Identified! WA - Spokane, WhtFem 16-30, UP489, AKA "Millie", skull found in '98, Jun'84 - Ruth Belle Waymire

[pip]

the image(s) are looking great CarlK!
How nuts is that Pip? Wonder if they were all related? Nice to have a insiders look at the neighborhood, etc and goings on in that area during that time.

It was a pretty low rent hood.. Lots of renters and older home owners. Lots of worse areas of town in the 80's, but this area got much worse over time. I am trying to dig up info on the playground murder victim but no luck so far. It is chilling that the other woman's skull was dumped across the street from this woman's residence. Nuts is right. I just can't remember all the details from the news back then, I recall not being too surprised.. I do recall two sisters (in their 20's?) lived in the lower unit from me with 2 small kids (toddler and a baby). They looked like they were possibly Native American/black mixed race.. Many young black guys coming and going at all hours. I suspected drug activity. The younger sister was found dead in Underhill Park (in the area..) It was either right after I moved in 1982 or into 1983?? Foggy. I was just glad to get out of that place. There was originally an older woman living below me when I moved in, which was fine. Then these shady people moved in. It was scary as hell. I wonder if the two could be connected???

 

[4gwen]

I hope you are able to dig up more info.. What do you remember about the prostitution in and around town? (if you do) . Did the AFB personnel make any impact on the town--i think i'm trying to say like any military town , say like Fayeteville NC or such. I was reading on other threads about several serial killers and local killings going on in Spokane in the 80's...more so than the "average" # of murders....
I have a friend living in Spokane now, he says its kind of a run down town--shady, so to speak, though I think no different than most down-towns around the country?? who knows....
i hope with the latest up dates on this gals facial reconstruction, this will help more than ever.

 

[pip]

I hope you are able to dig up more info.. What do you remember about the prostitution in and around town? (if you do) . Did the AFB personnel make any impact on the town--i think i'm trying to say like any military town , say like Fayeteville NC or such. I was reading on other threads about several serial killers and local killings going on in Spokane in the 80's...more so than the "average" # of murders....
I have a friend living in Spokane now, he says its kind of a run down town--shady, so to speak, though I think no different than most down-towns around the country?? who knows....
i hope with the latest up dates on this gals facial reconstruction, this will help more than ever.

I recall it being well known in Spokane that Sprague Ave. was where prostitutes hung out. I wasn't really aware of it much until the news broke about the prostitute murders and the eventual arrest of Robert Yates the serial killer. It was a nice and pretty quiet town to grow up in, it has since had a rapidly growing crime rate. It is still a nice city, the downtown area is nice actually...but not very busy. There are certainly areas, like any city that are run down. I never felt a big AFB presence growing up there, nor do I now when I visit. It is close to Fairchild AFB, but it never had a military town feel at all. Still digging for more info, but coming up short.

 

[4gwen]

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,997445-1,00.html

interesting article. a few years too late maybe.

http://www.mayhem.net/Crime/yates.html

..about Yates.

 

[Roselvr]

I had a heart to heart with the ME whose pet case this is-she is certain that Jane Doe gave birth to at least one if not more than one child. Pelvic changes etc...support her findings. Maybe there was an episiotomy scar??? I will ask her.

Are you still in contact with her? Can you ask if there is enough DNA to send a sample to 23andme for a genealogy profile? It may end up giving her a family name to work with

There is one side-view of this Jane Doe's skull in NamUs, and I got ahold of some additional images.

The two facial reconstructions are terrible. The drawing depicts her with an extremely weak chin (which is the opposite of what is true), and a nose that is correctly depicted as prominent. I can see from the nasal bone that her nose projects prominently, but the bottom of her nasal aperture is positioned relatively high on the skull. So I would say that the drawing probably depicts her nose taller than what is true..

The sculpture doesn't even look human, although it was probably designed to portray the fact that she has a strong nose and strong chin, without providing specifics that might lead the viewer to mistake it as a true depiction of the woman's "look".

I decided to do my own reconstruction. Remember this is not intended to be an accurate depiction of her "look". We are told that the Jane Doe was petite and possibly blonde, but we know nothing about her hairstyle, nor do we know eye color, or the shape of her eyes, or the thickness of her lips.

This is just a portrayal of how I see her facial dimensions:

Since this was early 80's, I depicted her with the big-fluffy harr [sic] like just about all of the girls had back then.

Note that the Jane Doe was missing all four wisdom teeth and all four second molars, and I would guess that her cheeks were a bit sunken (sort of like Tom Petty or Steven Tyler).

BBM - not necessarily. I've had my wisdom teeth & molars out since my early 20's.
Pretty spooky looking at her photos.

I don't think that pregnancy info would necessarily apply to this woman. She had spina bifida occulta, which is the least serious version of spina bifida. Occulta means 'hidden', a lot of people with that version never even know they have it- my sister just found out she had it a few months ago after getting an Xray after a car accident.

In general it does not cause health problems except back problems related to the spine/vertebrae malformation. The more commonly known kind is the cystica kind where babies are born with a hole along their back with some of the spine showing, sometimes there is a cyst that covers or damages part of the spine also. That type is what causes those serious issues related to pregnancy I'd guess, I don't think you get that stuff with spina bifida occulta though.

ETA_ I dont' know what the 'unfused apophyses' thing means though, so she might have had a more serious type of occulta? I wonder if that is part of spina bifida or a back issue that she got because she had spina bifida? Or unrelated? not sure really...

I wonder if she had hardware in her wrists & ankles. The spine issue spina bifida occulta is also known as tethered spinal cord. She would have suffered with what was termed "growing pains" back then. The "growing pains"; bugs crawling or biting sensation is used to diagnose TC these days. Back then kids like me suffered & wondered why our siblings didn't have it. Was also scary to walk up & down steps because we never knew when our legs would go out from under us.

The things I'm reading with the spina bifida occulta (tethered spinal cord); her unfused lumbar vert as well as iliac problems; add the teeth issues; missing hands/feet; she probably had a connective tissue disorder.

 

[carbuff]

Current ruleouts list (21 June 2013). Mary Ann Hogland is not on the list:

Andria Bailey 1963 Washington
Carol Donn 1963 Florida
Carol Edwards 1955 Washington
single severed hand found in Spokane County o 1900 Washington
Sharon Giusti 1943 Washington
Kathryn Gregory 1957 Washington
Joan Hall 1966 Oregon
Wendy Huggy 1965 Florida
Marcia Joyce 1950 Washington
Julia Kanol (Cannell) 1947 Washington
Kase Lee 1966 Washington
Kelly McGinniss 1965 Washington
Helen Morgan 1957 Georgia
Elaine Robertson 1955 Washington
Verla Winter 1939 Washington

 

[CarlK90245]

There is one side-view of this Jane Doe's skull in NamUs, and I got ahold of some additional images.

The two facial reconstructions are terrible. The drawing depicts her with an extremely weak chin (which is the opposite of what is true), and a nose that is correctly depicted as prominent. I can see from the nasal bone that her nose projects prominently, but the bottom of her nasal aperture is positioned relatively high on the skull. So I would say that the drawing probably depicts her nose taller than what is true..

The sculpture doesn't even look human, although it was probably designed to portray the fact that she has a strong nose and strong chin, without providing specifics that might lead the viewer to mistake it as a true depiction of the woman's "look".

I decided to do my own reconstruction. Remember this is not intended to be an accurate depiction of her "look". We are told that the Jane Doe was petite and possibly blonde, but we know nothing about her hairstyle, nor do we know eye color, or the shape of her eyes, or the thickness of her lips.

This is just a portrayal of how I see her facial dimensions:

Since this was early 80's, I depicted her with the big-fluffy harr [sic] like just about all of the girls had back then.

Note that the Jane Doe was missing all four wisdom teeth and all four second molars, and I would guess that her cheeks were a bit sunken (sort of like Tom Petty).

Looking through the HS yearbooks from Spokane, I see a girl who was a senior in the 1983 West Valley HS yearbook who looks a lot like my frontal recon, except that she has a slightly freckly complexion, and the dorsum of her nose is narrower. The facial shape is spot-on. She is posing for the photo with her hand below her chin, so I can't see if she has any moles on her neck.

I'm not putting her name (or even initials) up yet until I do a little more research. So far, I can't locate her in any of the common sources.

I never was able to find any current information online for the girl in the yearbook.

I located another girl in the 1985 book with the same surname and who looked similar enough to be possibly related. I've been trying to contact her for quite a while. My calls have always gone to voicemail.

I finally left a voicemail to confirm if she is related to this girl, and if so, whether she has seen her since 1984.

I hate to go to this extent because people usually get the creeps when they get a a call like that. LOL. But this girl's facial shape is quite unusual, and so spot on to the skull recon that I did that I had to follow-up.

 

[CarlK90245]

I never was able to find any current information online for the girl in the yearbook.

I located another girl in the 1985 book with the same surname and who looked similar enough to be possibly related. I've been trying to contact her for quite a while. My calls have always gone to voicemail.

I finally left a voicemail to confirm if she is related to this girl, and if so, whether she has seen her since 1984.

I hate to go to this extent because people usually get the creeps when they get a a call like that. LOL. But this girl's facial shape is quite unusual, and so spot on to the skull recon that I did that I had to follow-up.

I got a call back from Meta Marshall (Missing Person Locater at the Spokane PD), and she was able to find current info in the girl in the yearbook. It was a bit of a long shot, but I was amazed at how closely this girl resembled my drawing, and it had been nagging at me for months that I should make sure that she was not an unreported missing person.

 

[alllads]

Bumping for this UID. Another possibility for the prostitution angle, it would also be an explanation for why so careful to dispose of the hands. If she had a criminal record, UID's fingerprints would be on record. I just remember upthread a discussion of possibilities of what kind of people would have fingerprints on file.

 

[carbuff]

No new ruleouts since 2013 (https://identifyus.org/en/cases/489):

Andria Bailey 1963 Washington
Carol Donn 1963 Florida
Carol Edwards 1955 Washington
single severed hand found in Spokane County o 1900 Washington
Sharon Giusti 1943 Washington
Kathryn Gregory 1957 Washington
Joan Hall 1966 Oregon
Wendy Huggy 1965 Florida
Marcia Joyce 1950 Washington
Julia Kanol (Cannell) 1947 Washington
Kase Lee 1966 Washington
Kelly McGinniss 1965 Washington
Helen Morgan 1957 Georgia
Elaine Robertson 1955 Washington
Verla Winter 1939 Washington

 

[danzn16]

"The woman, who may have borne children, was dismembered while alive."

This makes me weep for the human race


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[EmmaliLucia]

If she was dismembered while alive then I have a question,

Do we know where Dayton Leeroy Rogers was in '84? It's about a 5 1/2 hour drive from Portland, but that was his MO.

 

[biscuits222]

Searching through findthemissing for women who went missing in the weeks leading up to 20th June 1984, there is this case entered on 01/15/2014, Susan M Cooke, missing 16th June 1984 from Cle Elum, Washington:
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/23251

The IdentifyUs page says the UID died perhaps 1 day before the remains were discovered:
https://identifyus.org/en/cases/489

Susan Cooke appears to be a very obscure case, no photo, no details. Cle Elum is around 200 miles by road from Spokane according to Google Maps.

 

[biscuits222]

Some good age-range MPs with prominent chins who went missing between 04/01/1984 to 06/21/1984:

Lisa Addington: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/8282/9
Debbie Lynn Prosser: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/11306
Mary Ann Bagenstose: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/12184

Penny Mollett - no photo but says she had a child like JD, missing April 1st '84: https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/7093

 

[CarlK90245]

It's not just that she has a prominent chin. Her chin projects forward, and she probably has a noticeable underbite.

And although there is no mention in the physical characteristics, it appears by the way that the sockets are spaced, that she probably has a gap between her two front teeth. And she has a noticeable mole on the front of her neck.

I have a revision to my reconstruction of this Jane Doe's skull (much different from my previous one), but I am waiting on Janet Franson to see if she can get a more precise description of the location and description of the mole on this Jane Doe's neck.

BTW, Lisa Addington isn't a bad suggestion in terms of her appearance. I'm not sure what circumstances would have brought her to from Oklahoma to Spokane, but her physical description and appearance looks reasonably close.

 

[biscuits222]

Does Josephine Despard look like she has an underbite? https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/5381/7

 

[CarlK90245]

Does Josephine Despard look like she has an underbite? https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/5381/7

I'm not seeing it. But if she does, it doesn't appear to be as severe as I'm seeing with this skull.

 

[biscuits222]

I'm not seeing it. But if she does, it doesn't appear to be as severe as I'm seeing with this skull.

Thanks for the responses! I decided to email Janet Franson at NamUs about some of my ideas here including Susan M Cooke, who perhaps has the best potential because of disappearing in Washington only a few days before the body was found. I doubt I'll get a positive match so soon after starting, but as a beginner I hope to get better and better at this kind of searching.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/23251/0

 

[CarlK90245]

Thanks for the responses! I decided to email Janet Franson at NamUs about some of my ideas here including Susan M Cooke, who perhaps has the best potential because of disappearing in Washington only a few days before the body was found. I doubt I'll get a positive match so soon after starting, but as a beginner I hope to get better and better at this kind of searching.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/23251/0

She looks like a pretty decent possible, especially considering that she supposedly had a cleft lip. The sockets of the Jane Doe's front teeth are spaced a little wide, so the cleft lip and gapped teeth might be related.

Too bad there isn't a photo of her.

 

[carbuff]

I'm not seeing it. But if she does, it doesn't appear to be as severe as I'm seeing with this skull.

Photos can be very misleading about a person's chin and mouth, depending on how the person carries their head. People with jutting jaws sometimes learn to tuck their head down to make their profile more "normal," and others face the world with a pugnacious jaw-thrust-forward attitude that can make a small jaw look more prominent. I don't mean Despard in particular, just a general observation...