AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #18

[MsBetsy]

Yes and if the parents had been left alive as you suggested in the post I responded to, they'd likely have a good idea about the identity of the kidnapper. JMO

I did not suggest they had been left alive. I thought you did, when you stated she would be returned to her parents. That's what confused me.

 

[peace9274]

They searched with people, dogs, and helicopters equipped with infrared.

She didn’t run away, as I believe she never had the chance.

I remember Elizabeth Smart said that, for several days, she could hear the people searching for her and the helicopters above, from the camp her perp & his wife had made prior to abducting her.

Does anyone remember why the dogs didn’t find her?

 

[Jethro4WS]

How sure can LE be, based on surveillance video, that the car in question was a Dodge Challenger? Note the Red Monte Carlo pulled out of the water in Oshkosh on the 26th. Car Found in Lake Butte des Morts

The FBI have experts that do vehicle make and model identification. Also, I am sure you have heard of facial recognition. Well, there is such a thing as Vehicle Make and Model Recognition software that exists. There are limits to human and software abilities.

However, there are physical differences between the Challenger and that specific Monte Carlo. In particular the angle (or slope) of the rear window and the length of the trunk/rear end in proportion to the length of the car overall are rather obvious. I doubt either of those differences are something an expert would get wrong. There are likely other aspects of the car dimensions relative to positions of things like any side marker lights or door handle or wheel well, etc. that can be used to differentiate one model from another or differentiate between model years for a specific make and model of vehicle.

Plus, it should be noted that law enforcement in Barron said that vehicle in Oshkosh was unrelated and police in Oshkosh dismissed it as well. That came from Paul Blume the reporter for KMSP Fox 9.

 

[Oakland CA]

So, after she runs out of the house scared, shocked and traumatized by what she just witnessed, someone driving by picks her up and now that person has her?

Highly unlikely IMO

 

[BIC]

I'm not quite sure what happened.

This sums up the whole thread.

 

[MassGuy]

So, after she runs out of the house scared, shocked and traumatized by what she just witnessed, someone driving by picks her up and now that person has her?

Highly unlikely IMO

Exactly. First off, she would have had to escape that house, which is extremely unlikely.

Secondly, some guy with nefarious intent would have had to have been driving by at that precise moment.

No one gets that lucky. Or unlucky.

 

[Lizzack1]

Delete

 

[MsBetsy]

So, after she runs out of the house scared, shocked and traumatized by what she just witnessed, someone driving by picks her up and now that person has her?

Highly unlikely IMO

Yes, I think it's pretty clear that whoever killed her parents are responsible for her abduction. Imo

 

[MsBetsy]

This sums up the whole thread.

Short and right to the point!

 

[Lizzack1]

Is there any chance the dad kicked the door in? Trying to get to his family?

JMO Why would someone targeting Jayme not expect her parents to be home at that hour? Seems implausible. Not saying Jayme couldn’t have been the target, just the scenario where someone would be surprised to find the parents home. Especially at that hour. Where else would they be?

 

[MassGuy]

JMO Why would someone targeting Jayme not expect her parents to be home at that hour? Seems implausible. Not saying Jayme couldn’t have been the target, just the scenario where someone would be surprised to find the parents home. Especially at that hour. Where else would they be?

Exactly. This person obviously came prepared for a confrontation.

He or they, knew that the family was in that house.

 

[MsFacetious]

Exactly. First off, she would have had to escape that house, which is extremely unlikely.

Secondly, some guy with nefarious intent would have had to have been driving by at that precise moment.

No one gets that lucky. Or unlucky.

It HAS happened before.... where a rape victim escapes only to be picked up by another rapist. That was in a busier area with far more people though.
There is just no way in this particular location that it's remotely possible. The odds of someone even driving by at that time would be remote, it would be more likely to be the responding officers than anyone else.

 

[peace9274]

MOO: I still think the perp that killed Jayme’s parents and abducted her, is a homeless guy that Jayme & her mother helped, either at a shelter, a soup kitchen or brought to their home to do handi-man work.

MOO: I think, like Elizabeth Smart and her mom, Denise & Jayme cared about the homeless and wanted to help them.

MOO: I think the perp/homeless guy came to the house thinking he could get in and abduct Jayme without waking her parents.

But, I think James woke up and heard the perp trying to get in. James got his gun and opened the door slightly (chain locked). Perp pushed the door open, breaking the door/frame. A physical altercation began, perp got the gun and shot James and then Denise.

Perp realized 911 had been called - he grabbed gun and Jayme and left.
If not by car, then into the woods.

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

It HAS happened before.... where a rape victim escapes only to be picked up by another rapist. That was in a busier area with far more people though.
There is just no way in this particular location that it's remotely possible. The odds of someone even driving by at that time would be remote, it would be more likely to be the responding officers than anyone else.

Definitely. I could see that happening in some inner city/gang infested area. But not here, in a rural area, at that hour

 

[badgersmythe]

MOO: I still think the perp that killed Jayme’s parents and abducted her, is a homeless guy that Jayme & her mother helped, either at a shelter, a soup kitchen or brought to their home to do handi-man work.

MOO: I think, like Elizabeth Smart and her mom, Denise & Jayme cared about the homeless and wanted to help them.

MOO: I think the perp/homeless guy came to the house thinking he could get in and abduct Jayme without waking her parents.

But, I think James woke up and heard the perp trying to get in. James got his gun and opened the door slightly (chain locked). Perp pushed the door open, breaking the door/frame. A physical altercation began, perp got the gun and shot James and then Denise.

Perp realized 911 had been called - he grabbed gun and Jayme and left.
If not by car, then into the woods.

MOO

I’ve been thinking along these lines too. I think it’s someone that wouldn’t have left any digital traces, as they’d met in person via church or soup kitchen as you suggest.

 

[MsBetsy]

JMO Why would someone targeting Jayme not expect her parents to be home at that hour? Seems implausible. Not saying Jayme couldn’t have been the target, just the scenario where someone would be surprised to find the parents home. Especially at that hour. Where else would they be?

I don't think he assumed they were not home. I don't think he cared. He didn't hesitate to shoot them both. Either that or he intended to kill them in the first place. Jmo

 

[SandyQLS]

That's awful to imagine that someone would just dump another person in a field to decompose I sure hope this has nothing to do with Jayme. I'm surprised that there's no initial identification as far as age, height, or sex, must be pretty bad. I guess we'll know a bit more tomorrow though...

Hair does not decompose easily or soon iirc from very ancient gravesites because it is already dead tissue. Since they called in the drug & gang unit and not the FBI, I am betting the body in MN is a young black male likely missing from St Paul/Minn or even Chicago, maybe with some gang articles of clothing like a red hat or bandana. JMO I don't think it is related to this case.

 

[Wrenny]

It HAS happened before.... where a rape victim escapes only to be picked up by another rapist.

Yike!

The odds of someone even driving by at that time would be remote,

It IS a US highway.

 

[BeeGirl]

I remember Elizabeth Smart said that, for several days, she could hear the people searching for her and the helicopters above, from the camp her perp & his wife had made prior to abducting her.

Does anyone remember why the dogs didn’t find her?

I think dogs are only optimal in certain situations.

 

[Wrenny]

MOO:
James got his gun and opened the door slightly (chain locked).

People keep bringing up this idea. Do people really rely on a chain lock for their outside door security? I don't remember ever having a front door without a deadbolt.