NY NY - Sylvia Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #3

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MMQC said:
She was a good swimmer. Diver? Can't say. I know she went on a trip and swam with the dolphins.

As far as her style, all of the above.
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MMQC, was this a school trip? or a pleasure trip? (Even a school trip would turn out to be both, I imagine.)

Do you remember her talking about this before or after the trip? This kind of experience was a lot more rare in those days and, given her love of animals, I expect it would have had a big impact on her.

And do you remember where it was?
 
GoingByMyGut said:
MMQC, was this a school trip? or a pleasure trip? (Even a school trip would turn out to be both, I imagine.)

Do you remember her talking about this before or after the trip? This kind of experience was a lot more rare in those days and, given her love of animals, I expect it would have had a big impact on her.

And do you remember where it was?
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-I remember MMQC talking about this - Bermuda

Excerpt MMQC - Post #258 Thread #2

..."What does jog my memory is that she was really over the top in love with the biology trip she took to bermuda while at wagner. Being able to swim with the dolphins and snorkel and scuba dive for live specimines. She really loved that. She did want to travel again in that direction, which to my recollection is where she wanted to honeymoon. You know it's only now that I remember that. I guess talking and answering questions and even talking to my friends now about this cold case has made me remember things that I thought were long gone from my memory bank."

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - NY NY - Sylvia Alice Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #2
 
You know I am thinking as we are (relentless, I know) pressing the memory of our VI, now almost 40 years later, and given the fact that there were some big events, and other people around in Sylvia's life just before her disappearance, and the really sketchy evening with the BF/F, and the "cut off" by the BF/F afterwards, I think there would have been quite a lot to investigate in 1975.

LE would have been able to track down the sorority, and band, and mutual friends of the BF/F and SL. If they had talked to MMQC, and both families, what common or unknown piece would have been fleshed out from that night, and in the days before and after? What other details would the BF/F give LE, if interviewed? If they had a strong idea about time frame and mile radius as mentioned on Tricia's radio broadcast, would they have known where to search for her body based on other cases?

What a shame that she was not classified as endangered missing. Why the "depressed" on the PR didn't warrant a probe especially when she didn't return is what has me questioning the whole system, today.
 
rosemadderlake said:
You know I am thinking as we are (relentless, I know) pressing the memory of our VI, now almost 40 years later, and given the fact that there were some big events, and other people around in Sylvia's life just before her disappearance, and the really sketchy evening with the BF/F, and the "cut off" by the BF/F afterwards, I think there would have been quite a lot to investigate in 1975.

LE would have been able to track down the sorority, and band, and mutual friends of the BF/F and SL. If they had talked to MMQC, and both families, what common or unknown piece would have been fleshed out from that night, and in the days before and after? What other details would the BF/F give LE, if interviewed? If they had a strong idea about time frame and mile radius as mentioned on Tricia's radio broadcast, would they have known where to search for her body based on other cases?

:scared:What a shame that she was not classified as endangered missing. Why the "depressed" on the PR didn't warrant a probe especially when she didn't return is what has me questioning the whole system, today.
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You know, that made me wonder, too-why, if LE thought she was depressed, wouldn't they look for her? It certainly seems that, in those days, everyone who was missing was a runaway, and not a victim of a crime. It seems to me that they should have put more, not less, time into searching for Sylvia. There might have been all kinds of things, and people, to consider if they had only asked some questions in 1975.
 
rosemadderlake said:
MMQC: bbm: I am wondering about her style because I have seen women transform themselves for men, especially when they are young. Did she go to great lengths to become the reflection of who her BF/F wanted her to be? Or, did he like her just the way she was? Or, were there any subtle changes that you noticed?

I am also wondering what size purse she usually carried because if she carried around "her life" in her bag, then she may have had all her Sorority and other friends (biology grads) contact information, notes, journal, etc., with her when she vanished. This may have made it very difficult for EL to track down anyone specific, especially if her parents had just met some of these people for the first time at the pool party.
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SL would turn on the smile and melt grown men. She was just herself. We both would be in jeans and sweaters or T shirts usually, unless going out. Then makeup, better top and good jeans or a skirt or even sun dress or an outfit fit for a DATE. Jewelry nice shoes and a matching handbag. As far as size goes, not a very big bag at all. Enough to accomodate lipstick, hair brush, tissues, wallet and keys.
 
MMQC said:
I can't remember if I bought anything. That said, I really don't know.
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Sylvia had not been working through college nor since she graduated in 1975.

How was she even saving/putting aside money to shop early in September?

Did her BF/F help her out financially at all?
 
Jmoose said:
You know, that made me wonder, too-why, if LE thought she was depressed, wouldn't they look for her? It certainly seems that, in those days, everyone who was missing was a runaway, and not a victim of a crime. It seems to me that they should have put more, not less, time into searching for Sylvia. There might have been all kinds of things, and people, to consider if they had only asked some questions in 1975.
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Respectfully BBM

MO is that SL's Mother described her as "depressed." If she did not use that precise word, she described SL's mood in the days prior to her disappearance to LE which led to that descriptor.

MMQC has told us that she & SL had a history of going to each others home when each had an argument or disagreement at their respective homes. This is continuing as young
adults and post-graduation.

MMQC has told us that as late as July 1975 (close to her disappearance) when MMQC's nephew was born, SL continued to react emotionally to her earlier experience, and that may have been visible to SL's Mother, not just MMQC (and possibly her brother who now lived next door/duplex to SL's family).

MMQC has stated that SL's Mother did not desire publicity because she may not have wanted Sylvia do be viewed as "unstable," in addition to not wanting to hinder her post-graduate or career prospects.

MO: Mother was in tune that something was up with her daughter.
 
MMQC said:
MOO, I think she was trying to impress the WC crew. Then the unthinkable happens with her dad. Totally throwing off the entire evening and being laughed at, not only laughing at the father but a mocking laugh. I was embarrassed for her. It just flipped her switch!
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Did the pool party quickly end after SL "flipped her switch"?

Or was Dad escorted inside, put to bed and the party continued? I know you stated that SL left for your home after the incident, but how did that come about: What exactly happened that you described them both as behaving like "*****"?

Also, their engagement party at Fort Wadsworth may have been the first time their families really interacted with each other for any great length of time.

There must have been alcohol at such an event.
 
epiphany said:
Sylvia had not been working through college nor since she graduated in 1975.

How was she even saving/putting aside money to shop early in September?

Did her BF/F help her out financially at all?
Click to expand...

I worked PT at various places. Although two summers come to mind. We drove an ice cream wagon/truck/motorscooter. That was a fun summer! Put a goodly sum away from those 3 months of really hustling but having fun. Then another summer I remember us painting. Painting inside peoples homes. Put a nice chunk of change away from those days too. Getting spending money comes to mind too. You know...Mom, I'm going to the mall can I have some money? I don't recall other than getting money from parents either of us getting money from anyone.
 
epiphany said:
Did the pool party quickly end after SL "flipped her switch"?

Or was Dad escorted inside, put to bed and the party continued? I know you stated that SL left for your home after the incident, but how did that come about: What exactly happened that you described them both as behaving like "*****"?

Also, their engagement party at Fort Wadsworth may have been the first time their families really interacted with each other for any great length of time.

There must have been alcohol at such an event.
Click to expand...

The party ended shortly after the incident. Then we went inside and more words were said and then she packed a bag and we went to my house.

As for Alcohol at the engagement party? I can't really say yes or no.
 
epiphany said:
Respectfully BBM

MO is that SL's Mother described her as "depressed." If she did not use that precise word, she described SL's mood in the days prior to her disappearance to LE which led to that descriptor.

MMQC has told us that she & SL had a history of going to each others home when each had an argument or disagreement at their respective homes. This is continuing as young
adults and post-graduation.

MMQC has told us that as late as July 1975 (close to her disappearance) when MMQC's nephew was born, SL continued to react emotionally to her earlier experience, and that may have been visible to SL's Mother, not just MMQC (and possibly her brother who now lived next door/duplex to SL's family).

MMQC has stated that SL's Mother did not desire publicity because she may not have wanted Sylvia do be viewed as "unstable," in addition to not wanting to hinder her post-graduate or career prospects.

MO: Mother was in tune that something was up with her daughter.
Click to expand...

bbm: Possibly knew what the argument was about before SL went out that night and could explain EL's urgency in searching for her that night, too.
 
MMQC said:
SL would turn on the smile and melt grown men. She was just herself. We both would be in jeans and sweaters or T shirts usually, unless going out. Then makeup, better top and good jeans or a skirt or even sun dress or an outfit fit for a DATE. Jewelry nice shoes and a matching handbag. As far as size goes, not a very big bag at all. Enough to accomodate lipstick, hair brush, tissues, wallet and keys.
Click to expand...

Her smile could melt grown men, do you remember if there were any grown men that she felt were being a little to friendly with her, any professors maybe?
 
skeet said:
Her smile could melt grown men, do you remember if there were any grown men that she felt were being a little to friendly with her, any professors maybe?
Click to expand...

She never mentioned anything to me about such advances.
 
skeet said:
Maybe there is a difference between a missing person report and an incident report? For instance, Eva supplied the information for the missing person report, when SHE last saw Sylvia, she had glasses, a purse, an engagement ring, a watch. An incident happens after she leaves Eva's sight, and Charles becomes the last person to see her. Do police then ask Charles what Sylvia was wearing when she "stormed out of the car"? Eva files the report, the police are aware of these items so they should have asked him if these items were on her person when she got out of the car. Assuming here, that he gave the glasses to Eva the night of the fight and told her that Sylvia threw them against the dash, he would have also had to tell police the same thing. I would think there would be two reports, missing person taken from the Eva, and incident report taken from Charles.
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Skeet, I have no idea about the incident v. MP report, but re the part BBM, in T1, Post 359, ASWDeerHunter said, "Sylvia's glasses were never returned to the house of the parents after the night in question ..."
 
MMQC said:
The party ended shortly after the incident. Then we went inside and more words were said and then she packed a bag and we went to my house.

As for Alcohol at the engagement party? I can't really say yes or no.
Click to expand...

The length of this thread is really starting to challenge my memory! :facepalm:

BBM: I just went back and looked up some other posts on the engagement party. Here are some excerpts:
T2, Post 525, by MMQC: "I don't recall the date of the Engagement Announcment in the newspaper. It was before graduation so it must have been spring of '75? Not really remembering it except the engagement party. No breakup that I know of."
​
T2, Post 528, by MMQC: "I believe it was held at Ft. Wadworth and SL's family paid for it as it was held at the Fort."
​
T2, Post 532, by MMQC: "On a small scale. I don't think it was even close to 50 people. I think EL had all the gifts still in the house. She asked me what to do with them. I had no clue. Don't know what was eventually done with them."
​

Apologies if there were more and I missed them.

MMQC, some Qs for you:

(1) Did you attend the engagement party? Or was it strictly a family affair?

(2) Had SL decided on her bridal party yet? If so, who did it include?

(3) Is Ft. Wadworth an army facility? with a banquet hall available to veterans?

(4) If you attended the engagement party, what memories do you have of that night? If you didn't, what did SL tell you that sticks in your mind about it?
 
rosemadderlake said:
-I remember MMQC talking about this - Bermuda

Excerpt MMQC - Post #258 Thread #2

..."What does jog my memory is that she was really over the top in love with the biology trip she took to bermuda while at wagner. Being able to swim with the dolphins and snorkel and scuba dive for live specimines. She really loved that. She did want to travel again in that direction, which to my recollection is where she wanted to honeymoon. You know it's only now that I remember that. I guess talking and answering questions and even talking to my friends now about this cold case has made me remember things that I thought were long gone from my memory bank."

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - NY NY - Sylvia Alice Lwowski, 22, Staten Island, 6 Sept 1975 - #2
Click to expand...

Thanks, Rose :) That post was around the time of my daughter's surgery in Honduras. I have a memory-hole the size of a month! I should go back and reread all those posts.
 
GoingByMyGut said:
Thanks, Rose :) That post was around the time of my daughter's surgery in Honduras. I have a memory-hole the size of a month! I should go back and reread all those posts.
Click to expand...

OT-how is your daughter doing now?
 
GoingByMyGut said:
The length of this thread is really starting to challenge my memory! :facepalm:

BBM: I just went back and looked up some other posts on the engagement party. Here are some excerpts:

T2, Post 525, by MMQC: "I don't recall the date of the Engagement Announcment in the newspaper. It was before graduation so it must have been spring of '75? Not really remembering it except the engagement party. No breakup that I know of."​

T2, Post 528, by MMQC: "I believe it was held at Ft. Wadworth and SL's family paid for it as it was held at the Fort."​

T2, Post 532, by MMQC: "On a small scale. I don't think it was even close to 50 people. I think EL had all the gifts still in the house. She asked me what to do with them. I had no clue. Don't know what was eventually done with them."​

Apologies if there were more and I missed them.

MMQC, some Qs for you:

(1) Did you attend the engagement party? Or was it strictly a family affair?

(2) Had SL decided on her bridal party yet? If so, who did it include?

(3) Is Ft. Wadworth an army facility? with a banquet hall available to veterans?

(4) If you attended the engagement party, what memories do you have of that night? If you didn't, what did SL tell you that sticks in your mind about it?
Click to expand...


1) I attended as well as my parents.
2) Bridal Party? We had to graduate first then plan later.
3) Yes
4) The only memories I have from that event was getting into the Fort and that it was OLD. Other than that I don't remember much.
 
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