AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #15

[winterrose]

I did notice in that video of Isa it was dark outside and the window was open. I wonder if they kept windows open at night, alot of people do, if someone did come in an open window, it would be that much less noise. A reporter said they had dogs inside and out, my dog would have been freaking out in the house at the slightest noise that was different. Depending on the type of dog, if outside dogs have a different bark, like alarming, someone's here bark, the inside dogs would have started barking, also. That is, unless it was someone they knew.

 

[spoiledmom]

So they recruit 6 year old little girls?

I am confused how it got started that this is tied to a Mexican drug cartel. Is this because the Celis family happens to be Hispanic?

Does the cartel only target Hispanic families?

imo

The cartel doesn't target innocent families. They target people that owe them money or get in there way. It has nothing to do with them being hispanic or having a child. It is a theory about whether Sergio was possibly involved in some illegal activity with the cartel. None of it is fact, just a theory. Whether it be gun smuggling, transporting drugs, buying drugs etc. If he is, then that would be a reason for them to be involved in Isa's disappearance. If he is not, then there is no reason for them to be involved.

 

[DollyPardonMe]

He did call her first and told her to come home.

Then he turned around and called 911.

All of this was happening very quickly. He found her missing around 8 am and went out to look for her and his older son was looking too and by 8:13 or 14 he had the 911 op on the line.

IMO

IDK? You would think he would have told the 911 op that he called his wife and asked if she was with her instead of just announcing that he told her to get her butt home..

 

[johnQpublic]

Something else I have pondered with parents being of a medical type background being a dental surgical assistant and a RN that perhaps they could have had some involvement in helping people on the downlow. Like maybe helping out border crossers or helping people involved with the cartels out with wound care and other various things that may have needed attention off the record. IDK just a thought.

 

[Donjeta]

Part of that was cutting in and out. He seem to know a lot for a daddy when they arent as observant as mommies tend to be sometime.

He did tell them her full name and spelled it.......her date of birth and how tall she was and how much she approximately weighed.

Neighbors have spoken out and said they would often see Sergio and Isa walking around the neighborhood so I think he was extremely close to his youngest child and only daughter but I think he was also close to his two sons. I think the entire family doted on Isa because she was the baby child and had older brothers. I think in all of their eyes Isa was so very special!

JMO

I think he might have been distracted during parts of the 911 call. Searching for Isabel or keeping an eye for his sons or trying to keep his story straight or some other reason, I don't know. But he makes the spelling mistake although he is rather pedantic remembering to mention the middle initial, appears to have given them her birthday wrong first and self-corrected and he gave the wrong height too. He said 36 to 40 inches and RC said 44-48 inches. The missing posters say she is 44 inches so it looks like RC's estimate was more reliable.

http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/link/555906/pdf-isabel-celis-missing-poster
http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/18395759/father-to-911-she-was-abducted-from-my-house
http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/18395708/celis-911-call-someone-broke-in-and-grabbed-her

 

[dog.gone.cute]

While I don't remember any cases where LE has addressed how many officers are assigned to certain aspects of this case, I do remember plenty of cases where LE has said that they are looking at the family and family involvement - it's standard operating procedure. Some have been even more blunt in talking about what family involvement or circumstances they are investigating. If anything, I find LE in this case far more closemouthed than LE in other cases. LE also announced how many officers they had assigned to investigating other leads outside the family, which if I recall correctly, was a higher number than those assigned to the family. In my opinion, I don't think this statement is a bombshell.

BBM: IMO ... it is a BombShell -- LE NEVER states PUBLICLY the number of LE detectives/officers that are LOOKING AT FAMILY INVOLVEMENT -- especially when a POI or a SUSPECT has NOT been named ...

Of course they are going to say the number of LE on the case ... and since they publicly admitted to a specific number of LE looking AT the family, naturally they are going to include the number of LE that are looking OUTSIDE the family ...

"Fair and Balanced" ...

JMO and MOO ...

:moo::moo::moo:

 

[Prof]

One thing that had slipped my mind was the break in and attack on the three little girls 10 miles away. How could anything be weirder than that?
And who knows if someone had not alerted and he ran out, he might have been there to abduct one of those girls. Has there been anymore released on that case? jmo

THis is in REGARDS to the three little girls only (ETA)

Monday night NG had a PCSD officer on her show. He stated that the man in his 20s* in the surveilance tape @ Circle K* has not been ruled out, but they are still investigating others, too.

They believe they have the perp's DNA and at least partial latent prints.
They are waiting for results on all DNA, prints collected for comparison.

He would not comment on the Celis case. NG asked him why PCSD had previously stated that the cases were not likely connected, and he would not comment other than he's aware of the facts gathered on the Celis case and they are comparing notes.

 

[txanmom]

IMO, the part that struck out to me the most was when he had difficulty spelling the child's name (OR) at least it appeared he had difficulty because he began over and spelled it a 2nd time. There is no language barrier with the spelling of a name.

I got the strange impression that he maybe was not as close to this child because of that and because he seemed to struggle on a few other things regarding her, as the operator asked him questions about her. It just seemed odd to me. Especially the name spelling.

This is so true. My husband made the comment that maybe he didn't like daughters/girls. He said he knows some men like that. MOO

Also, don't you find it strange as well that he could remember what they did the night before, where he slept, the game he watched, his wife's height, how to spell various things, where his son's were at the moment, but very little about Isa. Makes me think he was distancing himself from the victim. MOO again MOO

 

[bwilson]

ITA! Does anyone know if he FIRST contacted his wife (since she did leave sooo early for work) "Hey, by any chance is Isa with you?"

That's a good point- it would make more sense if he did call Becky first, before automatically assuming an abduction had occurred.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Our darling little 4-5 year old granddaughters cant wait to show us their pretty painted fingernails and toenails when they come over.

I didnt do that with our daughters at that young age but it is just considered normal nowadays, imo.

IMO

:seeya:

BBM: Yes, good point ... it is considered "normal nowadays", when compared to "back in my day" ... lol ...

:seeya:

 

[mck16]

Monday night NG had a PCSD officer on her show. He stated that the person in the surveilance tape has not been ruled out, but they are still investigating others, too.

They believe they have the perp's DNA and at least partial latent prints.
They are waiting for results on all DNA, prints collected for comparison.

He would not comment on the Celis case. NG asked him why PCSD had previously stated that the cases were not likely connected, and he would not comment other than he's aware of the facts gathered on the Celis case and they are comparing notes.

You mean the surveilance tape that was close to Celis house? The person behind the wall? Did they ever say how this boy got into the house? Was it door, or window? tia

 

[spoiledmom]

There's a difference between the drug cartels which involve Mexican citizens and F&F which was a "mission" of the U.S. Government. It seems as if both are being considered, and some people are getting the two mixed up. I don't know what I believe yet, :fence: but while I do not think cartels have a lot of control over what gets posted online, our government may have the ability to "shut down" a forum if we were getting too close to the truth. Maybe they would just discourage posters by making the site flakey and difficult to use? *LOL*
I think that if there was anything to the F&F theory, we would not still be posting about it. MOO

I think as long as we are stating it as our theory and not a fact that LE isn't worried about what we say. Although they may be saying, "Damn they are close!"

I have revised and deleted previous posts I made for that reason. I don't want to piss anyone off or hurt the case. I am trying to put things together in my head and come up with my own theories. You are correct about what you stated above. It could be any of those really. I want to know what has been ruled out, if anything. That way if something I come up with is ruled out, I can move on to a new theory.:what:

 

[txanmom]

Yikes... if that picture of Isa makes you think of Jon Benet and Toddlers and Tiaras, I can't imagine what you would think of pictures of me as a little girl and how my mother raised me.

:what:

I will go one further and state that me and my daughter got ahold of my son once and decked him OUT - and I have the pictures to prove it. (I threaten to show them to his gf all the time :floorlaugh. Boy was his dad mad at us that day lol!!

 

[time]

LOL! It's not just Arizona. California, Nevada and Texas are right up there too. It's just not talked about as much in states where it isn't happening. Where when you live there, you hear about it more. Also, we have LE dealing with it directly in our state and nearby states so we have more opportunity to hear about it from LE (people we know that have experienced it etc). Also, many of the people that they have caught from cartels and shown in the media don't look like meth heads at all. They actually look normal and healthy IMO. I haven't heard about the cartel messing with people that aren't involved with them in some way unless there is someone that is IN their way, like border patrol and cops. Then it is a full out blood bath. If Sergio has no connections whatsoever to the cartel, then I don't believe they have anything to do with Isa. If he does have some kind of connection, then that is another story.

There was a fairly long segment on CNN last night due to the 48 torsos found along the Texas/Mexican border. It appeared as if Zetas took credit for it, but the two experts, one from STRATFOR, said this was unlikely since they would not mess up their own territory. Interestingly, they said the Zeta Cartel is unlike any other in that they have a very future oriented plan - they do kidnap kids, some from the US, and raise them to become ubber drug cartel people (among other things). They even send some to college because the future is for them is partially in white collar/computer crime, money laundering. It was all very interesting.

However, I don't believe the border near Tucson is Zeta territory and not sure they would kidnap kids that young, more likely adolescents. That does not mean someone didn't cross some line with lower level cartel operatives or the local drug dealers or that a young girl would not be kidnapped for other reasons. Yes, they do mostly kill their own, but there are a significant portion of victims who are not in opposing cartels. One female reporter I believe was beheaded last year and left in the open with a note on her.

 

[txanmom]

Ruh-roh, dude, that's a no-go for me and the tent

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[Donjeta]

That's a good point- it would make more sense if he did call Becky first, before automatically assuming an abduction had occurred.

He says to the dispatcher that he had called Becky before calling 911 but there are no details on what they spoke about besides telling her that her butt needs to get home.

 

[bwilson]

Maybe we can read between the lines and determine that the case of the 3 girls break-in is being reported as likely unrelated to Isabel's case b/c LE has evidence or highly suspects that her "abduction" was an "inside job"...??

 

[oceanblueeyes]

The cartel doesn't target innocent families. They target people that owe them money or get in there way. It has nothing to do with them being hispanic or having a child. It is a theory about whether Sergio was possibly involved in some illegal activity with the cartel. His brother was arrested on drug charges near the border a while ago and its possible that Sergio could have some connections. None of it is fact, just a theory. Whether it be gun smuggling, transporting drugs, buying drugs etc. If he is, then that would be a reason for them to be involved in Isa's disappearance. If he is not, then there is no reason for them to be involved.

Oh I thought someone said they kidnap these children to recruit them into the drug cartel.

But with LE having Sergio under a powerful microscope for almost a month now dont you think they would find some type of evidence tying hm to gun running or drugs?

I mean wouldnt he have to communicate with these people in someway either by cell phone or other means?

IMO

 

[GutFeeling!]

Right, I understand that, I have two daughters, , but as part of a scenario of what type of parents they could be. Are they controlling, dominating, both of them seem to have an attitude that comes out a little in interviews. SC seems emotionless which is another trait of a dominant driven parent. So this just made me wonder are they the type to push kids and could there have been some abuse? What information did LE have to get SC out of the house? Were the kids ever in the ER for any reason, that type of thing I was actually getting at.

BBM Not really fair to judge reactions of parents in front of a dozen cameras talking about their child missing moo

 

[CharlestonGal]

Am I the only one who thinks it was neither Sergio, Rebecca, OR a cartel?

Just seeing if I'm completely out in left field - seems like the two biggest "camps" of theories are SC or cartel (whether drugs or weapons).

I'm still neutral on the whole issue. I haven't seen any evidence that sways me much in one direction or another. Lots of theories being bandied about, but I've heard very, very little in the way of actual facts. About the only thing I am reasonably confidant about is that there is a 6 year old female child by the name of Isabel Celis who has not been seen since 4/20/12. I am still open to any possibility.

I'm beginning to get a disturbing feeling that LE still doesn't have any idea what has happened to Isabel either.