AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #25

[jayaxx]

Widely rumored you hear a gunshot??
If the gunshot is audible wouldn’t the dispatcher immediately say to responding officer... be aware shots fired ??

That gun was loud af. I would think if it was on call we would know...

you could be right... and I agree.. wouldn’t want to hear.

If there is a chance it could help find this girl, I would listen to it.

 

[Mom24]

Agree...taking Jayme makes no sense to me in any scenario where she was not the motive.

That's my problem too. Every other scenario makes no sense

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

What is the context of those quotes by the sheriff? Especially the second one. Context is important for deciphering his meaning IMO. LE has clearly stated this is not a suicide. This is a double homicide. The ME's report is finalized. To insist it could still be suicide or to say maybe LE is lying for some reason is hurtful to the family and could be harmful to the investigation as well. JMO.

Here are some other things the sheriff said recently:

Sheriff Fitzgerald keeping hope Jayme Closs is still alive, calls it the worst crime in county history

They have had murder suicides before, why would this crime be worse if one parent was secretly a suicide?




Sheriff Fitzgerald keeping hope Jayme Closs is still alive, calls it the worst crime in county history

He is calling this a targeted attack and he is operating under the assumptions:
1. Jayme was the target.
2. She was taken against her will.
and 3. She was not involved.
Again, how would suicide of one of the parents fit into a scenario like this? What possible reason would LE have to keep something like that quiet and flat out lie to the community and her family? LE does sometimes lie but usually it would be more in the vein of misdirection or evading answering questions directly (like if they had decided not to release the causes of death in this case). Lying about something like this would cause a huge loss of trust and I cannot imagine what purpose it would serve. JMO.

I don't disagree. And, if you carefully read what I have written, you'll notice I haven't posited that one of the deaths may have been a suicide. Instead, what I've said is that the language of LE in the instances cited seems to suggest that they would have possibly viewed one of the deaths as a suicide, if a gun had been left on the scene.

Could one of the deaths have been meant to look like a suicide -- as part of a plan, before that plan went South? And that is what's behind the somewhat cryptic remarks from the Sheriff and the department? I dunno. I'm just trying to understand.

 

[Pretty Go Pale]

I understand the issue. It is problematic.

I don't know when the first bullet point was said but I expect that it was early. However, the second bullet point quote came much later.

The first one certainly could be based on initial investigation and preliminary notions of the crime flow but the second came later after law enforcement would have enhanced the 911 call and was able to model the crime flow and have a good understanding of how the crime played out and yet he says the same thing. So the conundrum is why would the Sheriff have an expectation, given what they know about the crime flow, that the firearm used in the crime would be found at the scene and yet it wasn't.

What it suggests to me is that what transpired into the Closs home that night is not consistent with how the crime is being perceived in the media (or even here at WS). Clearly if this was a home invasion style crime the Sheriff should have no expectation that the perpetrator would leave their weapon behind at the scene.

Thanks for the response - that is exactly my feeling.

 

[Quill]

It is non union so who knows what the working conditions are. There are no work rules in the US except there has to be a toilet break every four hours someone works.

Anything else such as lunch, overtime, coffee breaks, are megotiated by unions for employees. Otherwise, one is totally at the mercy of the company.

I imagine finding people to do that job is not easy. So maybe he could work those hours because of labor shortage.

Maybe he was saving up for a fun family vacation or an RV or a new house. Who knows.

Well, not exactly.

" The law requires employers to provide their employees with working conditions that are free of known dangers. The OSH Act created the Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA), which sets and enforces protective workplace safety and health standards".

DH has worked his entire career in manufacturing in union facilities as well as non-union.

 

[human]

St. Charles police searching for suspect in home invasion

Well that said nothing.

 

[Gardener1850]

I don't disagree. And, if you carefully read what I have written, you'll notice I haven't posited that one of the deaths may have been a suicide. Instead, what I've said is that the language of LE in the instances cited seems to suggest that they would have possibly viewed one of the deaths as a suicide, if a gun had been left on the scene.

Could one of the deaths have been meant to look like a suicide -- as part of a plan, before that plan went South? And that is what's behind the somewhat cryptic remarks from the Sheriff and the department? I dunno. I'm just trying to understand.

Oh, I see. My apologies for not getting your implication before, but there are other posters pushing the narrative that maybe one was a suicide. But if someone wanted to make this crime scene look like a suicide scene why would they take the gun? Are you thinking there were two perps and one of them took the gun that had been positioned in someone's hand? Plus, the scene did not look like a suicide for very long. It was only an initial impression on the dispatch log. It was changed on the log once investigated and later officially ruled double homicide by the ME. So I'm not sure why we would come to the conclusion someone tried to make it look like suicide, only because of the first responding officers very first impressions-- there is no way the perp(s) could predict what police would first think or first see upon arriving. From the sounds of it the perp(s) were there for very little time and did not leave much evidence behind. Would the sheriff say that if they had left a note? I don't think so. JMO.

 

[bellyup]

Well, not exactly.

" The law requires employers to provide their employees with working conditions that are free of known dangers. The OSH Act created the Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA), which sets and enforces protective workplace safety and health standards".DH has worked his entire career in manufacturing in union facilities as well as non-union.

And if you look it up, this Jennie-O plant doesn't exactly have a clean OSHA history.

 

[Bluepopsicle]

I understand the issue. It is problematic.

I don't know when the first bullet point was said but I expect that it was early. However, the second bullet point quote came much later.

The first one certainly could be based on initial investigation and preliminary notions of the crime flow but the second came later after law enforcement would have enhanced the 911 call and was able to model the crime flow and have a good understanding of how the crime played out and yet he says the same thing. So the conundrum is why would the Sheriff have an expectation, given what they know about the crime flow, that the firearm used in the crime would be found at the scene and yet it wasn't.

What it suggests to me is that what transpired into the Closs home that night is not consistent with how the crime is being perceived in the media (or even here at WS). Clearly if this was a home invasion style crime the Sheriff should have no expectation that the perpetrator would leave their weapon behind at the scene.

Why would anyone leave their gun behind though, for any crime? I mean, I know it happens sometimes, I guess I just assumed that would be accidental, not purposefully. For example, if there was a struggle, or something like that. But why would there ever be an expectation of a perp leaving their gun behind?

 

[human]

Well, not exactly.

" The law requires employers to provide their employees with working conditions that are free of known dangers. The OSH Act created the Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA), which sets and enforces protective workplace safety and health standards".

DH has worked his entire career in manufacturing in union facilities as well as non-union.

I believe the discussion was about working all of those hours and his wages.

 

[Gardener1850]

Why would anyone leave their gun behind though, for any crime? I mean, I know it happens sometimes, I guess I just assumed that would be accidental, not purposefully. For example, if there was a struggle, or something like that. But why would there ever be an expectation of a perp leaving their gun behind?

The Godfather - Leave The Gun, Take The cannoli

Perp must not have ever watched the Godfather. LOL.

 

[VeryVeritas]

And if you look it up, this Jennie-O plant doesn't exactly have a clean OSHA history.

What is the theory here, disgruntled co-worker? FBI no doubt has lists of current, former and peripheral co-workers, vendors, etc. Running those lists against other lists can zero in on them

 

[bellyup]

What is the theory here, disgruntled co-worker? FBI no doubt has lists of current, former and peripheral co-workers, vendors, etc. Running those lists against other lists can zero in on them

I have no idea what other peoples theories are. I was just responding to posts with information.

I'm sure LE has looked at some co-workers. I don't believe it possible to even come close to clearing them all. I also don't believe this has anything to do with a person from work but that's just my opinion.

 

[Rubiconbob]

Person whose bones were found by dog in western Wisconsin was shot in head – Twin Cities

That person was found
15 minutes/ 20 minutes from Closs family home... 2 streets over ....they were either shot then later buried there.. or shot there and buried. Body been there 1 yr. so in last 24 months in town of 3400 people. 3 people shot and killed and nobody has any idea who did it.??

I’d have 4 home cams and flood lights galore if I lived in that town. Still don’t know why u wouldn’t tell residents get home cam... your home owners insurance will pay for it...

Plus next murder will be solved ...,

 

[Whiskers16]

That's assuming that James was being paid OT. With 27 years at the company I am going to bet he was salaried management. Which would mean no over time pay required but they can demand hours out of you. You do it to keep your job because there isn't exactly a ton of other options in the area.

I work in a manufacturing plant where we have people with 35-40 years of service on the manufacturing floor. Some people are not interested in, and/or not cut out for, a management role.

 

[bellyup]

Deleted because contained incorrect information

 

[Randazzo]

Am I the only one who doesn't buy that there have been no murders in Barron since 2002? Would be great if it were true, but that's just doesn't sound right.

 

[Bluepopsicle]

Person whose bones were found by dog in western Wisconsin was shot in head – Twin Cities

That person was found
15 minutes/ 20 minutes from Closs family home... 2 streets over ....they were either shot then later buried there.. or shot there and buried. Body been there 1 yr. so in last 24 months in town of 3400 people. 3 people shot and killed and nobody has any idea who did it.??

I’d have 4 home cams and flood lights galore if I lived in that town. Still don’t know why u wouldn’t tell residents get home cam... your home owners insurance will pay for it...

Plus next murder will be solved ...,

There’s no telling how long that body’s been there though. Sounds to me like it could have been there a very long time.

 

[cody22]

Am I the only one who doesn't buy that there have been no murders in Barron since 2002? Would be great if it were true, but that's just doesn't sound right.

If my memory is correct, there was at least one murder/suicide case in Barron, in recent years, linked on a much earlier thread.

 

[ab01]

Does anybody have a plausible theory in which this may have a positive outcome? I have played different scenarios over and over and with each day it seems less and less likely...so many questions and so few answers!