Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #183

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There is no gag order on the public; some of those who worked with him and know him have already been interviewed and had nothing bad to say about him.

Public is public. What we say here can often be found with a google search.
Yes but I think what the poster may have meant was the people he lived near, worked with or he saw socially (Like the one man from the pool bar) would probably not want to say too much before trial?
 
In the SC oral argument, they talk a bit about Structural Error.
CJ Rush seemed to agree with Leeman that JG's removal of the D's would be a structural error. My understanding is if the D's had not pushed this to the SC, and RA was found guilty, it is possible this whole trial could have been for nothing. If that's the case, then we should be thankful the D's fought so hard to be reinstated. MOO

One part of the argument I thought was a bit amusing was when the atty for JG said Rozzi and Baldwin were very experienced and highly competent and then quickly added in other contexts.

They also mention not having hearings and not having findings. I'm assuming that impacts how the justices make their decisions.

My problem with this whole argument is that JG did not in fact remove AB&BR. The withdrew informally in chamber then did a take back later. It was very shady. All around. Perhaps they should have fought harder for a formal dq.
Perhaps the judge shouldn’t have allowed them to squirm away and then use her grace against her.
I personally cannot fathom anyone wanting a guilty man to have freedom based on some intentionally created technical error made by his defense. That isn’t justice. IMO not even close.
 
My problem with this whole argument is that JG did not in fact remove AB&BR. The withdrew informally in chamber then did a take back later. It was very shady. All around. Perhaps they should have fought harder for a formal dq.
Perhaps the judge shouldn’t have allowed them to squirm away and then use her grace against her.
I personally cannot fathom anyone wanting a guilty man to have freedom based on some intentionally created technical error made by his defense. That isn’t justice. IMO not even close.
I agree. I'm wondering just what JG's attorney meant by...from FrostedGlass's post "Rozzi and Baldwin were very experienced and highly competent...in other contexts". Is she (JG) saying they're not suited attorneys for a murder one defendant?
 
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My problem with this whole argument is that JG did not in fact remove AB&BR. The withdrew informally in chamber then did a take back later. It was very shady. All around. Perhaps they should have fought harder for a formal dq.
Perhaps the judge shouldn’t have allowed them to squirm away and then use her grace against her.
I personally cannot fathom anyone wanting a guilty man to have freedom based on some intentionally created technical error made by his defense. That isn’t justice. IMO not even close.
But it is...winning.
 
I am convinced once he is found guilty and the gag order not in place a lot of people will come forward and shed a light on what a weirdo he truly was. There will be a lot of skeletons in his closet.

Mooo
This seems quite likely. Even in the course of the trial, my guess is we might get some of that.
Why would anybody take that chance?

There is a gag order for a reason so unless you are absolutely garbage like the defense then the majority would realize it’s in place for a reason. It’s also being respectful towards the friends and families of the deceased by not muddying the waters yet .

Let the floodgates open once he is locked away for life. It won’t be long now as the clock is ticking.

Hell he likes confessing so much maybe he will write a book while he rots away in jail confessing his sins.

Moo
Totally agreed. The D never thought the gag order was "necessary." I'll say, they've already been trying the case with YouTube to the extent possible since they can control the flow of information. It came back on them, though, since their own client also doesn't seem to understand he needs to keep his mouth shut. When this client ends up in prison, with his D team writing books, we'll see how much RA likes them then. I hate to be so harsh, but the D's obligation was to their client and keeping him out of prison since they firmly believe he's innocent, according to themselves. During that trial, we should be seeing and hearing all kinds of information from the D that makes us feel like oh, yeah, not RA-- but there's no way I think we'll hear it. Every time I hear one of these lawyers proclaiming RA's innocence, I always think, ok... and that's because... why? And I have yet to get any kind of substantive answer from all their motions, mostly to suppress and blame crazed Odinites. The closest the D ever came for me was with the three phones at the CS, and I still believe the P will emerge victorious on that one, and that the D didn't interpret the cellular data correctly, probably because they were in the midst of their flurry of motions to suppress and quasi-investigation into an Odinite plot with tentacles into the LE, penal, and judicial systems. D's obligation shouldn't have been their YouTube audience and their future careers as novelists, which they seem to have already been prepping for with the Franks memo. MOO, they're a disaster.
 
Like many of you, I’ve spent countless hours staring at this photo trying to glean anything from it. Rather than a brown knapsack, it looks to me like BG’s right hand is holding something and the tip of the object is glinting in the sunlight; it looks to me like his hand is wrapped around this object and his thumb is on top. Could this be the gun? All speculation on my part.
 

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Like many of you, I’ve spent countless hours staring at this photo trying to glean anything from it. Rather than a brown knapsack, it looks to me like BG’s right hand is holding something and the tip of the object is glinting in the sunlight; it looks to me like his hand is wrapped around this object and his thumb is on top. Could this be the gun? All speculation on my part.
Yes.

I believe you are looking at a brown sweatshirt/hoodie beneath the blue jacket. Pulled low because the pocket (of the sweatshirt) is heavy and the position of his hand rising is causing the blue jacket to hike upward.

I wonder if he kept the gun concealed even as he raised and pointed it. Moreover, somehow he must have been confident they wouldn't scream (maybe there was more dialogue? 'Scream and I'll shoot'? Maybe he used their names.) or had confidence no one was in earshot. Might he have had look-outs?

So brazen. Brazen and bone-chilling.

JMO
 
Like many of you, I’ve spent countless hours staring at this photo trying to glean anything from it. Rather than a brown knapsack, it looks to me like BG’s right hand is holding something and the tip of the object is glinting in the sunlight; it looks to me like his hand is wrapped around this object and his thumb is on top. Could this be the gun? All speculation on my part.


I have always had the brown thing down as a hoodie underneath his jacket. He had a beer belly due to excessive drinking and being Short I believe he struggled to find the right fitting clothes so it hangs.

IMO
 
My problem with this whole argument is that JG did not in fact remove AB&BR. The withdrew informally in chamber then did a take back later. It was very shady. All around. Perhaps they should have fought harder for a formal dq.
Perhaps the judge shouldn’t have allowed them to squirm away and then use her grace against her.
I personally cannot fathom anyone wanting a guilty man to have freedom based on some intentionally created technical error made by his defense. That isn’t justice. IMO not even close.
Yeah, except the Indiana Supreme Court didn't see it that way. "Structural Error"
JG should have never stopped the D from working on the case.
JG didn't allow them to "squirm away"
Even in the end, the contempt hearing, she didn't have anything.
The "technical error" is on JG's shoulders, Not the D.
MOO
 
Yeah, except the Indiana Supreme Court didn't see it that way. "Structural Error"
JG should have never stopped the D from working on the case.
JG didn't allow them to "squirm away"
Even in the end, the contempt hearing, she didn't have anything.
The "technical error" is on JG's shoulders, Not the D.
MOO
Totally disagree with this. In my opinion it was a situation completely created by them. I believe they were dishonest with JG and it's very well put by Cyber sleuth that they "used her grace against her". JG should have aired it all out in open court that very day. AJMO
 
Totally disagree with this. In my opinion it was a situation completely created by them. I believe they were dishonest with JG and it's very well put by Cyber sleuth that they "used her grace against her". JG should have aired it all out in open court that very day. AJMO


This is true but some seem to want to Paint the defense as the second coming and Gull as the evil witch of the south West.

I mean god forbid we condemn the people responsible for letting in friends who leaked confidential photos of the crime scene.

Moo
 
Totally disagree with this. In my opinion it was a situation completely created by them. I believe they were dishonest with JG and it's very well put by Cyber sleuth that they "used her grace against her". JG should have aired it all out in open court that very day. AJMO

Did you get a chance to listen to the oral argument in front of the Indiana Supreme Court?
 
Regarding your last question: IMO
Indiana folks, in general, are pretty strong supporters of their constitutional rights. Knowing what his circumstances were when he did those things won't sit well with a whole bunch of them.
I think they'll make an exception for an accused double homicide child killer and torturer.

JMO
 
Just for the record:
When we get to trial, I'm sure there will be a lot of objections by the defense. I thought this would be helpful in understanding why objections and fundamental errors are so important.

Standards of Review
A claim of error in instructing a jury is usually reviewed for abuse of discretion. Miller v. State, 188 N.E.3d 871, 874 (Ind. 2022). When the defendant “fails to object,” however, she “waives appellate review.” Id. Still, we may review an instruction for fundamental error under a “narrow exception to waiver.” Id. An error is fundamental if it “made a fair trial impossible” or constituted a “clearly blatant violation of basic and elementary principles of due process that presented an undeniable and substantial potential for harm.” Id. (cleaned up). In evaluating the degree of error and its impact on the trial, we take account of any “unusual operative and procedural facts” affecting the case. See Young v. State, 30 N.E.3d 719, 728 (Ind. 2015).
Hopefully at the upcoming hearing Judge Gull will spell it out to D like they are 5 yo on what can or cannot be alluded to based on proof or relevancy during trial. As we have learned though, this D has a hard time following the Court's rules.

JMO
 
We'll see.

I suspect the Indiana Supreme Court might have a problem with it, too. Especially when they learn that Cass Co. had the ability to keep him safe and agreed to take him.
They could not transport RA though. They didn't want him, said they would take him if ordered to do so, but that they did not have the ability to transport RA.

moo
 
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