Josh Powell Burial

[GrainneDhu]

I understand what you are saying, but it would matter to me if I were a family member. I wouldn't want the grave of the killer just steps away from my grandbabies. Just imagine the emotions it would stir in the Cox family.

To some people, it does matter where bodies are laid to rest. Not to some mind you - (a few come to mind here - the Powells, the Anthonys - oh I digress) but to others it does matter. It gives a family a place to go, to pray, to lay flowers, etc. I can totally understand why the Cox family was upset about this and am so thankful that Crimestoppers acted so quickly and bought the plots.

BBM

To add to your list of people to whom it apparently doesn't matter where a body ends up, you can add billions of Hindus, Buddhists, etc.

It really is a cultural thing, not just the province of the Powells or the Anthonys.

 

[utmomof2]

Regardless of the Powell family's intentions, I am so glad that he will not be buried near those precious boys. I am glad that they have reconsidered.

 

[rotterdam]

"His sister and their mother, Terrica Powell, went to the cemetery. It was Josh's sister Alina who had actually picked out the plot that still has wood over the top of it," Troyer said.

Continue reading on Examiner.com Pierce County Sheriff: Confirms Powell family was buying plot, digging hole - National missing persons | Examiner.com http://www.examiner.com/missing-per...ly-was-buying-plot-digging-hole#ixzz1matqorup

Thank goodness for Terrica Powell being a voice of reason. Bless her.

wm

Terrica Powell lost a son and two grandchildren in a horrific crime/suicide. Let us not forget that. And I venture some folks got to her and even threatened to disturb JP's grave site unless they changed the location.
It is not going to happen now so let us stop pointing accusing fingers about something that never materialized anyway and without really knowing who came up with the idea in the first place. My money is still on JP. However, it is over now. JP is dead. He can not hurt folks anymore.

 

[Gypsy Road]

BBM

To add to your list of people to whom it apparently doesn't matter where a body ends up, you can add billions of Hindus, Buddhists, etc.

It really is a cultural thing, not just the province of the Powells or the Anthonys.

LOL. Thanks. I had no idea there was province called the Powells or the Anthonys. Maybe there should be:waitasec: ?

It matters to the Cox family, so I guess that's really all that matters here, and I'm just glad for them that they will not have to worry about this matter any longer. Those poor folks have had to deal with too much already. My heart goes out to them.

 

[Meri]

The only part you bolded in my post was the fact that I said "In my opinion". Then you went on to spout your OPINION as fact. WTH?

I will never agree with you that right or wrong is in the eye of the beholder. I can't even wrap my mind around that type of thinking. So, JP blew his kids up and it was the right thing to do in his mind so you're ok with that since it was his interpretation of what is right. :what:

I'm not buying it and I will never understand how you came to your life decision that right and wrong is speculative.

Wars and fights have NOTHING to do with right and wrong. They have to do with greed, dishonesty, nuclear weapons, broken treaties or one government (usually the US) trying to force another one to think and do as they do.

When I talk about right and wrong - especially in these WS forums, I'm not talking about wars and unrest in other countries. I am talking about these individuals who murder and rape and lie and steal and kidnap and torture other people - the basic right and wrong of MORAL VALUES and HUMAN COMPASSION.

One of the most obvious morally wrong things to do would be to bury JP anywhere near his precious children that he hatcheted about their necks and heads to unconsciousness and then he blew them up to smithereens!

We are ALL on the same side here. I think you are missing what the poster above, and myself, have really been trying to say. There was nothing about what Josh Powell did that was right, in his mind or anyone else's.

 

[GrainneDhu]

LOL. Thanks. I had no idea there was province called the Powells or the Anthonys. Maybe there should be:waitasec: ?

It matters to the Cox family, so I guess that's really all that matters here, and I'm just glad for them that they will not have to worry about this matter any longer. Those poor folks have had to deal with too much already. My heart goes out to them.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/province

prov·ince (prvns)
n.
1. A territory governed as an administrative or political unit of a country or empire.
2. A division of territory under the jurisdiction of an archbishop.
3. provinces Areas of a country situated away from the capital or population center.
4. A comprehensive area of knowledge, activity, or interest: a topic falling within the province of ancient history. See Synonyms at field.
5. The range of one's proper duties and functions; scope or jurisdiction.
6. Ecology An area of land, less extensive than a region, having a characteristic plant and animal population.
7. Any of various lands outside Italy conquered by the Romans and administered by them as self-contained units.

I used the word "province" in the sense of definition #4 or 5 above.

 

[Sulamith]

Color me old fashioned..but I would have had a private service, not a media event. The whole mess has been turned into a media circus.

 

[JSR]

What does it matter where the bodies are buried? The souls are no longer within the bodies and in Eternity are in 2 entirely separate places anyways..

That's same line of thinking Cindy Anthony reasoned when confronted with what her daughter did to her granddaughter by throwing her in a swamp. That the body no longer matters when the soul is gone. Although I believe what Cindy spewed that the body is just a shell it still doesn't mean you can go willy-nilly and disrespect both a murder victim (even if it is just their shell) and the loved ones of the murder victims.

A final resting place is supposed to be restful and peaceful. It truly isn't meant for the person who has already gone but is for the loved ones left behind. It would have been incredibly disrespectful for the Coxes to have to pass by Josh's grave to visit their grandsons. It's Josh who single evenhandedly wiped out the entire family. I see no reason to still allow him to control the family he killed even in death.

 

[gitana1]

BBM. Sadly, I have to agree with this. Josh chose to maintain a relationship with his father long after he became an adult and had the choice to sever ties.

At some point, we have to stop excusing behavior because of childhood events when people become adults.

I can only pray with time, the rest of the P family is able to see with some clarifity how destructive their family is/was and place the responsibility where it appropriately belongs. It does not diminish their good memories or the love they had.....

The bible tells us to 'love the sinner, but hate the sin'. Sometimes we need to remind ourselves of such.

I knew someone would post this and I do agree. But, I think Josh was singled out by his father more than the other kids, groomed to be as sick as his dad. I don't think Josh ever stood a chance of even knowing what normal was. I'm not excusing him, believe me. But, we all know that abuse is the 'gift' that keeps on giving. God only knows what he put those two babies through during their short lifetime.

Does anyone remember one of the most horrific cases of child abuse that I've ever heard of (the victim wrote a book about it called "A Child Called It". He went through more torture and abuse then I've ever heard before. He is now grown and married with children and a good man.

I believe that no matter what you go through, you can CHOOSE whether you will live the same kind of lifestyle when you are older and continue to cry that you're a victim.

OR

You can CHOOSE to realize that what happened to you was wrong and that you will not repeat that violence or type of behavior that you were brought up with.

I think the coward was irreparably damaged by his father's evil. But, everyone does have a choice. Children, for example, have an innate sense of fairness and know innately if something is right or wrong. I agree with Meri that he would have been totally different if not raised by steve powell. But, I don't think he would have been a strong, ethical human being if not abused as he was. Innate character AND choice likely play a part.

The fact is, the emotional abuse he was subjected to did twist his soul but as an adult, he decided to embrace evil and he did have another choice. His mother provided that choice to him his whole life. He made the decision. As a result, now he is dead and dead he shall remain.

 

[gitana1]

I'm not really following your line of thinking. Can you explain? I don't see how choosing a church, or choosing to murder your children can be compared. Or am I misunderstanding your post? Please accept my apology in advance if I misinterpreted your post.

I took it to mean why did she give him an ultimatum instead of just getting out and fast. The point being that a choice is not always that easy.

 

[txsvicki]

All I have to say is that narcissism/pychopathy can be inherited, but what it looks like IMO is simply that a controlling serial killer wanted ultimate control of helpless victims even after death. I highly doubt if the little boys will ever see him again on resurrection day at all, but 1,000 to 1,007 years later when the final judgement is meted out.

 

[Peazzzer]

Oh my!!! The roller coaster ride this thread was!! I am so glad that a decision was made regarding this matter. May comfort come to those who need it, all of them. I am just so grateful that this was not my family going thru all of this! I am so thankful! I hope I never have to suffer the way the Cox family has or suffer the loss they have at the hands of another "family" member.
How sad that the grieving was postponed for the Cox family. Jee whiz, the anguish I was feeing for them was just awful and I don't know them! They have such grace and dignity, something Josh lacked so miserably. I feel wherever Josh is laid to rest will cause pain or sadness to anyone buried nearby. How sad is that? Infamy. Wow.

 

[susan1122]

All I have to say is that narcissism/pychopathy can be inherited, but what it looks like IMO is simply that a controlling serial killer wanted ultimate control of helpless victims even after death. I highly doubt if the little boys will ever see him again on resurrection day at all, but 1,000 to 1,007 years later when the final judgement is meted out.

I have been thinking about how a personality disorder can be genetic. Does a psychopath, who was raised by a very sick person or psychopath have a choice? I don't know. In some cases yes, and in some, maybe, no? It is an interesting question that I don't have an answer for.

 

[Storm]

Problem with that, the "right" thing is pretty subjective.

Murder is not subjective. The "right" thing is not subjective.

I was born into a horrifically dysfunctional family...I can remember
starting to think of how I could escape if I had to at 6 years old..
I spent the next 12 years imagining how I'd make my life different.
In the end, I had to set boundaries..I understood that when my
1st son was born..They don't know my family (except for one
awesome brother) and now that they are 30 and 23, they've
told me that they can't imagine how hard it was to literally give
up your birth family. I explained that you would do anything for
your children.
The "right" thing is not subjective. If you have a conscience
and the intelligence to know right from wrong...it's just not
a choice. We know when we do the wrong thing and so did
Josh and that man didn't have a conscience..^i^

 

[hollyblue]

I keep thinking of a relative of mine when we entered into a discussion of the war in Iraq, the belief systems, etc. The relative is very stern in their religious beliefs, and stated they would try to tell the Muslims they were wrong in their beliefs. They were "just wrong". I tried to tell them that the Muslims had prolly been following their family's belief system for generations, as ours did ours, and would prolly turn to them and say they were "just wrong". Long story short....relative never "got" it. My relative's belief system was so ingrained they wouldn't fathom to think anyone could believe just as strongly in another religion. They were willingly indifferent to the point of no acknowledgement....it was unthinkable to them. I see the same for JP. He was so ingrained with his belief in way things should be...because his family was appropriate and knew best. The controlling and narcissistic behaviors of his father. I'd bet SP, being the negative and critical person (& twisted) criticized many to his children, including their mother and other relatives...and just about anyone who didn't view the world from his perspective. SP bent, molded and controlled JP to his death as sure as JP lead his children into his den of inferno. Somehow, and I hope someone can put it together, but SP's obsession with Susan was not only a convenience for his sexual perversions while she was living there, but in maintaining control over JP also. Susan won control over JP by moving to UT, that had to highly impact SP. Maybe SP fed JP lies upon lies about Susan's willingness with him, etc. to turn JP loyalty back to him? Women were only good for their bodies...producing YOUR children and controlling. Basically, what I'm trying to say is SP had controlled, lied and manipulated JP (not nurtured) into being so ef'd up JP didn't have a snow balls chance. No telling what JP or any of his siblings had to live thru, especially after Jen left. Men keep, raise and control their children...the courts said "No" to everything JP had been raised to believe in from the time he knew there was a difference between male and female and their prospective role models.

Poor Susan, she had no way out with the children. JP and his father wouldn't let that happen....ever...

**I was thinking today about what it must be like in that house now with just AP and the mentally challenge brother. Can't help but think they will be in news down the road...somehow. If AP or MP went into counseling and wrote a book about their lives with SP, they'd make a mint; but their perspective is prolly so skewed with dysfunction, it's unlikely.

JMO, IMO, etc.

 

[Melanie]

I'm a little slow on the uptake, but I'm pleased to see that the monster won't be buried at the same cemetary as the boys:

Josh Powell will not be buried in the same cemetery where his two sons were laid to rest, according to his mother.


Source: http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20570986,00.html

 

[pip]

From an outsiders perception of this family... with the facts we know...
I would have to say I believe JP's mother was/is obviously a victim as well, and feels very sad and guilty for the outcome of her children because of the influence her husband SP has had on them. She has likely chosen to support JP out of that guilt and sadness. I feel she hasn't come to full grips of the fact that her son JP had become as bad as SP and blames herself somehow. It seems the Graves have been supportive and protective of her, yet have made it somehow clear that she has not come to grips, or has not made rational/sensible decisions because of her confusion/guilt. I would say to her...
You have been victimized enough. Let go. Stand up and say NO MORE. You have lost one child, a daughter in law and two grandsons. Let go of the guilt over your damaged children and be proactive, Save the one's who are left behind, still semi-functioning in a deluded haze. Wake up, own up, step up and shout out. No more passive hiding. Speak up and help your surviving children to heal and become healthy of mind and soul. Break the cycle. You have support.

 

[bessie]

I removed several posts that had veered way off track, and I could have removed more. The topic is JP's burial. Thank goodness, that issue seems to be resolved. The thread might close later, but while it's open please limit your comments to the controversy surrounding the Powell family's first choice to bury Josh at the same cemetery as the boys, and now his mother's announcement that they will not go forth with that decision, after all.

 

[Oriah]

Thank you, bessie.

Murderers die every day. They are murdered themselves, they commit suicide, they die of disease or accident. Some take innocent lives with them, and some don't.
No matter the situation, there are inevitably other living and innocent victims in these victimizers' lives... and personally, I think these 'left behind' victims are perhaps the most damaged of all. They have to live with every decision they have ever made- anything that may have inadvertantly aided a murderer.

My heart breaks for these victims nearly as much as it breaks for the victims of murderers.

I am glad that the issue of burial seems to have been resolved, but my heart will continue to break for the innocent members of both the Cox and the Powell families.

I cannot imagine having to make a decision of where to bury my child under such intense duress and pain- especially if I was fully aware of the terrible things my child had done.

The Cox's have been amazingly gracious throughout this terrible time. I think Josh's mother has returned that grace.

I hope WS's can continue that chain of grace.

Hope that makes sense.

 

[mamamia54]

From an outsiders perception of this family... with the facts we know...
I would have to say I believe JP's mother was/is obviously a victim as well, and feels very sad and guilty for the outcome of her children because of the influence her husband SP has had on them. She has likely chosen to support JP out of that guilt and sadness. I feel she hasn't come to full grips of the fact that her son JP had become as bad as SP and blames herself somehow. It seems the Graves have been supportive and protective of her, yet have made it somehow clear that she has not come to grips, or has not made rational/sensible decisions because of her confusion/guilt. I would say to her...
You have been victimized enough. Let go. Stand up and say NO MORE. You have lost one child, a daughter in law and two grandsons. Let go of the guilt over your damaged children and be proactive, Save the one's who are left behind, still semi-functioning in a deluded haze. Wake up, own up, step up and shout out. No more passive hiding. Speak up and help your surviving children to heal and become healthy of mind and soul. Break the cycle. You have support.

Actually you make alot of sense. The woman COULD do something positive now, as well as could Jennifer. They could both stand up against the sickness that must have permeated the Powell family for as long as it existed. Jennifer is the only daughter that stood up, now it's time that her mother did the same.

As far as where they bury the monster, who really cares? The only thing that he is now, is a bag of bones.