "deaden" sound. Even a 22 caliber is loud without ear protection and with any kind of suppressor.
     
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  17. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    A sound suppressor reduces the sound. It doesn't silence it. A typical .45 handgun load produces a sound in the 155 to 165 decibel range. A suppressor reduces that by about 30 decibels to about 125 to 135 decibels. The horn on a train is anywhere from 130 to 150 decibels. The typical automobile horn is 110-120 decibels.
    Even with a suppressor it still would be heard. That is why the proper term is a 'suppressor' and not 'silencer'.
     
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  18. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    The insidiousness of "suppressing" the information about shooters absolutely insures that the focus in the media is on the weapons used. Any any background even tangentially related to weapons purchase, training, or possession is typically highlighted by msm. The weapons are the focus going forward, NOT the murderous shooter, which IMO, is an intentional ideological ploy of the msm.

    It's a useless tactic, IMO, that pretends to dissuade copycat shooting sprees. No spree shooter was ever dissuaded from shooting because the thought they wouldn't get "enough" publicity. Worse yet, IMO, suppressing information about shooters minimizes their social/ antisocial/ mental health issues. It PROTECTS the privacy of the shooter, over the victims.

    So if media and LE won't talk openly about the shooters in these cases,, who they are, social/ antisocial / mental health issues, WHY they carried out a mass shooting, what's left to demonize? See how that works.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019
  19. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    By the way, a box of 45 caliber bullets is much heavier that you might expect.. A 45 cal pistol is also heavy (Average 27 oz empty)-- probably several (3+) pounds when loaded with a regular magazine. An extended mag makes the already heavy pistol much heavier.

    It takes significant strength to keep lifting, aiming, and shooting a gun that heavy, even with a 2 handed grip.
     
  20. K_Z

    K_Z Verified Anesthetist

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    IMO, it's extremely unlikely he was fired.

    In almost all government jobs, there is a protocol for firing that typically includes presence of security in HR department during the firing conversation, instant surrender of key cards/ passes, and an escort off the property. LE is typically given a heads up by HR if there is a concern for violence. A lot of these protocols came about as a result of postal shootings, and massacres like San Bernadino.
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2019

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