WA - 3 children, ages 13, 9 and 7, among 5 killed inside Fall City home, 15 y.o. in custody - 21 October 2024

[Kittypoo]

Same here.
Did the parents see that the son was changing in recent weeks or months? Did he meet new friends?
Were the parents extremely demanding?
From the comments of the neighborhood folks who were questioned, it sounded like things were okay at home.
And I do worry about the surviving girl in the family...

I wonder the same. There is definitely more than meets the eye hopefully will come out in time.
Just thinking even the parents reproducing seems regimented. Ages 7 9 11 13 and 15
Being the eldest child in the family was the biggest pressure to be perfect put on him?
Teens and youngers learn from their mistakes. That’s my opinion we have all been there.
Just my thoughts and opinions

 

[girlhasnoname]

I wonder if the parents had a will and that is somehow influencing the move to a private attorney, the 15-year old now has money and a guardian is appointed in the will to carry out their wishes vis a vis the children and hence the 15-year old?

Hard to imagine this, but other than a pro bona attorney, that pretty much only leaves his family and I think they would be satisfied with a public defender for him. JMO.

This will be an expensive undertaking with attorney's fees, expert witnesses, etc., and over a long period of time.

I don't think that the accused murderer would be able to access money from any insurance, and I don't know about a will. Do the same rules apply? IDK Would the family assets be frozen during this time?

Agreed that this will end up costing easily 6 figures if not more before it's said and done.

JMO

 

[nhmemorymaker]

bbm
Hmmm. Good point, Chimera -- I hadn't thought of that angle.
Hoping for the best for the surviving girl. She is alive and apparently doing as well as is possible. She, IMO, will certainly never be the same, but it sounds like she has other family members who can be with her and help her in whatever ways they are able.
I do wonder if the surviving girl noticed anything unusual with the brother who wrought the killings before his rampage occurred.

Your question...about what the sister might have observed about her brother recently..... yet another monumental responsibility to be the only survivor to attempt to address and answer this .

The stress on her is just so unbelievable. I just hope she is not getting further stress from various do-good extended family who are trying to keep her safe and sane. And only confuse her more. moo.

 

[Seattle1]

I don't think that the accused murderer would be able to access money from any insurance, and I don't know about a will. Do the same rules apply? IDK Would the family assets be frozen during this time?

Agreed that this will end up costing easily 6 figures if not more before it's said and done.

JMO

At age 15, the defendant is both a dependent and a minor where WA Statue makes his parents or guardian responsible for his legal debts and unless they are indigent, they are responsible for the cost of his legal defense. See my earlier linked post.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I wonder the same. There is definitely more than meets the eye hopefully will come out in time.
Just thinking even the parents reproducing seems regimented. Ages 7 9 11 13 and 15
Being the eldest child in the family was the biggest pressure to be perfect put on him?
Teens and youngers learn from their mistakes. That’s my opinion we have all been there.
Just my thoughts and opinions

I can only speak to what I know being the youngest sibling of 5 similar in ages. I can say without hesitation that the oldest, my brother, is the most thoughtful and caring person you'd ever meet. He has looked after and protected the rest of us his whole life and still does. He's successful and living his best life.

I don't think there's anything strange about the age differences nor do I think being the eldest necessarily puts pressure on them to be perfect.

JMO

 

[scapa]

I wonder the same. There is definitely more than meets the eye hopefully will come out in time.
Just thinking even the parents reproducing seems regimented. Ages 7 9 11 13 and 15
Being the eldest child in the family was the biggest pressure to be perfect put on him?
Teens and youngers learn from their mistakes. That’s my opinion we have all been there.
Just my thoughts and opinions

Definitely worth discussion -- haven't seen many details yet.

MOO -- there may well have been pressures within this family, even profound ones, but mass murder still seems like an enormously outsized response to them.

Many, many children face demanding family environments, many of those will be firstborns, and many of those firstborns will have to mediate at times between parents and siblings (and many of those siblings will have to endure firstborns...).

Some of those children will act out, fight for their independence, get tattoos and listen to music their parents hate, spend $ at the mall, date kids deemed unsuitable, drink at park parties, etc etc etc. Some get into trouble and get juvenile records.

A small number commit major crimes and a vanishingly small number of those kill people. Those who wipe out their families one by one and then concoct a ludicrous shift-the-blame narrative are so few that it's hard for me to remember more than a handful without looking them up.

I have no idea what daily life was like in this family. I will be astonished if we find out that it was anywhere punishing enough to drive this boy to annihilate them and properly causative in any convincing way.

But we may know more at some point if this ever goes to trial. I'd be shocked if it stays in juvenile court given the immensity of the crime and the killer's age.

 

[mickey2942]

It is another tragedy, where adults let down children by not securing guns in the home. A gun safe, trigger locks, keeping bullets secured, in a different place from guns, so many ways to prevent this type of violence.

Teens are impulsive. They need protection from their own impulses. Adults are the balance.

 

[Bounceycat]

It is another tragedy, where adults let down children by not securing guns in the home. A gun safe, trigger locks, keeping bullets secured, in a different place from guns, so many ways to prevent this type of violence.

Teens are impulsive. They need protection from their own impulses. Adults are the balance.

The gun was locked up...except reportedly only the oldest was told the combination

 

[Ontario Mom]

It is another tragedy, where adults let down children by not securing guns in the home. A gun safe, trigger locks, keeping bullets secured, in a different place from guns, so many ways to prevent this type of violence.

Teens are impulsive. They need protection from their own impulses. Adults are the balance.

I'm unclear if it's ever been confirmed one way or the other if the 15yr old was given the gun box combo by his dad, or if he aquired it on his own? The only reports I've seen stated that is sister said he (the 15 yr old) had it. But she never clarified how he came to be in possession of it.

 

[Sundog]

With regard to the gun, we have read that supposedly the father kept the gun at the front of the house near the front door in case he decided to take it to work with him. In a locked box.

I don't think the parents were overly concerned about any major changes in the attitudes or behavior of their oldest son, or they would have likely moved the gun box and/or changed the lock number if they were concerned for their safety or the safety of their son or other children. If no changes were made, then it is likely, IMO, that the 15-year old planned the killing spree in advance and it wasn't a quick decision leading up to the murders.

JMO at this stage of things from what we know and/or the speculation that has so far been reported by the media.

 

[mickey2942]

The gun was locked up...except reportedly only the oldest was told the combination

Which means it was not secured from children.

 

[Deleted member 296739]

Which means it was not secured from children.

We don’t know how he got the code- 11f said that he was the only one who had it but o don’t recall it being reported that he was given the code- he could have gotten it by other means and parents didn’t know- siblings often keep secrets - moo

 

[Ontario Mom]

We don’t know how he got the code- 11f said that he was the only one who had it but o don’t recall it being reported that he was given the code- he could have gotten it by other means and parents didn’t know- siblings often keep secrets - moo

That's the same understanding I have. We were all teenagers once. Many of us knew the combo, the hiding place, etc., that our parents thought was secure. That's pretty common. It's also possible dad thought 15m was responsible & trustworthy & gave him the combo, but we don't know for certain either way.

 

[Seattle1]

That's the same understanding I have. We were all teenagers once. Many of us knew the combo, the hiding place, etc., that our parents thought was secure. That's pretty common. It's also possible dad thought 15m was responsible & trustworthy & gave him the combo, but we don't know for certain either way.

Given the circumstances where her brother just executed his entire family and attempted to kill her too, do you really think she would not tell authorities that her brother secretly obtained the passcode to the gun box without his parents knowing or without permission? That makes absolutely no sense to me! No, she told them he was the only one of the five children including herself that knew the code. It's clear to me that he was entrusted with the code. And another reason to eliminate M13 as the shooter. JMO

 

[Ontario Mom]

Given the circumstances where her brother just executed his entire family and attempted to kill her too, do you really think she would not tell authorities that her brother secretly obtained the passcode to the gun box without his parents knowing or without permission? That makes absolutely no sense to me! No, she told them he was the only one of the five children including herself that knew the code. It's clear to me that he was entrusted with the code. And another reason to eliminate M13 as the shooter. JMO

I'm well aware of what she said. We still don't know for a fact either way, if it was given to him, or if he obtained it on his own.

 

[Deleted member 296739]

Given the circumstances where her brother just executed his entire family and attempted to kill her too, do you really think she would not tell authorities that her brother secretly obtained the passcode to the gun box without his parents knowing or without permission? That makes absolutely no sense to me! No, she told them he was the only one of the five children including herself that knew the code. It's clear to me that he was entrusted with the code. And another reason to eliminate M13 as the shooter. JMO

I don’t think we know everything that she told investigators and what I’ve seen is that 15m had the code- I don’t recall reading that she said the parents gave it to him- and I don’t know if investigators followed up with “how’d he get it?” And if they did ask, I’ve no idea her answer-

It’s not been explicitly stated that I recall how he got the code

personal experience in my family and friends’ families tell me often times kids get information that they aren’t supposed to know and siblings keep information secret from parents for a variety of reasons -

Not saying that’s what happened- but I’ve not seen that the parents gave the accused the code to the gun lock box- moo

 

[Seattle1]

I don’t think we know everything that she told investigators and what I’ve seen is that 15m had the code- I don’t recall reading that she said the parents gave it to him- and I don’t know if investigators followed up with “how’d he get it?” And if they did ask, I’ve no idea her answer-

It’s not been explicitly stated that I recall how he got the code

personal experience in my family and friends’ families tell me often times kids get information that they aren’t supposed to know and siblings keep information secret from parents for a variety of reasons -

Not saying that’s what happened- but I’ve not seen that the parents gave the accused the code to the gun lock box- moo

Having obtained and read the PCA, I simply disagree with the implication that the surviving victim would know the brother's secret, and withhold it from investigators. I also found her statement to be clear. Given the parents are both deceased, we shouldn't expect to read an affirmative statement that dad (or mom) gave the code to the accused.

But yes, it's certainly possible that all the residents got the lockbox information they were not supposed to know, I just don't think it plausible. That pretty much defeats the purpose of having a lockbox. The impact of this tragedy worsens every day. MOO.

 

[Deleted member 296739]

Having obtained and read the PCA, I simply disagree with the implication that the surviving victim would know the brother's secret, and withhold it from investigators. I also found her statement to be clear. Given the parents are both deceased, we shouldn't expect to read an affirmative statement that dad gave the code to the accused.

But yes, it's certainly possible that all the residents got the lockbox information they were not supposed to know, I just don't think it plausible. That pretty much defeats the purpose of having a lockbox. The impact of this tragedy worsens every day. MOO.

I’m not suggesting she withhold anything from investigators, just that it was not explicitly stated that 15m was given the code- just that he had it-

Highly likely and probable that it was given to him by the parents- it’s also possible that the sister knew he had it, she didn’t know it herself and hadn’t told her parents that she knew that he had it-

on several occasions one of my kids had information (like passwords or someone cheated) that I didn’t know about, and siblings were aware of these things and it wasn’t until years later I found out-

Not saying that’s the case but the info available does not rule it out- moo

 

[borndem]

Re the lone survivor of this horror:
Wondering if -- when she is able -- it would be a good change for her to go to a boarding school.
Her name has not been mentioned (AFAIK) in the press; she is of an age where there could be a good boarding school with girls of her age -- the girls in these schools are from various states -- small classes -- good education, etc., etc. She would be away from the house and the area where it all happened, etc.
Just a thought...

 

[doublestop]

Re the lone survivor of this horror:
Wondering if -- when she is able -- it would be a good change for her to go to a boarding school.
Her name has not been mentioned (AFAIK) in the press; she is of an age where there could be a good boarding school with girls of her age -- the girls in these schools are from various states -- small classes -- good education, etc., etc. She would be away from the house where it all happened, etc.
Just a thought...

Or if she lived with relatives in another town she would be away from that area. I would think being with what remains of her family would be a better idea for her.