Brain Dead & Comatose = synonyms per news w/s. Preg. Lisa Avila, 37, Orange Co, CA

thread in these cases sometimes, I think, can be gross negligence or extremely bad bedside manner or treatment of the patient or their family. In this case, the pregnant woman went to the ER and they told her nothing was wrong and gave her morphine, allegedly. She and he husband kept insisting something was wrong and wouldn't leave but the staff said she just needed a prescription and would be fine. Her husband finally said he would take her to another ER. They smugly told the couple that since all the hospital computers were linked, no one would help thd drove to the pharmacy. Husband went in to get the meds, came out and found she was no longer breathing. ...
sbm bbm

re^bbm
Gitana1
Asking you (or anyone), as you are local-ish and may have seen more news from other sources.
Do you recall where your source on this? If no time, no worries.
I[/QUOTE]

Yes. Let me link you. https://m.facebook.com/ABC7/posts/10152632202797452
 
The family was also saying things like "the hospital got her into this situation and we reject brain death because they have to get her out of this situation" and yes, I feel terrible for the family and her teenage girls who need her and want her back and how they want things back the way they were. You can't make a big wink while crossing your arms and make it all better.

It's the nature of brain death-- families get confused because the person is reflexing and the family hears "dead" but they have never known dead people to move so they don't believe it. Families very rarely don't become hostile when brain death news is given to them. A friend called me wanting to speak to my husbnd because, -according to her- the ER doctor was being mean and rude and saying her uncle was dead when she (the doc)doesn't know how strong he is and how he always fights hard and wins in the end. (The family agreed to remove the vent 2 days later)

It's irrational and I guess the bargining part of grief kicks in.
 
As far as I can tell, the family went to court today and the court must have granted a TRO against removing the vent until (I guess) a court appointed doctor runs another test and according to one family member this test would determine if the court sees Lisa Avila as dead or alive and the test was (apparently) in progress.

I have speculated a lot here based on what happened with the other case. I could be wrong but I think this is what is happening.
 
As far as I can tell, the family went to court today and the court must have granted a TRO against removing the vent until (I guess) a court appointed doctor runs another test and according to one family member this test would determine if the court sees Lisa Avila as dead or alive and the test was (apparently) in progress.

I have speculated a lot here based on what happened with the other case. I could be wrong but I think this is what is happening.

I've seen nothing about any court appointment for this family. But I did read that the family claims Lisa is showing lower-brain functioning and the doctors now agree she is alive: https://www.giveforward.com/fundraiser/6hv7

I also did a search of her name(s) in the Orange County court system and found nothing.
 
I've seen nothing about any court appointment for this family. But I did read that the family claims Lisa is showing lower-brain functioning and the doctors now agree she is alive: https://www.giveforward.com/fundraiser/6hv7

I also did a search of her name(s) in the Orange County court system and found nothing.

I saw that but I think that was written in February. I am unclear why they said the doctors said that and it could be she has lost PVS status since then and is now brain dead. That is just a guess though.
 
Glad to see the family was given extra time. Now the question is, how easy will it be to get a doctor to agree to come do the necessary testing?
 
already linked. Thank you Hiandmighty http://content.clearchannel.com/cc-c...1427221753.pdf

Per Mar 23 TRO, page 2, para 3), "...Petitioner is entitled to an independent neurological examination with
the assistance of The Medical Center's diagnostic equipment & technicians necessary
to carry out the standard neurologic brain death examination with a repeat EEG and a Cerebral Blood Flow Study
."

Further hearing 10:30 Fri. Mar 27.

Remember Jahi McMath & parties quibbling about who would be allowed to perform exams in Oakland Hospital ~ Dec 2013/Jan 2014?
I wonder if parties here have already agreed on that issue.
 
Why was it Jahi was able to move to New Jersey? Because someone offered to take her?

What will have to happen here for this family to wind up there too.
 
Thank you gitana1 for link to funding site. Goal is $30,000, now at $470, w 7 donations.

"Lisa now has regained some lower brain activity and doctors are in awe of her.
They say she is defying the odds and are still unsure of her chances but now admit she is aliv
e." apparently dated ~ Feb26, w bbm.

If this bbm is true, why would person posting (states Robert Chavez is spouse/partner, team captain/funds manager) not specify doctors names?
 
Why was it Jahi was able to move to New Jersey? Because someone offered to take her?
What will have to happen here for this family to wind up there too.

For a (relatively quick) recap re Jahi McMath, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jahi_McMath_case w many linked references for further reading.

IIRC, w/s thread is closed, no more discussion ATM, but there still is a media-only thread on case. Hope it helps.
 
I've been looking and finally found the Court Order! (Seems her name is Ann Avila?)

http://content.clearchannel.com/cc-common/mlib/616/03/616_1427221753.pdf

Hearing on Friday.

Great find. She's not named Ann though. It's definitely lisa. She went in on an emergency basis (or her husband did) so I guess it's not imaged in the system yet. But now that we have a case number it will be easy to track.

I know the judge. Straight forward, normal judge. He didn't give them much time before a come back date.
 
I saw that but I think that was written in February. I am unclear why they said the doctors said that and it could be she has lost PVS status since then and is now brain dead. That is just a guess though.

Its odd though. Because they state she was examined by 5 experts who determined she was brain dead and THEN they determined she actually had some lower brain functioning. It makes no sense. You don't come back from brain death to any sort of brain functioning. And if 5 experts examined her it would seem they'd be quite certain. So I don't know what's happening.
 
Thank you gitana1 for link to funding site. Goal is $30,000, now at $470, w 7 donations.

"Lisa now has regained some lower brain activity and doctors are in awe of her.
They say she is defying the odds and are still unsure of her chances but now admit she is aliv
e." apparently dated ~ Feb26, w bbm.

If this bbm is true, why would person posting (states Robert Chavez is spouse/partner, team captain/funds manager) not specify doctors names?

I wouldn't think of doing that. What's the point? They are not building a court case online. They're trying to get financial support and prayers. Listing what doctors state what should be left for court documents.
 
Its odd though. Because they state she was examined by 5 experts who determined she was brain dead and THEN they determined she actually had some lower brain functioning. It makes no sense. You don't come back from brain death to any sort of brain functioning. And if 5 experts examined her it would seem they'd be quite certain. So I don't know what's happening.

I agree. It's confusing. Keep us posted if any new documents pop up.
 
I agree. It's confusing. Keep us posted if any new documents pop up.

I guess I can't! I looked and the case number is blacked out and it looks like the case is under seal or not yet imaged because it's not popping up under a name search yet1
 
I thought the case number was blacked out. Why would that be redacted? Isn't that public record?
 
I thought the case number was blacked out. Why would that be redacted? Isn't that public record?

They can request the case be under seal. It would be fairly easy because it has to do with private medical stuff. But the news station got a hold of the documents so that makes no sense. I will be in court this afternoon and look.

Also, I note that the ex parte was filed by the husband "in pro per" but no way did he do all that by himself. Someone is helping the family legally.
 
I haven't been following this closely-- travelling a lot lately. However, I see 2 separate issues here-- the misdiagnosis of the ectopic pregnancy, and the occurrence of brain death.

I read in one article that she was 12 weeks pregnant, and this was her 8th pregnancy (at least). I'm really, really confused as to how an emergency dept could "miss" a 12 week ectopic-- from my experience, I don't think a 12 week pregnancy can "fit" inside a fallopian tube-- they usually rupture a lot earlier than that, so I have to wonder if it was implanted outside the tube in the abdomen? I just don't understand the circumstances whereby a gravida 8, 12 week pregnant woman, with acute abdominal pain would be sent home from ER with a MSO4 script?? Granted, we have no idea what was done or not done at the hospital, and only have the family's version. But something is very, very wrong with that story, as they have told it. I'd expect a malpractice suit will be filed to find out what happened, and they have every right to that.

And the second issue-- this very unfortunate woman is now brain dead, for several weeks, if I have that right? Tremendously sad-- a real tragedy, as she was quite young at 36. The one article says 5 separate docs have verified the brain death critieria (including the not-required, but definitive intracranial flow studies), so I have no doubt that they are correct, and she is irreversibly brain dead. I wonder if the courts will do what they did in Jahi McMath's case-- allow the family to take her, after initiating a death certificate? It's a good compromise for families who refuse to accept brain death, but it does contribute to setting a disturbing precedent.

Somehow, the states all need to come together to have a consensus conference on what to do in these circumstances of brain death with family refusal of diagnosis, because while rare, there have been so many in the news lately that we need a large scale discussion on this, IMO. Just as we did back in the 70's and 80's on the Uniform Determination of Death Act. I don't think it's good to leave the mechanism for resolving these kinds of decisions in the hands of individual judges and individually filed lawsuits, for the long term, for many reasons.

Dead is dead-- families cannot mandate that CPR/ ACLS be continued indefinitely-- why are dead patients on ventilators different? It's hard for me to understand why some people have trouble accepting brain death, although I certainly understand the shock of the diagnosis in the first hours and days. I would want to see the results myself, to be sure-- I do understand that. Is it just because the patient is warm and pink? Why don't people "believe" in brain death, as actual death?

Is there any indication that this case has anything to do with the malpractice caps on payouts for death, versus disability, in California?
 
I wouldn't think of doing that. What's the point? They are not building a court case online. They're trying to get financial support and prayers. Listing what doctors state what should be left for court documents.

You would not think of doing that? FWIW, me neither. Personally, I cannot imagine doing that - opening a funding site for myself - at all ever.

What's the point of naming doctors (in funding site, allegedly now saying she's alive)? Rethinking it, prolly none.

Trying to get financial support and prayers? IIUC, funding sites' goals are $. Many websites & other methods for asking for prayers. Guess nothing wrong w combining requests.

That said, I cannot imagine being in the shoes of her family members facing this sudden, out of left-field medical catastrophe. Sad, sad, sad.
Hoping they eventually find answers & healing they seek.

As always, gitana1, thank you for the benefit of your legal knowledge and experience you bring to W/S.
 

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