AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #15

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IMO, any or all of these could be reasons. #5 might is a very likely reason why he can't call his boys.
http://www.wcadv.org/sites/default/files/resources/DV_and_Parenting.pdf

Exactly... well fingered Pensfan ! One thing people I think fail to understand in this particular case is YOUR DEALING WITH ARIZONA NOT ANY OTHER STATE. AZ CPS can be a pain in the A$$ and at times will be as protective and as to the letter of the law as they can be. It's CPS's BUTT on the line here as well, if something were to happen mentally or physically to these children it would come back on CPS for NOT separating him from them. This isn't liberal land THIS is Arizona and they do dot thier I's and cross thier T's as well as ~ some of thier P's. Where most states let little things slide they do tend to take it to the extreme in covering thier butt.
 
I totally agree about Becky. OMG poor thing. I think she was sincere and so upset.
I didn't get to hear the brother. Was it the older one? What did he say?
Becky's 911 call was seperate from Sergio's right? Cuz she wasn't home yet right? Did she get home before the police ever got there?
Also, did i hear something about a guy and his son came over with something to say? Was it ever told what they had to say?

I only saw transcripts of what the brother said, he was just answering the dispatchers questions, and telling her a few times to send the police quickly.

RC got home, sounded like she got home while someone was still on the phone with 911, I think SC.

I don't know about the man and the son.
 
Unless he's an idiot. But if he signed the voluntary and sticks with it, he won't need a lawyer for approx. 90 days.

ETA: Well. Not for the CPS thing. But IMO he will need a lawyer for other reasons much sooner. ;)

I think he needed one last week.
 
I think he did sign the plan, though, because at the press conference the officer said there was a voluntary agreement with CPS.
That could be if he is guilty or if CPS threatened to immediately remove his children from him/his wife if he didn't sign their "plan". If he was not guilty of CPS's "evidence", he should have consulted a family attorney and made CPS prove their evidence of his abuse/neglect in a courtroom.
 
Most likely, that's what the voluntary agreement said, but it's voluntary ;) so they can back out of it anytime. Of course, if they do, CPS will (probably) follow through on the thread they (probably) made to take the kids away on a non-voluntary basis.

I have had personal experience with this in Texas though but it sounds like the exact same rules in Arizona. I am nan.

When the party here volunteered 30 days they started doing all kind of weird things, turning up to my home with cops, calling cops saying I was doing things to harm the child - just awful things. CPS were regular visitors because of their constant complaints (just to have paperwork completed). In the end CPS recommended (and supported) to the attorney that a restraining order be placed on the person which means they can never come near me (I however can go near them for visitation if I want - they have no say)

they can not contact me in any way now, they cannot phone the child, they cannot make any remarks about me or diss anyone around me in fron of the child. Visitations at the moment are with me and the child but will be changing to supervised by police or CPS.

So it has gone from voluntary to mandatory. IF they came to me and demanded the child back I would have had to have given them too him but was told to immediately call police and CPS and the child would be returned immediately and they would have charges against them.

YES, indeed, my life has been a living hell since January 1 lol
 
OK. Preface: I am not a conspiracy nut. Matter of fact quite the contrary. I've scoffed at everything from con/chem-trails to water fluoridation in my time. But I do play devil's advocate with the pros.

What if... JM was involved in FnF.
and what if... he turned informant to save his hide when things started to go bad.
and what if... he went into hiding (traversing from WA, FL, Rocky Point, etc.).
Wouldn't that make him a threat to one or both sides?

And if so, what if someone finally located him when he re-surfaced in Tucson where he may or may not have a significant source of familial "protection"; possibly staying with RC & SC, and decided to lay in wait for a retribution and/or ransom opportunity?

What if someone, on either side, was hellbent on punishing a turncoat and noticed the children at the household and made the assumption that would be a really powerful message to send a snitch... to grab one or more of the kids not knowing or caring if they were his?

Add to the above scenario the possibility that JM had/has a big mouth and brought SC and/or RC into this mess? Now... if JM is/was involved in FnF, how on earth would LE be able to explain this if there was some perceived familial protection in the form of local or regional LE; let alone the national implications? Or even if they were not fully aware of any possible connection until after the FBI involvement, the "dance" would be insane.

I dunno. Toss them 'maters. I'm just postulating. Primarily because this case is so incredibly bizarre on it's own merits.
 
On the local news tonight, the top story was about TPD searching a wash area today 3 miles from the Celis home for evidence. http://www.kgun9.com/news/local/151589955.html

The area was included in the initial search, but it is a large area. This doesn't give me a lot of hope for sweet Isabel's return. (my opinion, of course!)
 
Post brought over from thread #14

Someone said s/he giggled at her mom's funeral.

IHNC replied: Yes... but I bet you didn't tell your mom to "get her butt home!"
(Referring to SC's inappropriate affect and responses on the 911 call)

Ransom said: Her mom was dead. How could she tell her that?

Actually.. My reply was just a sick joke... Of course we wouldn't tell a deceased loved one at a funeral "Get your butt home!"

But... It reminds me of Saturday Night Live when Gilda (?) was in a spoof of the Exorcist and growls, as she is levitating off the bed, "Your mother sews socks that smell!"... instead of Your mother s_____ c_____ in H_____!

Macabre.... yes.....but still so funny to me!

I know... jokes lose their flavor when they need to be explained, and I hope the first poster is not offended.

It is late... I better sign off!
 
Unless he's an idiot. But if he signed the voluntary and sticks with it, he won't need a lawyer for approx. 90 days.

ETA: Well. Not for the CPS thing. But IMO he will need a lawyer for other reasons much sooner. ;)

Other reasons? other than a missing daughter? or because of a missing daughter?

Would love to hear your opinions...any you'd care to share.

Always nice to see you.
 
On the local news tonight, the top story was about TPD searching a wash area today 3 miles from the Celis home for evidence. http://www.kgun9.com/news/local/151589955.html

The area was included in the initial search, but it is a large area. This doesn't give me a lot of hope for sweet Isabel's return. (my opinion, of course!)

I am hoping they were looking for evidence there, and not Isa.
 
Other reasons? other than a missing daughter? or because of a missing daughter?

Would love to hear your opinions...any you'd care to share.

Always nice to see you.

Oh, I was just thinking because of the missing daughter. That 911 call was chilling. But something like that, if the parent is involved, doesn't just happen in a vacuum. There would probably be some other criminal activity involved in the background.
 
I am hoping they were looking for evidence there, and not Isa.

Based on the photos, I think they were prepared to find evidence or a body. Thankfully they didn't find the latter. Still holding onto hope...
 
OK. Preface: I am not a conspiracy nut. Matter of fact quite the contrary. I've scoffed at everything from con/chem-trails to water fluoridation in my time. But I do play devil's advocate with the pros.

What if... JM was involved in FnF.
and what if... he turned informant to save his hide when things started to go bad.
and what if... he went into hiding (traversing from WA, FL, Rocky Point, etc.).
Wouldn't that make him a threat to one or both sides?

And if so, what if someone finally located him when he re-surfaced in Tucson where he may or may not have a significant source of familial "protection"; possibly staying with RC & SC, and decided to lay in wait for a retribution and/or ransom opportunity?

What if someone, on either side, was hellbent on punishing a turncoat and noticed the children at the household and made the assumption that would be a really powerful message to send a snitch... to grab one or more of the kids not knowing or caring if they were his?

Add to the above scenario the possibility that JM had/has a big mouth and brought SC and/or RC into this mess? Now... if JM is/was involved in FnF, how on earth would LE be able to explain this if there was some perceived familial protection in the form of local or regional LE; let alone the national implications? Or even if they were not fully aware of any possible connection until after the FBI involvement, the "dance" would be insane.

I dunno. Toss them 'maters. I'm just postulating. Primarily because this case is so incredibly bizarre on it's own merits.


I must agree with you there.... this case is perhaps as sticky and conflictious as the JFK Mystery at the moment. Here it is 2012 and yet even now we are wondering if the Z film is authentic, if there was a shooter in the storm drain, was it the FBI, CIA, Mafia, Castro or an Elaborate Hoax that was staged by JFK himself and he did'nt even die... There are toooo many unknown's and plenty more dots to connect than there is string to connect them and where do you tie the connections together at at this point after connecting them ?
 
:please: I sure hope so! I wonder what pointed them back to that specific area?

I think that area is right behind the ball field? But, I don't think LE will be sharing what led them there any time soon..
 
Post brought over from thread #14

Someone said s/he giggled at her mom's funeral.

IHNC replied: Yes... but I bet you didn't tell your mom to "get her butt home!"
(Referring to SC's inappropriate affect and responses on the 911 call)

Ransom said: Her mom was dead. How could she tell her that?

Actually.. My reply was just a sick joke... Of course we wouldn't tell a deceased loved one at a funeral "Get your butt home!"

But... It reminds me of Saturday Night Live when Gilda (?) was in a spoof of the Exorcist and growls, as she is levitating off the bed, "Your mother sews socks that smell!"... instead of Your mother s_____ c_____ in H_____!

Macabre.... yes.....but still so funny to me!

I know... jokes lose their flavor when they need to be explained, and I hope the first poster is not offended.

It is late... I better sign off!

Back when SNL was actually good...
 
Oh, I was just thinking because of the missing daughter. That 911 call was chilling. But something like that, if the parent is involved, doesn't just happen in a vacuum. There would probably be some other criminal activity involved in the background.

Thanks.
That 911 call was unreal. That's why I first thought of him being on some kind of meds or drugs. He seemed more upset and RC's arrival "she's freaking out" than he was about his missing 6 year old.

As far as other criminal activity,
is it not odd that he has nothing on record, but some traffic tickets and dogs at large issues?
 
Another thing I was wondering about is ... Those 49 dead bodies found in Mexico ... I just wonder if those 49 bodies consist of person's taken from the US ... It would certainly be a bold statement. If so, is one of those 49 bodies poor little Isabel.
 
Another thing I was wondering about is ... Those 49 dead bodies found in Mexico ... I just wonder if those 49 bodies consist of person's taken from the US ... It would certainly be a bold statement. If so, is one of those 49 bodies poor little Isabel.

Nope. All 49 have ties to the Zeta cartel. Adults from what I hear.
 
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