Found Deceased Australia - Russell Hill, 74, & Carol Clay, 72, Wonnangatta Valley, 20 March 2020

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Kemug said:
I've just been doing some maths re the area given in today's article, which says that the 4 people in question went missing within a 60 km radius of each other. Unless I got it wrong (quite likely!) that equals an approximate area of about 11,300 square kms. To put this in proportion, for example, the area of Hawaii's "Big Island" is about 10,400 square kms. And it is a "big island". So 4 people going missing in this area isn't quite so amazing (to me, anyway) as the article might imply. Which of course doesn't mean that they're not connected.
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I definitely don't think they're connected and didn't really get the sense the article was implying they were either. I think the 'connection' is only the challenging terrain and weather conditions in the area.
 
I have read through all the comments here and all the associated news stories, and one thing I can't find is how it was confirmed Russell actually had the drone at all on the trip he went missing.

He supposedly had it the week before, but who confirmed he had it the week after? Did he in fact lose it the week before, and return to retrieve it?

A few other things;

Russel confirmed via radio on March 20 around 6.30pm that they were setting up camp. You would assume by then that anybody else in the valley had probably also set up camp, if there was anyone else. Why would they get into an altercation that night with someone who had already set up camp and if the valley was empty was probably camped a distance away from them? The moon was only a few days from a new moon, so it would've been fairly dark that night and less likely for someone to be driving into the area along a 4wd track on a night with no light.

As for accidentally being shot by deer hunters or coming across illegal deer hunting. Deer hunters don't fire randomly at any moving thing. They can roam the bush for days, or setup in one spot, waiting for the perfect moment to shoot a sighted deer. Also why would Russell approach anyone he suspected of illegal hunting, and a deer hunter responding to being seen by killing two people is a fair leap psychologically from shooting an animal.

Why hasn't there been any news on where the couple stayed the night of the 19th, and why they were setting up camp on the 20th so late in the afternoon? Surely if they stayed somewhere outside the bush on the 19th we should be able to find out. Or did they stay at someones house and that person also travelled with them to the valley?
 
JSimpson said:
I have read through all the comments here and all the associated news stories, and one thing I can't find is how it was confirmed Russell actually had the drone at all on the trip he went missing.

He supposedly had it the week before, but who confirmed he had it the week after? Did he in fact lose it the week before, and return to retrieve it?

A few other things;

Russel confirmed via radio on March 20 around 6.30pm that they were setting up camp. You would assume by then that anybody else in the valley had probably also set up camp, if there was anyone else. Why would they get into an altercation that night with someone who had already set up camp and if the valley was empty was probably camped a distance away from them? The moon was only a few days from a new moon, so it would've been fairly dark that night and less likely for someone to be driving into the area along a 4wd track on a night with no light.

As for accidentally being shot by deer hunters or coming across illegal deer hunting. Deer hunters don't fire randomly at any moving thing. They can roam the bush for days, or setup in one spot, waiting for the perfect moment to shoot a sighted deer. Also why would Russell approach anyone he suspected of illegal hunting, and a deer hunter responding to being seen by killing two people is a fair leap psychologically from shooting an animal.

Why hasn't there been any news on where the couple stayed the night of the 19th, and why they were setting up camp on the 20th so late in the afternoon? Surely if they stayed somewhere outside the bush on the 19th we should be able to find out. Or did they stay at someones house and that person also travelled with them to the valley?
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Welcome JSimpson!

You asked a lot of good questions and gave us good food for thought!

I, too, had wondered about the drone and if he had it, or had lost it the previous trip and went to search for it this trip. The fire, though, still has me perplexed.

JMO
 
Blueberry2720 said:
Welcome JSimpson!

You asked a lot of good questions and gave us good food for thought!

I, too, had wondered about the drone and if he had it, or had lost it the previous trip and went to search for it this trip. The fire, though, still has me perplexed.

JMO
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Thanks Blueberry. I have been following this mystery closely recently and thought I really should join in the discussion.

I know some people who live up near Jamieson and spend a lot of time 4wding and hunting in the area. I should ring them and ask what they think, what they see in the mountains. I'll share anything interesting.
 
JSimpson said:
Thanks Blueberry. I have been following this mystery closely recently and thought I really should join in the discussion.

I know some people who live up near Jamieson and spend a lot of time 4wding and hunting in the area. I should ring them and ask what they think, what they see in the mountains. I'll share anything interesting.
Click to expand...

Local knowledge is always great. Thanks!
 
Great to have your input JSimpson.

Thanks for the link regarding the woman who was murdered near Abbeyard. That is only a very short distance to Wonnangatta, so that's really interesting. I found it incredible in that article that the police didn't even release the woman's name - and yet they want people to ring Crimestoppers with information! It's very difficult to try and piece anything together when the police release such scant information.

The whole case is very bizarre. What are your thoughts on the fire? Do you think it's related, or an extremely unusual coincidence?

Looking forward to any information or opinions your hunting friends can give.
 
Panda said:
Great to have your input JSimpson.

The whole case is very bizarre. What are your thoughts on the fire? Do you think it's related, or an extremely unusual coincidence?
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Arson detectives don't believe the fire was caused by a charger, but that would have been my guess if it wasn't deliberate.
A drone charger hooked up to a car battery. If you were charging a second battery for the drone, you would connect the charger to a second car battery, and I would do that outside the vehicle in case of a fire caused by overcharging or the battery already being outside for use with other things.
Russell seemed pretty keen on using his drone, based on stories of use during previous trips, so charging batteries whilst he was camping would make sense.
The screenshot someone posted here of the car battery showed it had been seriously burnt. I just don't think a tent fire would burn long enough to cause that amount of damage to the battery. A burning drone battery/charger on top or next to it might though.

Below is a link to a video of a test burn of a Canvas tent setup. Shows you how quickly they burn, and how quickly the fire would be over and cold again afterwards. I don't think I've read anywhere what type of tent they were using but a Canvas style, and not a more modern one, would be my best guess.
 
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JSimpson said:
Arson detectives don't believe the fire was caused by a charger, but that would have been my guess if it wasn't deliberate.
A drone charger hooked up to a car battery. If you were charging a second battery for the drone, you would connect the charger to a second car battery, and I would do that outside the vehicle in case of a fire caused by overcharging or the battery already being outside for use with other things.
Russell seemed pretty keen on using his drone, based on stories of use during previous trips, so charging batteries whilst he was camping would make sense.
The screenshot someone posted here of the car battery showed it had been seriously burnt. I just don't think a tent fire would burn long enough to cause that amount of damage to the battery. A burning drone battery/charger on top or next to it might though.

Below is a link to a video of a test burn of a Canvas tent setup. Shows you how quickly they burn, and how quickly the fire would be over and cold again afterwards. I don't think I've read anywhere what type of tent they were using but a Canvas style, and not a more modern one, would be my best guess.
Click to expand...

I agree. That car battery looked very seriously burned, considering there is no/very little long-lasting fuel for a fire in a tent.

I don't know how a phone/drone charger is hooked up to a car battery, but there are reports of the corrosion on a battery being highly flammable.


Many people will leave the corrosion on the battery cables and the battery tray, which is a precursor to battery fires. Car battery leakage is not only toxic in its own way. It is also highly flammable and can prove to be a true fire hazard.
Causes of a Car Battery Fire
 
JSimpson said:
Arson detectives don't believe the fire was caused by a charger, but that would have been my guess if it wasn't deliberate.
A drone charger hooked up to a car battery. If you were charging a second battery for the drone, you would connect the charger to a second car battery, and I would do that outside the vehicle in case of a fire caused by overcharging or the battery already being outside for use with other things.
Russell seemed pretty keen on using his drone, based on stories of use during previous trips, so charging batteries whilst he was camping would make sense.
The screenshot someone posted here of the car battery showed it had been seriously burnt. I just don't think a tent fire would burn long enough to cause that amount of damage to the battery. A burning drone battery/charger on top or next to it might though.

Below is a link to a video of a test burn of a Canvas tent setup. Shows you how quickly they burn, and how quickly the fire would be over and cold again afterwards. I don't think I've read anywhere what type of tent they were using but a Canvas style, and not a more modern one, would be my best guess.
Click to expand...

Excellent video. It certainly burnt quickly. I was interested to see the posts fall sideways as it appears happened causing the vehicle to be "scorched" or maybe just smoke damaged.
 
JSimpson said:
Arson detectives don't believe the fire was caused by a charger, but that would have been my guess if it wasn't deliberate.
A drone charger hooked up to a car battery. If you were charging a second battery for the drone, you would connect the charger to a second car battery, and I would do that outside the vehicle in case of a fire caused by overcharging or the battery already being outside for use with other things.
Russell seemed pretty keen on using his drone, based on stories of use during previous trips, so charging batteries whilst he was camping would make sense.
The screenshot someone posted here of the car battery showed it had been seriously burnt. I just don't think a tent fire would burn long enough to cause that amount of damage to the battery. A burning drone battery/charger on top or next to it might though.

Below is a link to a video of a test burn of a Canvas tent setup. Shows you how quickly they burn, and how quickly the fire would be over and cold again afterwards. I don't think I've read anywhere what type of tent they were using but a Canvas style, and not a more modern one, would be my best guess.
Click to expand...

Charging is the most likely time for a drone battery to catch fire, so concentrate the bulk of your safety efforts there. According to the CPSC, more than half of the drone-battery incidents documented at hospital emergency rooms occurred while the drone was charging. Be particularly careful when charging batteries from a brand you’re not familiar with. "I would just assume the cheaper ones are going to catch fire at some point," battery expert and Cadex Electronics product line manager Greg Funk said. “I wouldn’t treat it like a cell phone and plug it in overnight.”
How to Safely Charge and Store Lithium Drone Batteries
 
they'll get you said:
Charging is the most likely time for a drone battery to catch fire, so concentrate the bulk of your safety efforts there. According to the CPSC, more than half of the drone-battery incidents documented at hospital emergency rooms occurred while the drone was charging. Be particularly careful when charging batteries from a brand you’re not familiar with. "I would just assume the cheaper ones are going to catch fire at some point," battery expert and Cadex Electronics product line manager Greg Funk said. “I wouldn’t treat it like a cell phone and plug it in overnight.”
How to Safely Charge and Store Lithium Drone Batteries
Click to expand...

So, IF charging the drone did cause the tent fire (perhaps during the night), where are Russell and Carol? And where are the drone and mobile phone(s)?

And are the charging cords/equipment among the rubble of the fire or in the vehicle?
 
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SouthAussie said:
So, IF charging the drone did cause the tent fire (perhaps during the night), where are Russell and Carol? And where are the drone and mobile phone(s)?

And are the charging cords/equipment among the rubble of the fire or in the vehicle?
Click to expand...

None of it makes sense does it.
Misadventure? Murder? Murder suicide or runaway lovers claiming life insurance?
 
Can someone tell me more about Russell?
He didn’t tell his wife = liar, secretive, coward, possible narcissist.
His debts and addictions would help.
Carol might not have known he was married and was she well-off and was there money being withdrawn.....I’d like to know if he was a scamming ladies-man.

This keeps niggling at me.
Janet Campbell 49, had been left well off when her first husband died.
Prosecutors argued that Campbell was only ever after her money, with the Crown prosecutor, Mark Tedeschi, QC, comparing the murder to a contract killing.

On March 24, 2005 - six months after they secretly wed, and a week after Janet finally told her family of the marriage - Campbell took her camping in the Royal National Park.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/wifekiller-campbell-jailed-for-33-years-20100903-14sx9.html
 
Janet's case really haunts me. I have to stop myself from thinking about her falling and wondering if she even then realised he wasn't the loving husband she thought he was, and maybe just thought it was an awful accident.
I try to not think of it because I live what it must have felt like, and the terror of it :(
I've always had a fear of falling from a height.

I bet even at the end she didn't believe he was doing anything to harm her, not on purpose.
 
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I don't believe that Russell was after Carol's money. I do believe they just liked being together.
One paper said that Russell and Carol had been friends for 50 years but I'm not sure if they got that mixed up with Russell and his wife having been married for 50 years.
And it does seem like he wasn't home very much though I could be wrong about that, it's just my impression.
Maybe Russell's wife didn't like camping. I wonder if they ever did go away camping together ?
 
Mr Hill is an experienced bushman who worked as a logger near the place he disappeared.
They left on March 19, with Mr Hill contacting his wife over high-frequency radio a day later.

Really, why would you drive 6 hours for a very short stay unless he wanted to show her something special he’d found while logging, did they fall down a shaft?
Panning for gold maybe?
mine shafts Alpine National Park.
 
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