2010.06.01 - Defense Motion for Tips

[notthatsmart]

I'd like to just explain/clarify something, and I am speaking from direct experience and first-hand knowledge. Motions are filed in court sometimes simply from a strategic standpoint only. They are not always factually based. I have followed this case from the beginning, and many of the defense's motions (IMPO) are done just for that reason...they are looking to buy time for themselves, their case and their client, and even though they know at the outset that their motion may have less than a snowball's chance in hell in succeeding on the merits.....it is successful in the sense that it just bought them more time.

Discovery, which is what the exchange of information between the two sides is...is often done to bury the other side in paperwork, keep them running around trying to answer x, y & z, even though they could care less about x, y & z.

Think about that. It's strategy!

Yes I agree this is going on, but probably from both sides. It appears to be a game of some sort. I wish it wasn't that way, but I have come to expect it. Your opinion is well taken, but I could interpret it from the other side as well. I understand it is strategy and am glad you pointed that out. My thanks and my opinion.

 

[cmsg2002]

Yes, you are correct...it does happen on both sides. To further clarify my point, this is what the "tips" issue is with the defense's repeated requests. IMO, this is a perfect example of what I was trying to explain. They (the defense) is really not all that interested in the tips, but more interested in buying more time and having the state spin their wheels alittle.

 

[RainyGirl]

Yes, you are correct...it does happen on both sides. To further clarify my point, this is what the "tips" issue is with the defense's repeated requests. IMO, this is a perfect example of what I was trying to explain. They (the defense) is really not all that interested in the tips, but more interested in buying more time and having the state spin their wheels alittle.

bbm
I completely agree. IMO, this defense lacks focus and their motion regarding the tips serves to further demonstrate this. The reason we heard the term "fishing expedition" repeated numerous times by the lawyers on In Session recently is because experienced professionals in the legal field (like posters cmsg2002, AZlawyer and others) call a spade a spade. It is what it is. Terms I have heard include "buying more time", "still searching for any speck of dirt", "grasping for straws" and (my personal favorite) "digging aimlessly for unwitting, innocent suspects to bolster their flimsy claims". The defense "is what it is"----->unprofessional and still looking to take repeated bites out of the same apple. Thank goodness HHJP is on to their game!!!
JMO......

 

[Star12]

JB said long ago that he wanted 'everything'. He didn't know what he was looking for, but that he wanted everything that that state had. So, IMHO, the tips are part of everything. He wants 'em.

 

[beach]

Just want to chime in on top of the point cmsg2002 is making and say -

In Florida, the Sunshine Laws off a HUGE advantage to both sides. Since so much is released to the public, it is there for the taking - simply by request and submitting payment for copies. By anyone. MM had gotten it all for us. The media releases it. Depos are another story. The SA has released several already. But, gosh....there are thousands of pages of discovery already available to both sides and the public.


That goes back to my confusion that AZ alluded to earlier. Hundreds, if not thousands, of tips were released in a doc dump almost a year ago (July '09, I believe).

 

[ScubaTwinn]

I read this entire thread at lunch. I know this is off topic, but I just heard a commercial for Morgan and Morgan on the radio. I wasn't really paying attention until I heard John say "I hope these tips help."

 

[Trapshooter]

JB said long ago that he wanted 'everything'. He didn't know what he was looking for, but that he wanted everything that that state had. So, IMHO, the tips are part of everything. He wants 'em.

BBM:

That's just it....JB does WANT everything! He wants the SA to do the work FOR HIM so he doesn't have to do the work himself! ALL of the information released to date IS available to JB, he has just failed to get off his a$$ to obtain it! :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[RR0004]

I read the docket last night and no where does it say the defense has yet to turn over any discovery. So, I can not take that as a statement of fact.

Furthermore, I see lots of supplemental discovery entries, but no reference to who put in the motion. So, I think some are from the defense and some are from the state.

It may just be wishful thinking that the defense has turned over no discovery, however, why would they turn over the bulk until they get the states discovery...Seems to be a circular argument at this point and I will agree to disagree. There is no evidence in my opinion that the defense has turned over no discovery. JMO

So what have they handed over?

 

[RR0004]

I'd like to just explain/clarify something, and I am speaking from direct experience and first-hand knowledge. Motions are filed in court sometimes simply from a strategic standpoint only. They are not always factually based. I have followed this case from the beginning, and many of the defense's motions (IMPO) are done just for that reason...they are looking to buy time for themselves, their case and their client, and even though they know at the outset that their motion may have less than a snowball's chance in hell in succeeding on the merits.....it is successful in the sense that it just bought them more time.

Discovery, which is what the exchange of information between the two sides is...is often done to bury the other side in paperwork, keep them running around trying to answer x, y & z, even though they could care less about x, y & z.

Think about that. It's strategy!

Thank you...I agree wholeheartedly...it buys them time...except now they had better hunker down and get their work done. A year will be here before you know it.

PS- I have seen one too many useless motions.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Bump for reference after discussion of tips in hearing 7-2-2010.

 

[kaRN]

Some of us are not rich and can not just drop a thousand bucks just like that. I do not expect defense attorneys to use out of pocket money. She is indigent and the Judge wants them to come to him for money. I do not see the problem here. Moo

Some of us? Us meaning lawyers who can't afford to drop 1000 bucks on 'work product' but can afford to spend that on a flashy suit with no question?

The problem here is the Baez law firm is a private company. He isn't a public defender so he gets to put out money in his clients best interests and invioce the state for reimbursment later. Simple really.

 

[sleutherontheside]

I recall a comment made by JB.......that he asked for tips and that (in his opinion) "someone thought it would be funny to give us all the psychic tips first".

Now............if JB wanted copies of "tips" should he not have "specified" or "narrowed his request" to either eliminate psychic tips or request "tips" of a particular nature?

I am just saying.......how can you complain about the "type" of tips when you haven't eliminated and categories or groups from your request? Perhaps this was a time that requesting "broad" information backfired?

If he wanted to examine credible tips.......he should have requested copies of "tips that LE investigated...tips that named specific parties... or tips that mentioned specific terms.

JMO..

It's kind of interesting that he complained about getting the psychic tips first when he is fishing for ALL of the TES records. He wants ALL records pertaining to ALL searchers.....yet doesn't want ALL tips????? Gives one food for thought.