Annie Le, the person

[Gene]

I'm probably going to get slammed for saying this, but that high school picture of her with the partially dissected cat really makes me cringe. I understand that people in scientific and medical professions have to dissect deceased animals and people to learn things that ultimately benefit animals and people alike, but that's different from posing for a picture with a dead cat in your hands. That's just...troubling to me.

I am not going to slam you, but that is absolutely no reflection on Annie. Probably you did not take high school biology, or you are not from that region.

I also dissected a cat in high school biology class. Wasn't my choice. Everyone in our biology class did so, just as you probably read Catcher in the Rye in your English class. When the teacher tells you to do something you do it.

As I grew up in an area not too far away from where Annie went to school, perhaps this is something that is more common in that region? As we had (and I assume Annie had) already dissected frogs and some other smaller creatures, by the time I had to dissect the cat, I believe that I was not uncomfortable with it.

Why would a high school teacher do cat dissections? Probably to prepare students for college. In college bio labs, you do other stuff that is probably not appropriate for discussion on a forum board. If you are going to have problems dissecting a frog or a cat, you probably want to know that before you select biology as a college major.

Also, it did not look to me as if she were posing for the photo. It looked like someone (probably a member of the staff) was taking photos that day. Keep in mind that the photo was not submitted by a family member, it was submitted by the high school principal. So, this was probably her school files.

 

[Sola.N]

I am not going to slam you, but that is absolutely no reflection on Annie. Probably you did not take high school biology, or you are not from that region.

I also dissected a cat in high school biology class. Wasn't my choice. Everyone in our biology class did so, just as you probably read Catcher in the Rye in your English class. When the teacher tells you to do something you do it.

As I grew up in an area not too far away from where Annie went to school, perhaps this is something that is more common in that region? As we had (and I assume Annie had) already dissected frogs and some other smaller creatures, by the time I had to dissect the cat, I believe that I was not uncomfortable with it.

Why would a high school teacher do cat dissections? Probably to prepare students for college. In college bio labs, you do other stuff that is probably not appropriate for discussion on a forum board. If you are going to have problems dissecting a frog or a cat, you probably want to know that before you select biology as a college major.

Also, it did not look to me as if she were posing for the photo. It looked like someone (probably a member of the staff) was taking photos that day. Keep in mind that the photo was not submitted by a family member, it was submitted by the high school principal. So, this was probably her school files.

I think a lot of this was covered in subsequent discussion after my original post. Rather than repeat my several responses or that of others, I'll just say I stand by my earlier posts in the thread.

 

[Sloof]

Getting back on topic...

For those who wish to send condolence cards to the family of Annie Le:

* c/o Green Valley Mortuary
* 3004 Alexandrite Road
* Rescue, California 95672

 

[Sloof]

I thought this was a good short article to read, especially in light of some of comments I've read on this forum with regard to prevailing racial stereotypes:

http://www.twirlit.com/2009/09/18/asian-female-stereotypes-in-full-display-in-murder-of-annie-le/

 

[Jersey*Girl]

I read through some of the Yale Daily News articles today, and there are hints that there was a rift with her family or at minimum they were unhappy with the impending marriage.

* Her uncle is quoted in one of the early articles as saying, "She was hell-bent on getting married," which, unless his English is very poor, is a strange choice of words.
ttp://www.yaledailynews.com/news/university-news/2009/09/11/ten-hours-days-and-still-smiling/


* Yale called in the FBI on the grounds that it might have been an interstate kidnapping based on the theory that a family member might have kidnapped her because the family disapproved of the marriage.

What I think is unfair is that the media almost always puts their "own" spin on things, wording things so they appear one way when in all reality the opposite could ring true. In every single article I've read involving her immediate family, they approved of and very possibly love Annie's fiance. Does anybody know how expensive it is to hold a wedding & reception on Long Island - please for the sake of Pete just think about it. If her parents were against this, would they have forked out all this money? For all I know this so-called "uncle" is estranged from her immediate family and wants attention...either that or his very profound choice of words is meant to draw attention to the concept that maybe "he" himself didn't approve. I truly find it apalling knowing that whether he likes it or not, his niece was marrying somebody she was very much in love with, and he's announcing this crap to the world during a time that her fiance needs all the support and understanding he can get! It truly makes me sick...his choice of words, that is.

 

[JBean]

Do I have to say it? The topic is about Annie Le the person. Not about each other's viewpoints on animal research and the medical and ethical implications. if you would like to discuss that topic, I suggest you start a thread in the Jury Room for that.
How a thread about a murder victim as a person turns into a venue to insult each other I will never understand.

Please stay on topic.

All posts that were off topic or insulting in nature have been removed. So if you don't know what I am talking about that's why.

 

[Harmony 2]

For Annie Le who loved pink roses and chose them for her wedding bouquet. Pink roses signify "love, Grace, Gentility, You're so Lovely, Perfect Happiness, Please believe me. Single pink rose means simply 'I love you'."

http://www.meaning-of-flowers.com/

 

[Harmony 2]

Annie Le's body returned to California home...

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...f_home_on_what_would_have_.html#ixzz0Ra58wEMI

 

[face100]

Slain student's family grateful for support

By MICHAEL HILL and PAT EATON-ROBB (AP) – 4 minutes ago

NEW HAVEN, Conn. — The family of a Yale graduate student who was murdered on campus is grateful for countless expressions of support, but uncomfortable with the attention the tragedy has brought them.





http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5j3Z7m0uROG-_CM8GzpRCqE2M9IbwD9AQKQRO0

 

[JL50ish]

Well I think it's a safe bet you are not science oriented. She wanted to be an MD. .

Actually, I think she was studying to become a pharmacist...or at least get her PharmD and then do research for new meds.

 

[jjenny]

Actually, I think she was studying to become a pharmacist...or at least get her PharmD and then do research for new meds.

It is my understanding she was an MD/PhD student. In which case she would become an MD.
Not a pharmacist.

 

[Normcar21]

Do I have to say it? The topic is about Annie Le the person. Not about each other's viewpoints on animal research and the medical and ethical implications. if you would like to discuss that topic, I suggest you start a thread in the Jury Room for that.
How a thread about a murder victim as a person turns into a venue to insult each other I will never understand.

Please stay on topic.

All posts that were off topic or insulting in nature have been removed. So if you don't know what I am talking about that's why.

Thank you, thank you thank you, Bean. About 10 seconds before I got to your post I was thinking along those lines. I was asking myself how such a great idea for a thread with a great beginning turned into some sort of sideshow. Hopefully things will get back to the basic theme, Annie Le, the person. I was personally looking forward to gleaning some info on that and was somewhat puzzled by the detour. :banghead:

 

[Skigirl]

It is my understanding she was an MD/PhD student. In which case she would become an MD.
Not a pharmacist.

It means she'd become an academic - getting an MD/Ph.D. is a way for people who are getting medical degrees to also get research training to prepare them for academia. She was interested in enzymes - basic molecular biology with clinical implications.

 

[jjenny]

It means she'd become an academic - getting an MD/Ph.D. is a way for people who are getting medical degrees to also get research training to prepare them for academia. She was interested in enzymes - basic molecular biology with clinical implications.

No. She would have both M.D. and a PH.D. degree, but because of the M.D. degree, she could practice medicine just like any M.D. would. Someone with a Ph.D. can not practice medicine, while someone with M.D./Ph.D. can. She wouldn't need an M.D. degree if she just wanted to do research, Ph.D. would be quite enough.

 

[Emily Booth]

Annie Le was a:

daughter
sister
niece
fiance
friend
colleague
student
PhD candidate
researcher
teaching assistant

 

[eyes4crime]

Annie and her soul mate were young budding philanthropists - can you imagine what they would have contributed to the world if given time??? Annie's future gifts to the human race are immeasurable...mho

"They wanted to use their day to help others, to give back," said Charli Penn, managing editor of WeddingChannel.com. "They're so young and they're starting out doing philanthropy. It says a lot about them as people."


"They selected a store, Macy's. They picked the silverware, towels and the bed linens. They picked out a vacuum cleaner, a sewing machine and a colorful gravy boat."

And they did something special. They also selected a charity - the I Have a Dream Foundation, which works to guarantee that all children can pursue a higher education - from a list of more than 100 compiled by WeddingChannel.com and a second, Washington, D.C.-based group called the I Do Foundation, which links engaged couples to charities.
[/U]
http://www.newsday.com/columnists/j...e-student-fiance-aimed-to-give-back-1.1447841

 

[Kat]

Annie Le was a:

daughter
sister
niece
fiance
friend
colleague
student
PhD candidate
researcher
teaching assistant

Thank you Emily

Annie Le was:

Beautiful inside and outside
Intelligent
A blessing simply because she was...
Potential

Annie Le is:
missed by her loved ones and friends and by countless others that may have been touched by her had she not been taken from us


What Annie Le will never be now:
a fulfillment of that potential
a loving wife and companion for life to her fiance
a continued blessing in other's life's as a friend
a mother should she have chosen to be one


What we have lost:

Annie Le

 

[LillyRush]

fwiw - the statements below are from an interview Nancy Grace had last Monday, 9/14 with Annie's friend Vanessa Flores:

GRACE: Vanessa, was she a medical student or a pharmacology student or both?

FLORES: She was doing a doctorate for pharmacology and she was working at the medical school in Yale. So it`s -- so she`s not a medical student, like -- so she`s not going for a doctorate of medicine, if that`s what you`re asking.

GRACE: Yes.

FLORES: No, she`s a PhD candidate, so it`s for a doctorate. Yes, in .

GRACE: In pharmacology.

FLORES: Pharmacology. Right. Exactly. Right. Right.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0909/14/ng.01.html

 

[eyes4crime]

The MD/PHD program is a dual program -Ms. Flores is not quite right in saying it's a PHD program only.

Here is a description of the PHD/MD program...

MD-PhD Dual Degree Training

Related

Ph.D. in Biomedical Sciences
Biomedical scientists bridge the gap between the basic sciences and medicine. Learn about biomedical science Ph.D. programs at medical schools.

http://www.aamc.org/students/considering/research/mdphd/whypursue.htm

MD-PhD programs provide training in both medicine and research. They are specifically designed for those who want to become research physicians, also known as physician-investigators or physician-scientists. Graduates of MD-PhD programs often go on to become faculty members at medical schools, universities and research institutes.

Regardless of where they eventually work, MD-PhD candidates are being prepared for careers in which they will spend most of their time doing research, in addition to caring for patients. The MD-PhD dual career is busy, challenging, rewarding, and offers opportunities to do good for many people by advancing knowledge, developing new treatments for diseases, and pushing back the boundaries of the unknown.

 

[Skigirl]

No. She would have both M.D. and a PH.D. degree, but because of the M.D. degree, she could practice medicine just like any M.D. would. Someone with a Ph.D. can not practice medicine, while someone with M.D./Ph.D. can. She wouldn't need an M.D. degree if she just wanted to do research, Ph.D. would be quite enough.

I was a professor in the biological sciences at Yale (a group of affiliated programs including the one Annie was in -- recall she wrote an article for "B Magazine"). I understand the difference between the various degrees and can offer insight into why someone would pursue one over the other. It's not always easy to tell just from the description of the degrees alone, because some of this stuff is historical accident.

If you are interested in being a professor specifically in a medical school (as opposed to Arts and Sciences -- that would include biology and other departments), you are better off having an MD/Ph.D. because there is a bias toward medical degrees in medical school faculties, but you would need the Ph.D. (nowadays, not true in previous generations) to be taken seriously as a researcher. Plus, you're a more attractive candidate for a medical school over a Ph.D.-only degree because you can fill some clinical needs to cover your salary if you don't end up getting grants.

In most places, you do not do a full Ph.D. on top of all the medical school requirements. You do the medical school classes but have reduced course requirements and sometimes reduced research requirements for the Ph.D. part of the program. Most can complete the Ph.D. part in about an extra year. Both Ph.D. and M.D./Ph.D. awardees usually complete a fairly long postdoc before becoming an independent researcher, so it's not seen as a big deal that the M.D./Ph.D. programs truncate the research part of the degree, since you learn research by doing it anyway.