What one thing made you sure of her guilt or innocence?

Discussion in 'Darlie Routier' started by benelly, Feb 6, 2012.

  1. chissus

    chissus Active Member

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    I don't think Darlie murdered her sons because of the sock they found in the alley.
     
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  2. lantern sky

    lantern sky Former Member

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    If many women were honest they might admit it was her 36-DDD breast implants that dictated her guilt.
     
  3. bluesneakers

    bluesneakers not today satan

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    Never heard that from anyone. I thought it was the Silly String.
     
  4. macabremom

    macabremom Member

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    The pics of her injuries are actually pretty brutal, thats the one thing that keeps me from being 100% sure she did it. Those give me reasonable doubt at least. Google them they're worse than I thought, worse than they showed on tv.
     
  5. cami

    cami Keep your fork......

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    When I first heard of this case I would not believe she was guilty either. I could not believe a mother would so brutally murder her own children. Once I started to read though I started to sway to the other side. It was the 911 call that finally convinced me of her guilt. Especially when she drops the shouting to angrily declare to Darin someone came in there.
     
  6. cami

    cami Keep your fork......

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    Her injuries were minor compared to what her boys got.
     
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  7. Zzzz

    Zzzz Active Member

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    1) I had an IV in which the tech sort of missed the vein and my arm looked EXACTLY like that, even worse. That arm bruise is an IV leak for sure. If it was a result of blows there would be many individual welts - not one long bruise.

    2) Darlie always maintained she slept through the attack and woke up to find her neck slit and the intruder walking away. She said she then followed him. If she was warding off beating blows with her arm she would have been awake and screaming. It doesn’t make sense.

    3) Look at her arm in the silly string video. That bruise should still be there. It is not.
     
  8. SandyQLS

    SandyQLS Well-Known Member

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    I think I knew about the vacuum and other staging before I knew about the blood drops on the back of her nightgown. The blood drops belong to one of the boys, are clearly drops downward, and can only have come to the back of her nightgown as she raised something bloody up high - which is the knife she stabbed her own sons with. I find those specific blood drops incontrovertible evidence of her Guilt.
     
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  9. Hatfield

    Hatfield Well-Known Member

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    JMO
    I used to mainly think this way too and could not believe she could injure herself so badly but after studying so many brutal cases here on WS I have learned not to put it past anyone how bizarre and cruel a person can be.

    And the one particular thing that I go to as an example to realize yeah she most likely did this and tried to get away with it is a movie of all things. LOL

    The Dirty Harry movie when Scorpio pays someone to beat himself up.

    I know its just a movie but I think she really could have inflicted her own damage on herself. She probably slipped a little too far and cut herself more badly than she realized she would.

    Its horrific to think someone could do self harm like that but after she killed her own kids then she probably had it in her to do some bad self harm too.

    All JMO of course
     
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  10. MsMarple

    MsMarple Well-Known Member

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    Regarding the bruises on Darlie's right arm ( BTW, all IV's were inserted into her left arm so there's no question of the phlebotomist slipping while inserting the needle), she was disrobed and thoroughly examined when she was brought into the hospital on June 6. Online photos of her in the hospital show her with either no gown or short-sleeved gowns so any bruising would have been apparent within twenty four to forty eight hours of her hospital stay.

    None of the medical notes mention any bruises on her right arm and Dr. Dillwan examined her every day with no note about bruises on her right arm, up to and including her discharge on June 8. Yet they were apparent on June 10 at the police station when they were photographed.

    It wouldn't take 4 1/2 days for bruising to show from fighting with the intruder, especially with her light complexion and eyes. IMO she deliberately hurt herself prior to meeting with detectives in order to bolster her claim of an intruder.

    And speaking of "fighting," on the 911 call Darlie claimed she fought with the intruder yet she disputed that during trial, claiming she said "frightening," not fighting - even though after her arrest she said she had no recollection of what happened that night.

    As for the bloody sock IMO it could be a red herring - the sock could have been left outside at any time. We've seen cases where a detail has much importance placed upon it only to later learn that it wasn't important after all. JMO.

    And finally, it's interesting that Darlie had written in her diary just a month before the attack what could be thought of as a suicide note:

    She also tested positive for amphetamines at the hospital. I believe she was unhappy with her weight gain from having Drake and was taking diet pills. That, combined with possible postnatal depression could have made her suicidal or at least muddled her thinking.

    I can't ignore the possibility that Darlie may have planned to take her own life that night but changed her mind (doctors described the cuts to her throat as "hesitation cuts"). JMO.

    Sorry for the long post - I didn't follow the case when it happened and only recently took a serious look at the testimony, photos, 911 call, etc. so I'm trying to get a lot of my thoughts out at once, lol.

    Anyway, that's why I believe Darlie did in fact murder her boys and after following cases here for 6 years it really doesn't seem all that different from some of the atrocities we've seen mothers commit on their babies. MOO.

    The Nurses
    Statement #3 – Darlie Routier Fact and Fiction
    911 TRANSCRIPT
    The Darlie Routier Case - THE 911 CALL
    Myth #14 – Darlie Routier Fact and Fiction
    Darlie and Darin’s Statements – Darlie Routier Fact and Fiction
     
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  11. Bastian1961

    Bastian1961 New Member

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    Along with many points others have already mentioned, it was also the lie filled letters Darlie wrote to multiple family members and her accusation that it was a male acquaintance (I forget his name) that murdered Devon and Damon. Yet when the prosecution confronted Darlie with copies of these letters and brought the man in she accused of murdering Devon and Damon, Darlie crumbled on the stand. She thought she had outsmarted her family, the public, the jury and the prosecution. Epic failure on her part.

    RIP peace Devon and Damon
     
  12. Bastian1961

    Bastian1961 New Member

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    Another reason (or two) I believe she is guilty....while watching the Werner Herzog On Death Row documentary of Darlie Routier, at the 33:09 mark Werner shows snippets of the graveside birthday celebration for Damon, commonly referred to as the Silly String party, which was a mere EIGHT days after Damon and Devon were murdered. I saw NO bruises on Darlies exposed arms....ZERO! Begs the question: are the photos circulating the internet of darlie having severely bruised arms 'doctored' to make it look worse than what they actually were? Is this a duplicitous attempt from people who believe she is innocent to garner sympathy for this murderous monster?

    Secondly, prior to the graveside festivities the family attended what had been described as a solemn tearful memorial for Devon and Damon. Oddly enough, Darlies complexion does not reflect someone who had been crying. No puffy bloodshot crying eyes, no mottled skin or red nose....nothing that leads me to believe she was mourning for her sons that were viciously murdered just eight days before. Plus, who invites the local media to film what should be an utterly tragic loss? Even as I type this out I can't help but shake my head in disbelief.

    There's so much more that could be said and am certain has already been said, so I'll just leave the link to the Werner Herzog video and let others decide.

     
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  13. MsMarple

    MsMarple Well-Known Member

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    Yes, during her testimony the prosecution asked her about several letters she wrote in which she told the recipients that she "knew" who did it. The letters cited Glen M and Gary A.

    When pressed, not only did she do her best not to answer the questions put to her, she also stated that the letters weren't dated and she always put dates on her letters. IOW, she attempted to cause doubt that she had written the letters. She backed off when she agreed it was her handwriting.

    https://darliefacts.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/66_darlie-lynn-routier.pdf

    This was just another example of how Darlie continually modified her statements which did not fit with the evidence/information, starting with the 911 call. In it she told Darin she "saw them" but in her testimony she no longer remembered the events of the night.

    Darlie and Darin’s Statements – Darlie Routier Fact and Fiction
    The Darlie Routier Case - THE 911 CALL

    IMO Darlie did her best to make the evidence fit her statements and when that failed she either changed her story or suddenly had amnesia. Darlie has had more DNA testing conducted than I've ever seen in a conviction case. So far none of the results support her innocence.

    Diane Downs continues to proclaim her innocence yet no one has taken up her cause, probably because her own daughter testified against her. Darlie made sure to leave no witnesses. MOO.
     
  14. dogperson

    dogperson Active Member

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    For me it was the blood evidence (drops on the back of her gown, plus evidence that someone had tried to wash blood off in the sink---a thing a perp wouldn't do if a hysterical mom was chasing him). The staging of the scene was amateurish too. And the knife coming from her own house. If a maniac decides to bust into a house to kill two boys, wouldn't he bring his own knife?
     
  15. InDoubt558

    InDoubt558 Member

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    Do you mean the blood spatter evidence that was provided by Charles Linch? Maybe you should consider the following facts:

    FACT: The forensic "expert" Charles Linch questioned his abilities in areas that he testified on.

    Two years after providing the scientific evidence that helped send accused child killer Darlie Routier to death row, a Dallas forensic expert questioned his abilities in areas in which he testified. A series of memos attached to a job grievance filed against the Southwestern Institute of Forensic Sciences shows that Charles Linch questioned his qualifications in hair and fiber analysis and blood-spatter interpretation - all areas in which he testified against Ms. Routier, who was accused of fatally stabbing sons Devon and Damon in 1996.

    FACT: Psychiatric issues and alcoholism plagued Charles Linch

    Mr. Linch's psychiatric treatment in 1994 for drinking and depression, raise significant questions about the credibility of his findings. Those questions could become pivotal should Ms. Routier win the new trial she is seeking and could affect several other high-profile cases in which the forensic expert has testified. Mr. Linch provided the single most critical evidence against Darlie because it went to the heart of the defense that there was an intruder. This evidence that would attack his credibility should be a basis for appeal motions.

    FACT: Charles Linch was never tested in the area of blood spatter

    Records and interviews show that Mr. Linch never took a proficiency test in blood spatters and that, shortly thereafter, supervisors substituted another analyst to testify in a pending trial.

    FACT: The Routier case was the FIRST case that Charles Linch testified on in the area of "Blood Spatter"

    According to Mr. Linch, he testified only twice about blood spatters - the first time was during Ms. Routier's bond hearing.

    FACT: Charles Linch was hospitalized for mental health issues along with alcohol problems and released in order to testify in cases and return to the hospital. (NOTE THIS WAS NOT DURING THE ROUTIER TRIAL)

    Mr. Linch said he was embittered and felt more pressure after his treatment for depression and drinking, After first agreeing to seek treatment at Methodist Medical Center at his supervisors' request, he said he later was handcuffed and involuntarily committed at Doctors Hospital for about two weeks - a scenario he said was "unnecessary and humiliating." Twice during that time - and while he was taking prescribed anti-depressants - he was released from the hospital to testify in capital-murder trials in Texas and Arkansas.

    FACT: If Routier was to get a new trial Charles Linch WILL NOT TESTIFY on blood spatter evidence.

    Mr. Linch said he would refuse to testify about blood evidence should Ms. Routier win a new trial. "If there's a retrial, the word 'blood' won't come out of my mouth," he said.

    FACT: Although he was not the primary blood spatter expert witness, he had done most of the "blood work" in the Routier case.

    Although he was not the state's primary expert on blood-spatter evidence at trial, Mr. Linch said he did much of the "blood work" in Ms. Routier's case. In what he described as an embarrassing meeting before the trial, Mr. Linch said Mr. Davis instructed him to recount for Mr. Bevel how Mr. Linch had taken samples and reached his conclusions about blood in the Routier home and the only reason he was not the primary expert witness, the only reason that Bevel was the one to testify as primary was due to the fact that "Bevel had a book" on this subject.

    Taking this even a step further......

    Welcome to the real world of forensics, where the wizardry lionized by the “CSI” television empire turns out to have serious flaws. The science of bite-mark comparisons, ballistic comparisons, fingerprint matching, blood-spatter analysis, arson investigation and other common forensic techniques has been tainted by systematic error, cognitive bias (sometimes called “tunnel vision”) and little or no research or data to support it. There is, in short, very little science behind some of the forensic “sciences” used in court to imprison and sometimes execute people.

    Popular culture also loves to promote bloodstain pattern analysis as being foolproof, but it’s anything but. Even experts with years of training at times disagree on the conclusions from this evidence.

    To be exact, false or misleading forensic science is responsible for 24 percent of the 2,258 exonerations that have occurred in this country since 1989, according to the National Registry of Exonerations.

    The incestuous relationship between police, investigators, lab personnel, and prosecutors has an awful lot to do with it. All part of one big happy team to “get those perps!”

    Some of the methods, including blood-spatter analysis, are now considered by many researchers to be scientifically dubious, responsible for dozens of wrongful convictions and deserving no place in the criminal justice system.

    The discipline is so complicated, though, that even those who put in the hours don’t always have what it takes.

    So, if your opinion relies on this "junk science" of blood-spatter analysis, you may wish to rethink that opinion. There is a women here, Routier, who is on death row based on this fact and this fact alone, that should give anyone pause. This is not forensic science it is junk science.

    THERE IS NOT ONE PIECE OF DIRECT EVIDENCE TO CONVICT ROUTIER!

    Keep this in mind......

    This could happen to any one of us and that is not justice.

    R
     
  16. cami

    cami Keep your fork......

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    No he will not testify about blood spatter i.e. cast off blood on Darlie's nightshirt in a new trial but Tom Bevel will since it was Bevel who testified about the cast off blood and not Linch. It was Bevel who did the demonstrations for the jury, not Linch. It was Bevel who testified about blood spatter not Linch.

    Linch developed PTSD whilst processing a plane crash in Dallas and started drinking. When his employers noticed he was having trouble, they advised him to seek rehab, which he did. He spent two weeks in a psychiatric unit in a hospital. But trust you Darlie supporters to use it against him and try make it appear he wasn't fully capable of processing the house and testifying.

    Linch is a fibre expert not a blood expert. So he will testify in a new trial that the fibre found on the serrated bread knife came from the Routier window screen as he did in the first trial. He will testify the white fibres found on the murder weapon came from Darlie's shirt. He will testify that luminol showed blood had been wiped from the counter beside the sink, the taps and the faucet like he did in the first trial.

    But since you can't find anything nefarious to post about Bevel you have to try and smear Charles Linch for an alcohol problem he had years prior to Darlie's trial. And you take a memo he wrote when he was in a dispute with his employers over his employment title and salary and twist it to make it appear he did something wrong in Darlie's case.

    It was actually the WM3 case he left the hospital to testify at and for the defence not the state.

    And all of it has gone before the Court of Criminal Appeals, you know actual lawyers and not just paralegals, and they found that Linch's problems years before 1996 didn't make Darlie innocent.

    And lastly, there is never going to be a new trial, there is no legal reason whatsoever to give Darlie a new trial. But she could always be tried for Devon's murder so that's a new trial for you, just not the one you want.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2019
  17. Berrybell

    Berrybell Well-Known Member

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    After watching this video and the officer describing the little boy still alive when he arrived. The child was crawling away and NOT towards Darlie. His mother!! He was not going to her for comfort or help but a way from her.
    It breaks my heart when the officer described the fear in that little boys eyes.
     
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  18. Foxone1

    Foxone1 Active Member

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    Totally guilty followed trial when she was on trial " Oh I picked up the knife, it probably have my prints on it now", vacuum cleaner and glass , blood evidence Wish she would be put to death already. Too many appeals in death penalty and then you HBO doing specials making all these murders look good. Makes me sick
     
  19. ColyH

    ColyH Well-Known Member

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    Darlie is Guilty. The reasons I believe she is guilty:
    • The 911 call. I first thought she was serious but as the call went on I noticed she wasn't crying but just yelling. Another thing about that 911 call was when the dispatcher kept asking Darlie to let the cops in and she just continued to yell "Oh my God" as if she was trying to stall for time.
    • I can understand not thinking and picking up a murder weapon but since when does a killer break into a home with the intent of killing people and forget a weapon. On top of that she claims that the killer accidentally drops the weapon in the garage as he is leaving.
    • Devon crawling away from his mother after he was stabbed.
    • The lies that Darlie got caught in after the murders. Grieving mothers don't lie to investigators leading them away from the truth. They will tell the truth so that the murderer of their children will be brought to justice.
     
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  20. Berrybell

    Berrybell Well-Known Member

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    I agree with all of the points you brought up I would like to add to them if I may?
    • The killer breaks into the home using his own knife to cut the screen to gain entrance but uses a knife from the home to commit the killings.
    • Darlie's bloody footprints are all over the place, but there are no bloody prints from the killer and none from Devon that she claims woke her and was walking around. There is no blood smudges or drops in the garage, on the window or the back fence when the killer left. I would think it would be impossible to not be covered in blood from stabbing one adult and two children.
     
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