Brazil -- Murder probe after 3 die from eating arsenic-laced Xmas cake. Baker's husband recently died of food poisoning. 23 Dec 2024.

vls12345

Well-Known Member
Websleuths Guardian
Joined
Sep 7, 2021
Messages
5,465
Reaction score
43,129
  • #1
  • #2
  • #3
  • #4
wow, that is coldhearted. Baking an arsenic cake for family Christmas dinner?
 
Last edited:
  • #5
wow, that is coldhearted. Baking an arsenic cake for family Christmas dinner?
Yeah, poisoners are something else. You have to want to watch someone suffer, and not care if another person by chance eats or drinks the same thing.

I hate poisoners about as much as I hate bombers. There's a deep level of spite and callousness involved in both crimes. They're indiscriminate and sadistic.

MOO
 
  • #6
Have to hold my urge to pass judgment just yet as the article notes “Zeli Terezinha Silva dos Anjos, 61, who prepared the cake with her sister, and a 10-year-old boy were hospitalized after falling ill. The third victim hospitalized has not been revealed.”

If Zeli, the baker of said cake also ate the cake and fell ill, it begs the question if this was an intentional poisoning, or and intentional misdirection with the “illness”.

Past dead husband is not helping her case however…

Curious.
 
  • #7
Yeah, poisoners are something else. You have to want to watch someone suffer, and not care if another person by chance eats or drinks the same thing.

I hate poisoners about as much as I hate bombers. There's a deep level of spite and callousness involved in both crimes. They're indiscriminate and sadistic.

MOO
Also, both poisoners and bombers tend to be repeat offenders.

Poisoners in particular, especially family poisoners, can sometimes go quite a while before being caught. Once they decide poison solves their problem, they have no compunction about using it again. A lot of the development of modern forensic science came about because of a need to be able to identify death by poison. Arsenic was commonly used not just for rodents but in everything from industry to cosmetics, and was easy to obtain. Poisoners find it harder to get hold of these days, but it's still possible. It's less commonly used because it's very easy to detect at autopsy - those early forensic scientists discovered it remains in its crystalline form in the organs, even in the brain.

Poisoners have moved on from the Agatha Christie staples, but there have been a few arsenic cases lately, including the killing of Angela Craig. Her husband used both arsenic and cyanide on her, despite having access to medical drugs through his work as a dentist. They're not commonly tested for, but all it takes is one suspicious doctor or pathologist.

MOO
 
  • #8
Per the BBC article linked in post 2 above, the 'baker' had the highest level of arsenic present in her bloodstream. It also says that the Brazilian police were told (by whom, they don't say) that she alone had two slices of the cake.

A very bizarre family annihilator act? That seems far-fetched, given that acute arsenic poisoning is a very unpleasant way to go.

I hope that the cake that is out at their lab provides some kind of an answer.
 
  • #9
Per the BBC article linked in post 2 above, the 'baker' had the highest level of arsenic present in her bloodstream. It also says that the Brazilian police were told (by whom, they don't say) that she alone had two slices of the cake.

A very bizarre family annihilator act? That seems far-fetched, given that acute arsenic poisoning is a very unpleasant way to go.

I hope that the cake that is out at their lab provides some kind of an answer.
I'm wondering if they have reason to suspect that another person adulterated her ingredients. The article says that she is not considered a suspect at this time.

MOO
 
  • #10
"With the evidence we have collected, we do not know whether the poisoning was negligent or intentional," he said, according to the Daily Mail, "So far, I have not been able to find any intentional conduct. However, other evidence that comes to light may contradict what I think now. This is an investigation that requires great caution."

Back in September, Zeli's husband, Paulo Luiz, died of food poisoning. Now, police will exhume the body and examine it, following investigations related to the deaths of Maida, Neuza, and Tatiana

Preliminary blood tests detected arsenic in the victims, prompting a deeper investigation. Authorities are also re-examining the death of Zeli's husband, Paulo Luiz, who died from suspected food poisoning in September. His body is scheduled for exhumation to determine if his death was related to the recent poisonings, the New York Post reported.

During the investigation, police discovered expired food products and a suspicious white liquid in a medicine bottle at Zeli's residence. Zeli, who also fell ill after consuming the cake, is cooperating with authorities. There are no reported inheritance disputes among the family, and the motive behind the poisonings remains unclear.
 
Last edited:
  • #11
Zeli’s 10-year-old great nephew is also hospitalised after eating a piece, and another unnamed family member — understood to be Tatiana’s husband — was released

Lead investigator Marcos Vinicius Veloso, from Torres Police Station, announced the case has been upgraded to homicide.

He said cops have taken 10 statements from other family members — but for now, there is “no malicious conduct”.

Detectives also raided six properties of people involved in the poisoning on Friday.

1735491496228.jpeg

Images provided by police and posted online showed a partially served cake of dried fruit with white marzipan icing and maraschino cherries on top

*Now how many slices were served, they must have been small slices? I wonder if the slice shown was the same size for all served.
 
Last edited:
  • #12
Zeli’s 10-year-old great nephew is also hospitalised after eating a piece, and another unnamed family member — understood to be Tatiana’s husband — was released

Lead investigator Marcos Vinicius Veloso, from Torres Police Station, announced the case has been upgraded to homicide.

He said cops have taken 10 statements from other family members — but for now, there is “no malicious conduct”.

Detectives also raided six properties of people involved in the poisoning on Friday.

View attachment 554465
Images provided by police and posted online showed a partially served cake of dried fruit with white marzipan icing and maraschino cherries on top

*Now how many slices were served, they must have been small slices? I wonder if the slice shown was the same size for all served.
If that was the actual cake, the slices must have been tiny. I'm wondering just how much arsenic was present, to kill three people, and to make the cake taste "peppery" over the strong flavours of the spices, booze, dried fruit, marzipan and dark sugar generally present in many styles of fruit cake. It must have been a massive amount.

MOO
 
  • #13
With arsenic, a person can slowly build up tolerance. One can take small amounts over a long period of time. Then what would have been a lethal dose won't work.

"There is evidence that humans and other animals can build up tolerance to the toxic effects of arsenic. A society of “arsenic eaters” who deliberately consumed arsenic-laden soils in their religious practices developed a high tolerance for arsenic. Rasputin was reported to regularly ingest arsenic to build tolerance and to protect himself from poisoning."
 
  • #14
With arsenic, a person can slowly build up tolerance. One can take small amounts over a long period of time. Then what would have been a lethal dose won't work.

"There is evidence that humans and other animals can build up tolerance to the toxic effects of arsenic. A society of “arsenic eaters” who deliberately consumed arsenic-laden soils in their religious practices developed a high tolerance for arsenic. Rasputin was reported to regularly ingest arsenic to build tolerance and to protect himself from poisoning."
It's easy enough with testing to determine when and for how long someone has been ingesting a poison like arsenic. I imagine that all the victims including the family member who passed in September will be tested this way. It used to be done by segmenting hair samples into lengths, don't know if that's still the process or if something more whizbang has replaced it. The presence of banding on the fingernails is also a classic sign of long term ingestion.

MOO
 
  • #15
The family ate the cake in an apartment in Torres, where Maida lived with her husband. Police chief Mr Veloso said inquiries showed there had been a power cut at the address, and that Zeli found the fridge turned off when he arrived. He added: “When she went into the property there was an unbearable smell. Some of the things in the fridge, perishable foods like meat, were thrown away. But other items were re-used. What we’re trying to confirm is that some of those items, like currants and other crystallised fruit, could have been used in the cake a month later.”
Arsenic can develop in seafood, rice, mushrooms and poultry, though many other foods including some fruit juices can also contain it.
 
  • #16
The family ate the cake in an apartment in Torres, where Maida lived with her husband. Police chief Mr Veloso said inquiries showed there had been a power cut at the address, and that Zeli found the fridge turned off when he arrived. He added: “When she went into the property there was an unbearable smell. Some of the things in the fridge, perishable foods like meat, were thrown away. But other items were re-used. What we’re trying to confirm is that some of those items, like currants and other crystallised fruit, could have been used in the cake a month later.”
Arsenic can develop in seafood, rice, mushrooms and poultry, though many other foods including some fruit juices can also contain it.
Her husband died from food poisoning? Did anybody try to figure out which food poisoned him? Even if death didn't seem suspicious, you'd think somebody would look into which food killed him.
 
  • #17
The family ate the cake in an apartment in Torres, where Maida lived with her husband. Police chief Mr Veloso said inquiries showed there had been a power cut at the address, and that Zeli found the fridge turned off when he arrived. He added: “When she went into the property there was an unbearable smell. Some of the things in the fridge, perishable foods like meat, were thrown away. But other items were re-used. What we’re trying to confirm is that some of those items, like currants and other crystallised fruit, could have been used in the cake a month later.”
Arsenic can develop in seafood, rice, mushrooms and poultry, though many other foods including some fruit juices can also contain it.
Now I'm leaning towards them eating some tainted food, accidentally. If fruit juices can contain a buildup of arsenic, it's possible they used outdated fruit juice or crystallised fruit or currants way past the used date.

I just thought it odd that she ate 2 pieces of the cake herself. And I can't yet see the motive for poisoning her sisters and 10 yr old nephew on Christmas Eve. Unless she is very severely mentally twisted.
 
  • #18
Hard for me to believe that a juice can naturally build up a large amount of arsenic. Or this sort of thing would be happening all the time.
 
  • #19
Food products can naturally have arsenic, but it's at very low levels.
"Very low levels of inorganic and organic arsenic are found in many food products, according to the National Institutes of Health. Testing is routine, as slightly elevated levels of either form can cause symptoms such as vomiting, abdominal pain, diarrhea, numbness and muscle cramping."
 
  • #20
Maybe they died of food poisoning but the presence of arsenic from the fruit juice and fruit are incidental and misled the investigators? Or, maybe a third party poisoned them all, like a servant or maid. Even in less wealthy households in Brazil, it's not uncommon to have outside help.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
64
Guests online
2,252
Total visitors
2,316

Forum statistics

Threads
632,750
Messages
18,631,186
Members
243,277
Latest member
Xotic
Back
Top