Discussion in 'The Zodiac Killer' started by gaia227, Aug 29, 2008.
This was on the news today
As far as I know, Denis Kaufman turned Jack Tarrance's prints into the San Francisco PD two years ago, and they didn't match the prints in the Zodiac file. I am extremely skeptical.
Just saw this on Yahoo news. Incredible if this is infact the actual hood worn by Zodiac. The man in question, Jack Torrance, deceased, does look like the composite and the hand writing from what I saw looks close. Could this be actually true? I have never heard this name associated as a suspect in the crimes before, has anyone else??
I'm extremely skeptical as well - Kaufman has been making this claim for years. He's always struck me as being, um, unhinged.
But, hey, if it turns out to be true, I suppose Kaufman had a really good reason for coming across as an obsessive fruitloop.
Very intriguing. I know nothing about the ZK, but this information seems credible to me. Something new to research, anyway!
It's a little too close on the heels of the latest Bigfoot hoax for me.
It's been rumored that the Zodiac kept 'memories' of his crimes in a little metal box. I noticed Kaufman has one of those now.
However, all the film he showed is fairly recent---disposable cameras didn't hit the market until 1986. Is he claiming that Torrance has been killing all this time?
That IS what the Zodiac said he would do--kill but without claiming credit for the crimes.
I can't wait to hear more! It's about time to uncover the Z killer.
This is what AMW posted on 2/23/2007 about Jack Tarrance.
View LargerName: Jack Tarrance
1928 - 2006
Occupations: Honorable discharge from US Air Force; Navy; Ham Radio operator; Steele company worker; General Electric test foreman; Laundry attendant.
Jack Tarrance is not a name often associated with the Zodiac murders. In fact, he was not even considered a suspect until the summer of 2000, when his stepson, Dennis Kaufman, watched a Zodiac Killer documentary. Dennis became convinced that Jack Tarrance is the Zodiac. His research has produced some intriguing and complex clues.
I watched one og the links of him showing some of the stuff and i font know he came across pretty credible to me....I d0 think though that in our minds we almost do not ever want this case to be solved he was so infamous that i think its much easier and makes for a better story when it was never knowen ho had done it and i think thats a big reason some people are skepticle..J,M,O
This isnt going to amount to much.
I beleive this same guy was trying to sell a piece of what he said was paul Stine's bloody shirt on Ebay.
I was reading somewhere last night that he also found an old knife that could possibly have dried blood on it, had old photos developed that show dead people, closely matching handwriting samples, and he believes his stepfather smothered his mother. Kaufman does match the sketch pretty well.
So far there's not even credible evidence that the handwriting samples he presents are from Tarrance. Kaufman has tried to sell pieces of "Stine's shirt" and for a while, his website claimed Tarrance was the Texarkana Phantom as well, but I can't provide a link to prove it.
Bear in mind that Kaufman's now pushing a movie.
And yeah, I DO want the Zodiac case solved. Murderers shouldn't be legendary, they should be captured - or at least identified.
Yeah,except look at any college yearbook from 1969 I guarantee youll find 30 guys who match the composite perfectly.
That look was kind of the equivlant of having a composite today of a white guy between 25 and 45 with a shaved head and a goatee.
In my town you would see 20 guys like that before you got three blocks down mainstreet.
There are a few very compelling suspects,but this fellow is a fraud.
Hes liable to get in trouble if he keeps doing things like messing with the FBI.
To my knowledge there are no known, verified prints or DNA that can be said to definitively be that of Zodiac.
Anyone can correct me if they are wrong, but I believe it is correct to say that the only verified, provable link to the real Zodiac are to be found at the Lake murder. Before Cynthia Shepard passed away she described the individual, his height and weight and was established to be approximately 6 feet tall and weight between 220 and 250 pounds. She actually saw his face. She told this to Officer Collins who arrived there and was comforting her prior to the arrival of the ambulance which had to traverse a winding road to the site where she lay dying (about 1 hour). At the roadside where she and her boyfriend (still living) parked their car were some bootprints identified as "Wingwalker" type boots; size 10 1/2. Through comparison of a deputy at the scene it was established that the individual weighted in excess of 230 pounds. To my knowledge this is the ONLY proof of who Zodiac was. Who met those physical dimensions and who was in the area at the time of this murder and all of the other known Zodiac murders (there were only six verified murders)? Such an individual died in 1992.
He was never tied to any of the murders through DNA nor fingerprints. Conversely, it could not be said, contrary to assertions, that any DNA or fingerprints from any scenes exonerated him simply because there was no provable chain of custody; such as the DNA recovered from beneath the stamps, for example. No one has ever been tied to any of those DNA or fingerprints. There are no DNA or fingerprints on file that can be said to be definitely that of Zodiac.
The only thing that will ever tie anyone to Zodiac is something that only he could have in his possession that came from one of the crime scenes. That, to this time, has never materialized.
I've looked at this guy very closely and do not rule him out completely. His physical dimensions do match that of Zodiac. There are other interesting aspects of his character. There are only three individuals who I would seriously consider as being Zodiac. They are this one, Allen and another individual whose physical proportions and weight do not match the Lake crime. Nonetheless, based on other evidence I have seen, I would not rule him out. In my opinion, Zodiac died in 1992. But then again, who knows? Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
There is one interesting aspect of Tarrance that bears mentioning. In the Lake murder, Zodiac mentioned the state prison of Deer Lodge, Montana. I have attributed that to his lame attempt at deflecting the investigation. If I recall correctly, Tarrance does have some connections or made mention of Montana. Probably no more than a coincidence but interesting, nonetheless.
Obviously the alleged hood is of great interest.
It's interesting, i'll believe more when the Feds are done testing the items.
There was a finger print in the Paul Stine cab I think? But they don't know absolutely that it was Zodiac's correct? I would love to see the case solved just so he wouldn't "get away with it". Even if the guy is dead, it would be a semblance of closure.
I leaned toward Allen but then some claim alot of what Graysmith wrote in both books was slanted heavily toward what he believed and some things flat out fabricated.
I think in his 2nd book there's a brief post note that the Lake Berryessa survivor saw and identified Allen as the man who attacked them and then there are statements saying Ferrin's sister and friends identified Tarrance as the man harrassing her? Of course someone stalking you won't necessarily mean he killed her.
The frustrating part is you can read arguments in favor of various suspects and they sound very convincing. I believed with all my heart it WAS Allen, but now I tend to be skeptical. If the son's arguments and "facts" were really all true, it would be hard to disagree with his step dad's guilt.
And it could be more then one killer with one claiming kills that weren't "his". The high school students' murder is very similar to Ferrin/Ferraday but the Lake murder is very different. Though I would say the letter writer is certainly the Ferrin killer since that letter was most detailed about specific actions so the killer had to write it. But the other murders aren't detailed as specifically so it would be possible to claim them without being there. And of course Stine was done by the Ferrin killer if all the letters had the same author beacause of the bloody shirt.
Fascinating but very frustrating case.
The fingerprint in Stine's cab was always believed to be unreliable in that they didn't know how or who put it there. Unless it can be traced to a specific person it doesn't really prove much.
Some of the witnesses are not reliable including family members. In the "Director's Cut" there are extended discussions with principles that shed a good deal about what took place. I was very impressed with Officer Collins who ministered to Cynthia Shepard as she was lying near death. I was also impressed with the detective who investigated Stine's murder. He also cast considerable doubt on one of the patrolman's recollection. One of the most strange interviews was with the responding officer to Ferrin's murder. But the individual interviewed who claimed that Allen approached him to perform mob hits was certainly a smoking gun if it could be established as true.
There is also one very interesting account of a young woman who was a student of Allen's who moved to Wisconsin. And she writes home to say she saw him in Wisconsin. If that is true, it certainly is most interesting.
I can't discount this new revelation if it proves out but until I see something that seems more definitive, I'll continue to believe that Allen was Zodiac. I believe it is correct to say that most long time investigators believed Zodiac was Allen. Unfortunately for the investigation he dropped dead from the effects of diabetes and heart disease when he was but 58 years old. I believe an indictment was in the process at the time. At the end of his life he pleaded with a reporter to believe he was not the Zodiac. It would have been more helpful if he had tried to take the time to work with the investigators instead of taunting them. The only suspect who ever contacted Toschi was Allen when he got out of prison on the sex deviency charges. There were no Zodiac letters during his imprisonment. As an aside, Allen had a near genius IQ, but an abject failure in life and a complete bust as to possible romantic relationships.
So if Allen is the zodiac, how do you explain his DNA not matching the stamp on the envelope that Zodiac sent? Do you think he had someone else stamp it for him? I guess that would make sense.
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