AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #17

[prima.facie]

I've never felt so very torn at what has been publicly insinuated ..inferred.. and alluded to about a victims family in my entire life.. and it hasn't a damn thing to do with libel.. slander.. and certainly not about lawsuits.. it has to do with my feeling that this family are helpless victims and what they have been through in just this months time is a hell beyond which any family should ever have to live through..

I'm outta here.. peace

I can understand what you are feeling.....and I feel you have an extremely loving, caring heart!

For me its a bit different though....my stance always is: evidence, evidence, evidence (which includes testimony)....I have the ability (most times, i cave at times too) to set aside my personal feelings for people on a personal basis and focus on the facts of a case. Because it is the evidence that will either rule out a suspect or confirm a suspect. (I know im prob speaking to the choir...but) Evidence and the analysis of is not just to find someone guilty...it is also used to find someone innocent.

For me and others, in these type of cases our main priority is: FIND THE CHILD & WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CHILD'S DISSAPEARANCE OR MURDER. It is not to feel sorry for how relatives are feeling....there are other people who can do that task (counselors, victim advocates, and kind hearted people like you, etc).

A relative very well could be guilty and putting on an act or actually feel distraight for doing something on accident (mama Irwin, IMO, is an example of this). And since LE has not eliminated mom and dad as possible suspects, them being guilty is still on the table, just as much as them being innocent is. At this point...........we just dont know. But I refuse to rule them out because my heart breaks that they are missing their little girl and at a vigil were emotions are running super high, they appear to be sad.

I know my stance comes off as cold-hearted. It really is not. My passion for finding justice in this world is extremly high....and that justice goes either way: finding someone innocent and/or finding someone guilty (and in cases such as this....finding out where a child is and what happened to a child and who the hell did it).

Anyways, just my morning thoughts.....

 

[prima.facie]

I've never felt so very torn at what has been publicly insinuated ..inferred.. and alluded to about a victims family in my entire life.. and it hasn't a damn thing to do with libel.. slander.. and certainly not about lawsuits.. it has to do with my feeling that this family are helpless victims and what they have been through in just this months time is a hell beyond which any family should ever have to live through..

I'm outta here.. peace

I can understand what you are feeling.....and I feel you have an extremely loving, caring heart!

For me its a bit different though....my stance always is: evidence, evidence, evidence (which includes testimony)....I have the ability (most times, i cave at times too) to set aside my personal feelings for people on a personal basis and focus on the facts of a case. Because it is the evidence that will either rule out a suspect or confirm a suspect. (I know im prob speaking to the choir...but) Evidence and the analysis of is not just to find someone guilty...it is also used to find someone innocent.

For me and others, in these type of cases our main priority is: FIND THE CHILD & WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CHILD'S DISSAPEARANCE OR MURDER. It is not to feel sorry for how relatives are feeling....there are other people who can do that task (counselors, victim advocates, and kind hearted people like you, etc).

A relative very well could be guilty and putting on an act or actually feel distraight for doing something on accident (mama Irwin, IMO, is an example of this). And since LE has not eliminated mom and dad as possible suspects, them being guilty is still on the table, just as much as them being innocent is. At this point...........we just dont know. But I refuse to rule them out because my heart breaks that they are missing their little girl and at a vigil were emotions are running super high, they appear to be sad.

I know my stance comes off as cold-hearted. It really is not. My passion for finding justice in this world is extremly high....and that justice goes either way: finding someone innocent and/or finding someone guilty (and in cases such as this....finding out where a child is and what happened to a child and who the hell did it).

Anyways, just my morning thoughts.....

(still catching up on many pages from overnight....)

 

[Whisperer]

Actually, in my work with ELL (English Language Learners) students, pronouns tend to be one of the hardest aspects of the English language for them to master. It might not be a language issue in Sergio's case, but it is possible.

English language learners struggle with "we" and "I"?? Isn't that one of the very first things taught? I'm surprised that singular and plural on 1st person pronouns are one of the hardest aspects of the English Language.

Maybe possessive pronouns but personal 1st person pronouns?

 

[elmomom]

I think a much better way would all to agree to just get along and not pick
on things. Its so very easy!

When someone refers to previous "charges" filed by CPS and is later corrected, I don't think that is "picking on things". People have to be more responsible and state facts, without embellishment, otherwise the whole topic becomes one big sensationalized rumor mill.

IMHO.

 

[mamamia54]

Isabel Celis: Mom Attends Vigil, Defends Husband

The mother of missing Tucson girl Isabel Celis led hundreds of people on a candlelight walk for her daughter Friday as questions mounted against her husband, who has been barred from contacting the couple's two children.

"It's tough because we're already under a lot of stress because we don't have Isabel here, so to have more thrown on us, but we're strong and we'll be okay, we'll survive it. We just want her back," Rebecca Celis said.

Sergio Celis, the father of the missing 6-year-old, was told last week by authorities he cannot have contact with the girl's two older brothers, who are now in the custody of their mother.

Child Protective Services officials had visited the family's home in December, however officials declined to discuss the circumstances.

Rebecca Celis said her husband wanted to attend the vigil, but was unable to since one of her sons wanted to be there.

<modsnip>
.
http://abcnews.go.com/US/isabel-celis-vigil-missing-tucson-girl/story?id=16385286

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Did both boys run off looking? I thought the older who was 14 went around the neighborhood to look while the younger boy stayed in the garage waiting for mom.

I thought that both boys went out originally because it doesn't sound like 9-1-1 was called immediately upon Sergio discovering that Isabel was missing. I think the 14-year-old son ended up farther away from home, while the younger son might have just walked down the street a little ways - perhaps to his grandparents' home. There have been several different versions of the activity in and around the Celis' home that morning, so I'm gleaning bits and pieces from the varying accounts. :moo:

 

[Donjeta]

I can see not wanting the others out of your sight, but at 14 I think getting him to help search the neighborhood would fine. So I see nothing wrong with him out looking. I wonder if it could have been the older boys wish to try and do something. He was probably thinking she was walking around the neighborhood not thinking someone came into his house and took his sister.

Except he starts the 911 call saying someone broke in and grabbed his sister.

I think it would probably be perfectly safe in most circumstances to send the older kid looking in the neighborhood. Not necessarily what most parents would do... but it would be safe. If someone broke in and took one child it's unlikely that they're still hanging around waiting for the other kid to come out. If they wanted two they'd have taken two when they broke in.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

"My husband's a great father who loves his boys, who loves his daughter. He's a great husband, a great father. At the end of the day when she comes home, everybody's questions will be answered," Celis told ABC affiliate KGUN.

OK, then. Becky sounds very sure that Isabel will come home and that everyone will then understand what happened. So, where is the little girl and with whom? Why is she not home where she belongs? WTF!!

 

[Lava]

"My husband's a great father who loves his boys, who loves his daughter. He's a great husband, a great father. At the end of the day when she comes home, everybody's questions will be answered," Celis told ABC affiliate KGUN.

OK, then. Becky sounds very sure that Isabel will come home and that everyone will then understand what happened. So, where is the little girl and with whom? Why is she not home where she belongs? WTF!!

Yeah, I found this statement pretty interesting. IF Isabel comes home...does that mean Sergio gets to be around the kids again? How does that work?

 

[mamamia54]

"My husband's a great father who loves his boys, who loves his daughter. He's a great husband, a great father. At the end of the day when she comes home, everybody's questions will be answered," Celis told ABC affiliate KGUN.

OK, then. Becky sounds very sure that Isabel will come home and that everyone will then understand what happened. So, where is the little girl and with whom? Why is she not home where she belongs? WTF!!

I'm not understanding that comment either. It's almost like she knows where Isa is and she's coming home soon. It's either certainty or wishful thinking.

 

[Gardenlady]

I took it to mean "everyone's questions" about the separation/CPS involvement. That she couldn't talk about it now because of the investigation, but when it's all over, all the questions people now have will be able to be answered.

 

[Lava]

I took it to mean "everyone's questions" about the separation/CPS involvement. That she couldn't talk about it now because of the investigation, but when it's all over, all the questions people now have will be able to be answered.

I agree, but I still don't understand it. Obviously LE and CPS believe something about Sergio puts the boys in danger. How does that change once Isabel comes back? I don't think it could be speculation, LE must have something that they FOUND that they had to call CPS. I'm not sure that just goes away if Isabel comes back.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Yeah, I found this statement pretty interesting. IF Isabel comes home...does that mean Sergio gets to be around the kids again? How does that work?

:waitasec: If he's such a great father, why has Sergio been denied contact with his sons? Something stinks - besides the new mulch that DH spread in our shrub beds last night and this morning

 

[SuziQ]

I've never felt so very torn at what has been publicly insinuated ..inferred.. and alluded to about a victims family in my entire life.. and it hasn't a damn thing to do with libel.. slander.. and certainly not about lawsuits.. it has to do with my feeling that this family are helpless victims and what they have been through in just this months time is a hell beyond which any family should ever have to live through..

I'm outta here.. peace

BBM. I feel your pain. However, IMO, until LE clears the family Isa is the only known true victim at this point, and my immediate concern. It's hard to have a discussion when the lines are blurred like they are in this case.

 

[ThoughtFox]

I'm not understanding that comment either. It's almost like she knows where Isa is and she's coming home soon. It's either certainty or wishful thinking.

Personally, I think it's wishful thinking. We hear the same thing from many parents in these missing cases. It's a type of denial, and understandable! JMOO

 

[Shelby2]

deleted .. already answered.

I am still catching up and was just thinking I am so glad I wasn't posting late last night! Those head bang smilies come off as rude enough, but the posts themselves were condescending at best and downright mean at worst.

JMO but people are allowed to have thoughts and theories that differ from yours. Please be nice.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The thing that worries me is this type of attitude will make people, who may have very good ideas or local info, not want to post here. It's just as easy to be polite as it is to be rude. And I hope I have not been rude to anyone. The goal here is to find anything that could help find Isa. It's been done before here and maybe it can be done for Isa.

 

[galiuro]

It is possible that the builder of the Celis house only built that house and not any others....have a relative that basically built his own house under his own contracting license and not any others...

Also pretty sure there is not an HOA in the Celis neighborhood, most of the older neighborhoods in Tucson don't do that sort of thing.

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

As far as I am aware he has nothing in his criminal history that involves violence.

Isnt it mostly the one case about drugs when he was 22 years old then traffic offenses?

I have read a lot worse criminal records on this site than what Sergio has by far.

Yeah, I'm not trying to minimize DUI; it is a serious crime that has claimed many victims. But without knowing the specs of other drug-related charges, I can't get my dander up about them. I have been trying to stay mum about the drug stuff because Im highly critical of how we as a culture and a cj system handle drugs of abuse and I don't believe that this is the time or the place for that. That is just moo based upon my experiences as a researcher (drugs of abuse is my field) and what I have learned outside my own field by sussing out anecdotes and historical documents. But I do know that the Doj says we spend hundreds of millions of dollars each year on drug-related charges, most of which are non-violent. So IMOO I don't wanna assume the worst-case scenario with sc.

 

[jennapuppy]

:waitasec: If he's such a great father, why has Sergio been denied contact with his sons? Something stinks - besides the new mulch that DH spread in our shrub beds last night and this morning

I can understand why RC and Sergio's sister are supporting and defending him. However, just because Sergio's sister says that CPS had no prior contact with him doesn't mean that he's being railroaded by LE at this time.

 

[Anita Richman]

Dad having his two sons chase around the neighborhood when he thought that his daughter had been abducted and taken from the home makes no sense to me. I wouldn't have let my other children out of my sight! What if Isabel's abductor was still lurking in the vicinity of the Celis' home? One or both of the boys could have become victims, too. :moo:

BDE, I'm jumping off your post but this is in response to all of the posts with this type of question. It is really not a giant distance between the Celis home and the businesses where it's been reported the son went looking for Isa. It took me one minute (walking slowly) to get from the Celis' driveway to the parking area/dumpster area of the Party City across the street. So, the boy wasn't off searching blocks away from the "safety" of the home.

On another topic, about the proximity of SC to the boys; I don't know if we know how far he has to be away from them. Although he could peer over the wall and watch the vigil from across the street, the view of HIM from the vigil would have been obscured by the wall, the trees and the sheer volume of people, lights, cameras, etc. In my earlier post when I spoke about walking past "him", I was referring to his BROTHER. I NEVER saw SC outside of his yard. I apologize for any misunderstanding that my post caused.