Laura Babcock Murder Trial 11.21.17 - Day 19

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Thanks for sharing that, at least she showed some emotion which the monsters DM and MS have not in either trial.
Meneses is 23 — the same age as Babcock when she disappeared in July 2012. She never knew her, but as Meneses passed her grieving family in court, she looked at them in sympathy, the tears streaming down her face.

She’s done what she could.


Nice exit MM.
 
Charles Manson just died at 83 and the world is a better place for it. DM had many followers like Manson and they were willing to murder for Manson. Many of the hangers-on were willing to do illegal things for DM. It seems that in history these type of sickos show up and like Manson the world would be a better place without DM and MS.
 
There is so much evidence to think about but it just occurred to me that the simple fact that DM / MS were in possession of LB's iPad, is one of the most damning pieces of evidence, IMO. And then when SL contacted DM to ask him if he had any information about LB's disappearance, DM doesn't offer up that she left her iPad with him?? Any innocent person would have done so, IMO and even if DM didn't want LB around, if he had a clear conscience he would have absolutely no reason not to assist SL by providing him with LB's iPad. Also, MS knew he and MM had LB's iPad so there is no excuse for him either if he was innocent for not giving it up to LE once it was public knowledge that she was missing and yet he didn't. Damning IMO for both DM and MS.

IMO, it is not logical that LB would leave the iPad that was only on loan to her by SL with anyone else and just go off into oblivion and then shut off her phone and have no way to connect with others.

I hope the many little pieces of evidence lead the jury to make the big decision to convict both DM and MS of M1. The more I think about it all tonight, the more confident I feel that the proper verdicts will be delivered soon.

ALL MOO

This made my think... MM said she never heard of Laura babcock. Yet they had her iPad. So her name was never spoken, her pictures and info weren't on that iPad? Doubtful. Where did they tell her they got the iPad from? Why doesn't the crown ask these questions?

Also, MS had LBs luggage. She would have seen her name on it at some point?
 
This made my think... MM said she never heard of Laura babcock. Yet they had her iPad. So her name was never spoken, her pictures and info weren't on that iPad? Doubtful. Where did they tell her they got the iPad from? Why doesn't the crown ask these questions?

Also, MS had LBs luggage. She would have seen her name on it at some point?

It wasn’t Laura’s iPad. It was borrowed from SL just a couple days before for apartment hunting. She probably had no personal information or pictures on it.
 
It wasn’t Laura’s iPad. It was borrowed from SL just a couple days before for apartment hunting. She probably had no personal information or pictures on it.

You don't think so? Not even a conversation in the messages? Or even ask where it came from?
 
Thanks for this. I find it completely bizarre to say no real evidence. I’ve followed many trials before where people are convicted on less than that.

I don't think that anyone suggested that there wasn't any real evidence against DM.

DM is toast. It's MS that the Crown is struggling with.
 
This made my think... MM said she never heard of Laura babcock. Yet they had her iPad. So her name was never spoken, her pictures and info weren't on that iPad? Doubtful. Where did they tell her they got the iPad from? Why doesn't the crown ask these questions?

Also, MS had LBs luggage. She would have seen her name on it at some point?
They were deleting things off the iPad and the luggage tag was hidden which was why it was never taken off.
 
Have the exhibits been released from today yet? I am curious to see the time stamp on the text MM sent DM on September 30th -- the night MS was out "painting" and never came home.

Per Bill Andrew's timeline, MS was arrested for spray-painting the overpass on Sep. 29. On Oct 1, MS sends DM a pic of a 3500 tow truck. By Oct 2, he and DM are planning to steal lawnmowers (and MS says if MM and Arthur are willing to come, would be nice to have spotters).
 
we knew those things but the jury didn't

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what the crown established today with AM's testimony. Am I missing something? He was asked to keep tabs on LB's whereabouts (we already knew that), he sent DM the missing persons report (we also already knew that), there was animosity between DM, LB, and CN (we also already knew that) and he basically gave no further insight to any of it.

It saddened me greatly to hear him say "they didn't think very highly of her", as if that's an appropriate reason to dismiss and disregard someone's disappearance. It broke my heart a little bit, for Laura and her family.

As the crowns case is coming to a close, I can't help but share the sentiment of others here that it's been rather anticlimactic, and I'm concerned. With only two more "quick" witnesses left, can anyone speculate as to who they might be?
 
You don't think so? Not even a conversation in the messages? Or even ask where it came from?

I don’t assume she’d be iMessaging Shawn Lerner’s contacts, no. She had a very active social life on her own phone. I’m sure there was some story about where it came from, but no reason to think anybody beyond the accused should have been suspicious it had been in the possesion of Laura Babcock.
 
we knew those things but the jury didn't

The jury had already seen the texts, but I think the reinforcement of the “bad blood” evidence from another person was not unimportant. We now have that from both sides - a friend of CN and a friend of DM.
 
Still intrigued by DM's matress dilemma, was it blood from a gunshot, or expelled bodily fluids from strangulation. And where was LB rolled in the blue tarp, maple gate? Or the hangar/farm?
 
The Crown has brought some things into evidence: the van, CN working at a day camp, pic of the tarp with item wrapped inside, video of dog playing with purple slippers, etc but then nothing more is said about these things. There are supposedly only a couple of Crown witnesses left and I doubt it is about forensics if the testimony is not expected to take much time (per a tweet posted earlier and posted on this thread). What's the point of bringing all this stuff into evidence and then just leaving things hanging... sort of like the garden hose in the TB trial? Is there that much still under publication ban considering we're almost done the Crown's part of the 2nd trial for these two guys?
 
I don’t assume she’d be iMessaging Shawn Lerner’s contacts, no. She had a very active social life on her own phone. I’m sure there was some story about where it came from, but no reason to think anybody beyond the accused should have been suspicious it had been in the possesion of Laura Babcock.
According to Jim Falconer, as I read it, there were only 44 files on the iPad prior to it being backed up on July 3. As SL handed it over on June 26, that's not much activity. It would also, I assume, include any activity before June 26. I am sure I read somewhere that this wasn't SL's but a "work" one, although I can't now find that.
 
We've struggled on here with what "What you'd do?!" means. Perhaps AM isn't sure what DM meant when he texted that and his thought on the matter is just speculation.

Could it be as simple as AM is just saying "hey Dell, LB going missing looks like something you'd do, eh?" Aka. AM thinks/knows that DM wanted LB to leave him alone so her going missing looks like something DM may have had a hand in.
 
I hope the jury is not feeling as lost as me! The crown never seems to ask for more elaboration, or press the witness for more details. I am starting to feel like a lot of stuff is getting disallowed when the jury is sent out. I do not have a good track record so far in my predictions in this trial, but I am going to predict we will all be very peeved off when we hear about it!

I agree. Feels like there's too many loose ends in this trial, and DM isn't helping on that matter. What was with him bringing up the mittens found at the farm by the police? Were they originally LB's and MS gave them to MM?
 
So he was trying to get in to her pants just before he went to Winnipeg, then all of the sudden he doesn't think highly of her? What happened to change his thinking on her?

And is the "I remember" tattoo LB?
 
Perhaps there was no change, and he didn't think highly of her while trying to get in her pants.

Perhaps she said no to AM and offended him/hurt his feelings. She wanted to be with DM and not him kind of thing. Then DM showed dislike for her and AM agreed with him because he'd been turned down.
 
There is so much evidence to think about but it just occurred to me that the simple fact that DM / MS were in possession of LB's iPad, is one of the most damning pieces of evidence, IMO. And then when SL contacted DM to ask him if he had any information about LB's disappearance, DM doesn't offer up that she left her iPad with him?? Any innocent person would have done so, IMO and even if DM didn't want LB around, if he had a clear conscience he would have absolutely no reason not to assist SL by providing him with LB's iPad. Also, MS knew he and MM had LB's iPad so there is no excuse for him either if he was innocent for not giving it up to LE once it was public knowledge that she was missing and yet he didn't. Damning IMO for both DM and MS.

IMO, it is not logical that LB would leave the iPad that was only on loan to her by SL with anyone else and just go off into oblivion and then shut off her phone and have no way to connect with others.

I hope the many little pieces of evidence lead the jury to make the big decision to convict both DM and MS of M1. The more I think about it all tonight, the more confident I feel that the proper verdicts will be delivered soon.

ALL MOO

I think LB's red bag--with her name on it--in MS's house was a huge moment. Especially if it's true that people in the courtroom gasped. IMO, DM and MS didn't know LB's name was on it. They're not that ballsy to keep her name on it because the iPad name was changed asap.
 
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