Bosma Murder Trial 05.09.16 - Day 46

[ILoveDateline]

I wondered that myself. Perhaps MS has already given a statement of what his role was in this crime. And the Crown did not accept his statement, nor offer him any type of reduced charge or deal to testify against DM. Therefore, he had no choice but to go to trial on a first degree murder charge by pleading not guilty.

MOO

I don't know. Yes, to a certain point I agree. Maybe he tried to help out LE/crown but if MS was willing to give up the goods why wouldn't they want that on their side? Maybe they were confident they had a strong enough case without him. JMO.

Maybe MS is guilty (it is my opinion that both DM and MS are guilty) and the judge will give his instructions on whether he can/should be found guilty of murder one or... Do we know what the other options are for MS?

 

[Kamille]

It does make sense to me and I wonder if true, can TD bring this information up at trial?

All MOO.

Well if there is a statement by MS, that the Crown chose not to bring in to evidence, perhaps TD can bring it in? Would he have to do that via MS himself or can he call the LE officer who took the statement? And can the Crown exclude a defendant's statement from their case in chief?

:waitasec:

MOO

 

[Mscree]

Except he was Id by SS that it was him in the video at the hanger

 

[Kamille]

I don't know. Yes, to a certain point I agree. Maybe he tried to help out LE/crown but if MS was willing to give up the goods why wouldn't they want that on their side? Maybe they were confident they had a strong enough case without him. JMO.

Maybe MS is guilty (it is my opinion that both DM and MS are guilty) and the judge will give his instructions on whether he can/should be found guilty of murder one or... Do we know what the other options are for MS?

Maybe they didn't believe him based on the evidence that they had gathered so far? They knew they wouldn't need to make a deal. And certainly after they had gathered more evidence, it appears that both should be tried for first degree murder based on either premeditation or forcible confinement or both?

Just because MS may have said, or possibly will say, that he did not shoot...there is no absolute evidence to back him up. None. And if this was premeditated or it happened during a forcible confinement, it doesn't matter anyway.

MOO

 

[Oreck]

If MS would have changed his plea a year ago I could understand a consideration of leniency, but not now.

 

[Kamille]

Except he was Id by SS that it was him in the video at the hanger

There is no doubt in my mind that MS was at TB's house, left in the back seat of his truck and then transferred to the Yukon at some point. All with the premeditated idea to steal that truck. Then he followed DM driving TB's truck around the region, in the Yukon, to the farm, to the hangar and was eventually seen on camera in the hangar. And he was with DM that entire evening while TB was being incinerated outside the door of the hangar until DM dropped him off the next morning.

There is plenty of evidence that MS was there that night.

I think what people are questioning is whether he was actually in the truck when TB was shot and if he was the actual shooter. Basically, if DM shot TB in his truck while MS was driving the Yukon, is he also guilty of first degree murder? If he was in the truck but not the shooter, is he also guilty of first degree murder?

MOO

 

[Kamille]

If MS would have changed his plea a year ago I could understand a consideration of leniency, but not now.

If MS does not believe that he is guilty of first degree murder, he would not change his plea.

MOO

 

[brightii]

I don't know now what to make of MB's absence at DM's trial, IMO if she knew she wasn't going to be called as a witness, IMO. Maybe she didn't know for sure until today?

Even if MB now believes and accepts that DM is guilty as charged, she's still his mother and IMO she should have at least shown up at his trial to support him, IMO. Maybe some think that's expecting too much of MB as a mother, but I don't. If DM were my son no matter what he did and how much I hated his actions, I cannot imagine a scenario where I would abandon or reject him. I think what I would do is try to get him professional help and I'd be blaming myself for whatever failures I may have been responsible for that could have contributed to his behaviour, even if unfairly, but I would stand by my son even if he was a murderer, IMO. I know it would be a hard thing to do because of the public outrage against DM, but as a mother I think I would make the sacrifice required for my son, IMO.

All MOO.

 

[ILoveDateline]

Maybe they didn't believe him based on the evidence that they had gathered so far? They knew they wouldn't need to make a deal. And certainly after they had gathered more evidence, it appears that both should be tried for first degree murder based on either premeditation or forcible confinement or both?

Just because MS may have said, or possibly will say, that he did not shoot...there is no absolute evidence to back him up. None.

MOO

I agree. I think MS best defence is that DM is disliked so intensely that, by comparison, he will looks good. IMO. CNs terrible testimony and DMs letters couldn't have set the stage better for this defence. Not so good that the jury will be willing to forget his participation but if TD emphasizes him as a loyal friend to a fault, valuing family (his sisters wedding) to a fault and wanting to do right when the time was right, the jury might just give MS some slack. I mean, I was *almost* buying into that story on the MM cross. JMO.

I wish MS luck because I do think he is young enough to straighten himself out. MHO.

 

[Dutchman]

Interesting that the one thing we can remember of SS testimony was his pin pointing MS in the video. Pretty sure the rest was, oh, I can't remember. I think we'll be disappointed if MS does not take the stand. Personally my vote is that it will be Authur. Don't think the family will ever get all the answers they had hoped for. Sadly, I pray they will have enough answers to put this nightmare behind them.

 

[ILoveDateline]

Interesting that the one thing we can remember of SS testimony was his pin pointing MS in the video. Pretty sure the rest was, oh, I can't remember. I think we'll be disappointed if MS does not take the stand. Personally my vote is that it will be Authur. Don't think the family will ever get all the answers they had hoped for. Sadly, I pray they will have enough answers to put this nightmare behind them.

I'd be willing to put good money on Arthur being a witness. But I'm counting on TD to put forth a GOOD showing and I'm expecting more than just Arthur. JMO.

 

[brightii]

I can't wait to hear about the legal arguments regarding TB's case and just what information the public and jury was not permitted to know. We will likely have to wait until after LB and WM's trials are over before knowing, IMO. I imagine some important information was argued away because it overlapped with the other trials, IMO.

All MOO.

 

[Errrr]

Regarding DM's lawyers... while there are varying levels of capability, as ABro said, the defense can only work with what it has to work with.

Although I was not present, I believe that DM's lawyer team worked hard during legal arguments and were successful in preventing a lot of evidence that would hurt DM's case. A very high percentage of their subsequent objections with jury present were granted by Justice Goodman. I suspect that RP and NS tried to block letters from DM to CN but were not successful. These letters were IMO a mortal wound to DM's defense, the iceberg that tore open the ship, now SS Millard is sinking fast. RP and NS have done what they could, a bit more hard rowing to do during the TD defense cross exam, then abandon ship and collect remaining fees..

RP was the better of the pair in my opinion. NS... had a very bizarre method of questioning various witnesses, which I found distasteful and unprofessional.

I got the impression that NS was just following instruction from DM to point out whenever possible what a rich and generous guy DM was. If that's the way DM wants to mount a defence, it's his choice not to listen to his lawyers. Judging from his decision to represent himself at future trial, I assume DM thinks his is their equal.

 

[MorningStar22]

Charged for what? Getting the letters to and from Millard? Are you sure she did that and not a lawyer? Wiping prints from the trailer? Can you prove she knew what was in it?.

They really had nothing on her. I agree with you about her character, but thats life.

Emotionally, I want to disagree and argue this. But I get your point.

So... about those hoses and the bathroom visit at Riverside...Anyone?

 

[Kamille]

I'd be willing to put good money on Arthur being a witness. But I'm counting on TD to put forth a GOOD showing and I'm expecting more than just Arthur. JMO.

TD, or I should say MS, gave up the opportunity to have the last word AFTER DM's attorney gave his closing argument. That is a HUGE deal. So I would imagine he's expecting to have some really good persuasive evidence to present to have warranted that.

MOO

 

[hopingforjustice]

I wondered that myself. Perhaps MS has already given a statement of what his role was in this crime. And the Crown did not accept his statement, nor offer him any type of reduced charge or deal to testify against DM. Therefore, he had no choice but to go to trial on a first degree murder charge by pleading not guilty.

MOO

Can the Crown just not accept a statement? If a statement is given, is it not just given? Can it be revoked if they don't get the deal they want?
I was running this thought over and over if a statement was given, whether accepted or not, would it have had to have been included in disclosure..?? If so, DM's team would know he spilled the beans. Would they then sit back and not call evidence themselves knowing that MS probably would? Because of this, I am thinking MS has not given any statement to LE. Of course my thinking could be way off and I would love to hear others thoughts on this.

 

[MorningStar22]

So good he has no actual defense lined up? I wouldn't want him representing me if I was DM. Not sure what he's actually done for him thus far. I am however thankful for that. Hopefully that means justice for Tim. JMO

Respectfully, we haven't been in the courtroom to hear the arguments, but there were plenty. ABro likely has a much better understanding of the "big picture" here, that we won't get a glimpse of until the jury is sequestered. I think?

 

[Errrr]

If MS does not believe that he is guilty of first degree murder, he would not change his plea.

MOO

If he had told them the "truth" the police would have known what to charge him with then. Why didn't he?

 

[SnooperDuper]

SC has written a great article that outlines the upcoming end of trial process in detail

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/6546273-clairmont-the-end-of-the-bosma-trial-is-in-sight/

 

[MorningStar22]

I can't wait to hear about the legal arguments regarding TB's case and just what information the public and jury was not permitted to know. We will likely have to wait until after LB and WM's trials are over before knowing, IMO. I imagine some important information was argued away because it overlapped with the other trials, IMO.

All MOO.

Good point... I forgot about the pub ban. That will keep this all hush-hush for now? I was also expecting that to shed some clarifying light...