what are your thoughts now? *re-re-poll*

Discussion in 'Lisa Irwin' started by nursebeeme, Oct 28, 2011.

?

What happened to baby Lisa?

  1. Mom did it

    255 vote(s)
    45.0%
  2. Dad did it

    6 vote(s)
    1.1%
  3. Mom and Dad did it

    97 vote(s)
    17.1%
  4. SODDI (some other dude did it)

    49 vote(s)
    8.6%
  5. I am up on that fence

    86 vote(s)
    15.2%
  6. I have no clue

    74 vote(s)
    13.1%
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  1. butwhatif?

    butwhatif? New Member

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    I haven't answered this poll. (in the other two, I voted mom)

    I have no idea what happened to Lisa. I don't know why she is gone. I don't know who caused her to be gone.

    All I have are suspisions, and gut feelings that mean nothing in the big scheme of things.

    Every case I read about here is heart-breaking, but I've never been so upset about the lack of focus on the only person that really matters.... Lisa.

    Hopefully at some point there will be a court case, and we can focus on the 'who did it' as evidence is released.

    Right now, I'd just really like the opportunity to help find lisa- but with so few details about the timeline, and so much fuss about all the external stuff, there is very little sleuthing to be done.
     
  2. Magnifying Glass

    Magnifying Glass New Member

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    If the question is "What happened to Lisa?" I'm sort of missing the poll option: "Negligence" - but I understand why it was not included.

    I have and continue to be baffled about the fact DB preferred drinking and adult time over taking care of her kids. I've seen it been excused as "Lisa wasn't that sick" - "So she had a couple of drinks, haven't we all" - "DB is young" - etc.

    Fact remains and I will continue to be annoying about this: she made a conscious decision to put her needs above those of the ones who depended on her. She was the only adult in that house that night and she chose to be negligent. I don't care if it happened before or often; it happened ONCE and look at the result.

    I am not calling DB a murderer, nor do I want her vilified. I won't even say it's her fault Lisa is gone because she was negligent. If nothing had happened that night, she would have still been negligent. Just darn bleeping lucky.

    There is one victim: Lisa. Poor poor her. The rest just have to live with the decisions they made that night. Whatever those may have been.

    I'm past the point of whodunit. I simply don't care, as long as Lisa is found, justice will be served and this circus ends.

    All my opinion :twocents:
     
  3. Jack

    Jack New Member

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    Still on that fence, and still leaning heavily toward mom knowing something. Just not convinced she did it yet. I also still believe that the only reason to hide an accident is that there was something else going on a caregiver wouldn't want anyone to know, something bigger than negligence. That's what keeps me on the fence in this case. If there was something big going on in that house surely LE would have caught wind of it by now. But then again, maybe they have and I just don't know about it. Perhaps a bigger reason could be why the boys wont now be interviewed and a lawyer dropped them as clients.
     
  4. matou

    matou #los2188

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    I originally suspected the mother but now I have to place suspicion on the father as well. The clincher for me is the cancellation of their boys' interviews on Friday, October 28th. It almost seems to me that they had no intention of allowing them to be interviewed again. If it were only one parent involved in what happened, the other parent would have allowed the interview process to go through. It doesn't seem like they are arguing with each other, so either they are both innocent or they are both guilty IMO. JI claimed in an interview that 'it has brought them closer together' (or some similar statement). I was astounded by that comment.
     
  5. LancelotLink

    LancelotLink Better Days

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    From the very first time I saw and heard both parents, my hinky meter went off. All the talk about the cell phones...TMI. I questioned this back then and still have questions. Why even bring up the phones being stolen, with so much detail? I said way back something stinks. It still stinks.
    It was as if they really needed to get this information out.
    When DB spoke of the last time she saw Lisa, she went into detail again. It was 10:30. Changed her, fresh diaper, glow worm, Barney, binkie, blanket.
    That turned out to be a big fat lie, now didn't it?
    Why?
    Why claim you were drunk and move the timeline back to 6:40. taking yourself out of the picture all together by claiming to be drunk? Because you want people to disregard your previous lie. Because you know a call was made from your house at 2:30 AM. Which means it is only a matter of time before this is made public. You or someone else was doing something at 2:30 AM. What?
    A call was made from your house at 2:30, either from a work phone in the pocket of a person who says they were at work or from a phone you claim could not make calls.
    There is a reason LE is looking with such scrutiny at DB and possibly JI. There is a reason I am as well.

    Another thing that has bothered me and I don't expect people to understand what I mean, but DB seems to try and play up to the camera. Almost like an actor would.
     
  6. ZsaZsa

    ZsaZsa Well-Known Member

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    The first few times I saw her crying on TV I said to myself that she was crying because of something she had done....
    Nothing she has said or done since has dissuaded me from that opinion.
    Nothing about this family passes a simple sniff test!
     
  7. SmoothOperator

    SmoothOperator Sadly what connects all these puzzles is that ther

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    There is something I would genuinely like to know.. Wasn't sure where to post my thoughts and question on this but figured this the most appropriate place since it is asking what are our thoughts.. For the very many of you who are familiar with the Holly Bobo case( )you know there is an overwhelming amount of complete inconsistencies to the absolute MAX!!! The immediate family members(for whatever reasons) cannot for the life of them keep their story straight of the eevents of that day.. They have drastically changed on multiple occassions to the point that 6mos in we don't yet have a single clue as to what really happened to Holly at all in the very least!! THe last known person to have seen Holly(the actual eyewitness seeing her being walked into the woods with the perp) cannot keep a single event of that day straight, nor has he yet to once tell the sequence of events even remotely the same! Never!! There are glaringly apparent bold faced lies that have been told(again for reasons unknown) but nonetheless every time it's told what occurred that day new things are added, specific details then omitted and it varies wildly from account to account.. How then can so very many claim that family to be as innocent as the pure driven snow and here in this case where the inconsistencies literally pale in comparison To those in Holly Bobo's case but the family here are literally guilty as sin and ready to be hanged before the town square?

    It doesn't make sense to me how the lies and major inconsistencies are just excused away in one case but in another it is a clear and certain sign of guilty as sin?
     
  8. madge

    madge New Member

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    I haven't followed Holly Bobo so I can only speak for what I have emotionally invested in Baby Lisa. I hope Baby Lisa is alive but the efforts of her family members who are only using stall tactics at this time don't lead me to believe that there is much hope for that. It's sad. This weekend would have been a great time for both parents and children to set down with LE to rectify the outstanding odds that are putting up road blocks in this case.
     
  9. MsMacGyver

    MsMacGyver New Member

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    From everyones posts I see my own feelings mirrored. What help me sort things out was the cadaver dog hit. This info was released by the FBI. This tells me that little Lisa is dead and the mom knows what happened. It's very easy to draw from emotions and I think this is why her interviews are so convincing. Something happened to her baby and it resulted in Lisa's death. I don't see these parents as being very capable of forming an elaborate cover up. They didn't have enough time and I just don't think their smart enough to do it. I believe since Jeremy was working nights for the first time, this is very important. The normal routine this family had established was changed. I can see the possibilty of DB's brother spending the night because DB might be scared to be at home alone with her kids all night. Something happened, whether it be an accident or not. DB's brother was right there to involve himself in the cover up. He fits the description of the man in the white tee shirt. As terrible as it sounds I think he took dead baby Lisa through town, making sure no one saw his face but enough people saw the baby. The witnesses didn't get a good enough look to tell the baby was dead. I believe DB's brother hid Lisas body somewhere before sun rise. LE should be looking in the area where the man in the white tee shirt was spotted at around 4:00am.
    The cell phones had to disappear to fit in with their kidnapping story. Either DB panic and tried to call for help or they made a random call to confuse LE. Later Lisas clothes were destroyed in the dumpster fire to eliminate any DNA evidence. The cell phones could have been destroyed also. DB's brother could have done this or DB herself could have. I haven't put together the timeline well enough to figure out who could have taken care of this. From what I remember on HLN last night, they showed a clear timeline from DB house...to the dumpster fire...the first sighting of man in tee shirt close to DB house. The second witness, the man on motorcycle and ending at gas station video. I might have the second witness and gas station video mixed up. In any event, LE needs to search the area where the last sighting was. Theres a good chance this area is where Lisa is hidden. If you stop and think about it, it's not that elaborate of a plan. If DB had followed the Anthony case, she knows the more time passes, the less likely proof will exist. DB could very well be drawing from her real emotion from losing her baby and this could reflect in her interviews. The two brothers 2nd interview was cancelled. I don't think the parents will allow this to happen..ever. Remember it was reported that DB failed her lie detector test when asked if she knew where Lisa was or what happened to her. This together with the cadaver dog hit leads me in the direction of a cover up...JMO
     
  10. MsMacGyver

    MsMacGyver New Member

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    What a great post. Your point came through loud and clear SO!
    I admit I haven't kept up to date on Hollys case. It's sad to say but the media seems to center on one case and others are left behind. The familys are still suffering, their loved one still missing. It may seem to them that they have been forgotten. Hopefully someone has guided them here to see that their case has not in fact been forgotten at all. The day to day life goes on for us while these familys stopped the minute they find one of their loved ones is missing. I would highly suggest to these familys to contact the media..everyday until their case is addressed.

    As far as your question about opinions on guilt or innocence. We all here can only speculate, give our opinions based on what evidence has been presented to us by the media, LE reports. None of us can know for sure what really happened in either case. It's all just speculation. Some use their gut reactions to guide, some look at evidence we can count on, mainly reports from LE we can actually find a link to. Media has in the past reported news thats not always true. I never rely solely on media. I try to take the hard evidence and form my opinion based on that. At times I let my emotions rule which is not always a good thing. I get upset when i think of so many innocent people, children gone ..missing with no trace. The Caylee Marie case broke alot of our hearts.

    You may take into consideration also the fact that LE doesn't always give a lot of substance to witness reports. We all see things differently, whether it be an eye witness account or a piece of evidence. As time passes, things become clearer. More evidence is found, released, which tends to make us question our first opinion. I can see from reading some posts that many are just plain confused about this case. The one thing I think we can all agree on is our hope that Lisa along with so many other missing children and adults..teens...come home safe. This unfortunately is not the case alot of the times. Sadly it's found that something did happen that resulted in these missing loved ones death. I come here to read others opinions and to share my own. I wish I could find answers to all the cases ongoing. I can't..all I can do is speculate. Every case is different but I think the one thing that may be true here is... we all are seeking the truth....JMO
     
  11. MsMacGyver

    MsMacGyver New Member

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    My gut is telling me that something happened, an accident that caused baby Lisas death. When I see interviews of DB, her emotion seems genuine. Unlike FCA, DB seems heartbroken her child is gone. This case appears to me to be a situation where something terrible happened. JI wasn't home to deal with it and DB appears to me to be incapable of handling high stress situations. She relied on someone else to deal with this and that person did not do the right thing. From fear of the circumstances, they together made a decision. One that was wrong. This is only speculation on my part. There still exists the possibilty that a stranger did go into these peoples home and take that baby. From the evidence released so far...the cadaver dog hit and the failed lie detector test, it appears my first observation may be true. In either case I do think it's important that we keep an open mind. I really am hoping for the best, I just can't ignore the evidence...Evidence doesn't lie...people do. Remember CSI Grissom?
    Sadly this is real life...JMO
     
  12. 1&2&3

    1&2&3 Well-Known Member

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    From a few days after the disappearance, my vote has been on Mom knows exactly what happened to baby Lisa! What happened is beyond me. How their house has been gone over with a fine tooth comb and LE has not come up with enough to arrest DB or find Lisa floors me!!!

    Why would a benefactor want JT to represent these parents? The few times I have heard him, he has made gross mistakes in speaking about this case, and that is unacceptable on national television in a missing child case! What he has misspoken on are his errors, nothing to do with DB & JI. He is just not familiar with the case, yet being paid big bucks.

    Find Lisa, bring her home. Do not let this be another Kyron Horman
     
  13. Peepers

    Peepers Member

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    I have changed my mind, I was on the fence, now I really think there was an accident at the home and Deb and maybe a boyfriend or lover covered it up. Im not sure JI knows anything about it.
     
  14. MissJames

    MissJames a yellowflutterby changed my life : )

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    I think there was physical abuse that led to the death of baby Lisa. I'm not sure if both parents were involved,but both parents are covering it up,IMO.

    If there was an accident and mom chose to cover it up because she was also doing something inappropriate (affair,drinking,whatever) that means she chose her lie over getting help for baby Lisa. It means she cared so little for baby Lisa that she did not react as a loving mother would,panic stricken,unaccepting that their precious child could not be helped,calling 911 and doing everything to save her baby.If she cared more about covering up whatever she was involved in then she is just as capable of harming the baby .JMO
    I don't believe accidents are covered up by loving parents . JMO.
     
  15. trillian

    trillian Member

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    Perhaps mom doesnt even know what happened. Though if you dispose of a body I imagine you would remember..clearly.

    I recall about 6mo ago, waking to find my just-turned 3yo had black scuffs on her legs. I asked her about it and she said she tried to get into the car...outside the gate...on the driveway. Evidently, I got her back inside and put her back in bed. I dont remember any of it though!! No drinking involved.
     
  16. Seth

    Seth New Member

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    I think something happened to baby Lisa under Db's care and Dad helped the cover up. If you don't cooperate with police when they have the best resourses available to help find your loved one even if you have to go through some tuff interrogations at first who are you going to have to help you in this horrible event thats taken place in your life. Doing interviews to knock down the police because of the questions your going to be asked to rule you out and esp. if you KNOW YOU DIDN'T DO ANYTHING, it's a waste of precious time in finding your baby trying to tell the world that your being treated so unfairly with interviews that could be used to plead to the public to help find your baby and ask people to help you organize hunting expeditions for instance around where the man was seen with a baby in a diaper. Instead your so paranoid that everyone is out to get you, that you forget WE SEE THAT YOUR NOT LOOKING FOR YOUR CHILD! If you didn't do it, then why aren't you out looking for your child reaching out to all the people out there that want to help you in the search for your missing child. This is about your lost baby Lisa, not YOU and your boyfriend being treated like criminals! I'd be screaming off by rooftop of my innocense and pleading for people's help! Then taking a break because your too tired to find your child, I'm sure you could have a spokes person in your family that could help you answer the media's questions when you don't feel up to it from all the truama that has happened to you and your family, but for GODSAKE don't shut out the media, they are the one's that can keep your daughter's picture and story out to the public so she has a better chance of being found. All the things they are doing, DB and TI are the opposite of what you would do to find your child!
     
  17. Darcyline

    Darcyline New Member

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    My thoughts are pretty dark right now regarding her well-being. It is hard to keep hope when both parents are acting like she is gone and the important thing is making sure they don't get accused of anything.
    I am actually more on the fence about JI being involved or not. I know popular theory is they both did it and are covering it up, but I still get this occasional feeling that he just walked into a mess and genuinely believes her when she says it was an abduction. She seems sort of manipulative to me and manipulative people are great at getting those close to them to believe their lies. I do think someone helped and if the case is cracked that other person may be the key. A lover, a brother, the teenager...someone else knows.

    All my thoughts/opinions of course.
     
  18. EarlyT79

    EarlyT79 Inactive

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    I voted mom guilty. Inconsistant statements, excessive drinking, little emotion as the days linger on. I think there was an accidental death with a coverup which included 2 people.
     
  19. highflyer

    highflyer New Member

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    Very curious case. That ex SS threat assessment specialist Dr. Randazzo was mentioned along with colleague Bill Stanton who is bodyguard/PI and high powered international attorney Tacopina things are way out there. The focus is on beautiful sweet baby Lisa but I think that it is but a precious piece of the puzzle.
     
  20. SilkySifaka

    SilkySifaka Active Member

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    I always keep in mind the phrase "everyone lies". Innocent or guilty LE have to sift through lies that may have nothing to do with what happened but are told out of embarrassment, shame, fear or a belief that its not important. Or to cover for someone elses bad behavior, again not to do with the murder/missing. Drug users will lie about that, someone having an affair will lie about their alibi. Some feel they have to keep up a facade about the perfect family or police won't look for the real perp.

    Not all people are truth tellers but it doesn't mean they are murderers either. Personally I am more suspicious when all stories dovetail perfectly. Inconsistencies are the norm, eye witness testimony is absolutely lousy ..2 different people will see different things and one person can "rethink" or overthink what they saw and come up with a second version.

    That is why I am still on the fence. I have seen no evidence that says the parents are involved, just stuff that says I don't think I particularly like either one of them.
     
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