CA - Use of deadly force by police disappears on Richmond streets

[i.b.nora]

It sounded like a lot of excuse, to my ears.

" Gee, if everyone would have done what I told them to do it would have worked but it didn't and its not my fault, goodbye…"

Let me see if I understand correctly... are you bashing the Police Chief?

And, I too would like to see links to your supposedly factual claims.

 

[katydid23]

Respectfully, I have to say I'm surprised to see you coming down so hard on a member of law enforcement, one who works hard at what he does, is trying to improve the relationship between le and citizens, has a lot of support, and is leaving only because he, in my eyes, got a promotion of sorts.

JMO

I am not coming down hard but I am cynical about some of his approaches. He withheld the promotions of dozens of African American men and women because he wanted more Latinos. That seemed unfair to bring in younger and less experienced people and give them the promotions that others had earned already. That bothered me.

And it seems that some of his reforms are kind of shallow and not really effective in terms of getting to the heart of real issues. Did you see the Mother Jones article on Richmond?

I grew up IN Berkeley and am very jaded about some of the uber liberal reformers. It does not usually work out that great as far as I can see. Just ends in mass confusion and letting off the guilty parties with slaps on the wrists.


ETA: from Mother Jones:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/06/richmond-california-murder-rate-gun-death

Did This City Bring Down Its Murder Rate by Paying People Not to Kill?

A controversial experiment in Richmond, California, may have slashed street violence—or maybe it just got lucky.

 

[Woodland]

It sounded like a lot of excuse, to my ears.

" Gee, if everyone would have done what I told them to do it would have worked but it didn't and its not my fault, goodbye…"

People hear what they want to hear imo and see what they want to see - everyone can make an argument for what they want to believe in. Attributing a quote to Chief Magnus that he never made (at least not visible here) does not strengthen a view.

He has results that are different from other cities in the area of citizens being shot to death during encounters with LE - the point of the thread it seems - one can ignore that but one cannot make that disappear.

All jmo.

 

[Tawny]

I am not coming down hard but I am cynical about some of his approaches. He withheld the promotions of dozens of African American men and women because he wanted more Latinos. That seemed unfair to bring in younger and less experienced people and give them the promotions that others had earned already. That bothered me.

And it seems that some of his reforms are kind of shallow and not really effective in terms of getting to the heart of real issues. Did you see the Mother Jones article on Richmond?

I grew up IN Berkeley and am very jaded about some of the uber liberal reformers. It does not usually work out that great as far as I can see. Just ends in mass confusion and letting off the guilty parties with slaps on the wrists.

Link needed.

 

[katydid23]

Let me see if I understand correctly... are you bashing the Police Chief?

And, I too would like to see links to your supposedly factual claims.

what claims? You mean claims about police corruption and bribes in the past decades?

 

[Woodland]

I am not coming down hard but I am cynical about some of his approaches. He withheld the promotions of dozens of African American men and women because he wanted more Latinos. That seemed unfair to bring in younger and less experienced people and give them the promotions that others had earned already. That bothered me.

And it seems that some of his reforms are kind of shallow and not really effective in terms of getting to the heart of real issues. Did you see the Mother Jones article on Richmond?

I grew up IN Berkeley and am very jaded about some of the uber liberal reformers. It does not usually work out that great as far as I can see. Just ends in mass confusion and letting off the guilty parties with slaps on the wrists.


ETA: from Mother Jones:

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/06/richmond-california-murder-rate-gun-death

Did This City Bring Down Its Murder Rate by Paying People Not to Kill?

A controversial experiment in Richmond, California, may have slashed street violence—or maybe it just got lucky.

He chooses not to let his people shoot random citizens - that's shallow? Fwiw, I can see Chicago having a problem with that.

But we digress.

 

[Tawny]

I don't think it's at all "shallow" to look at other scenarios and do active training to avoid that happening in your own community. That seems to take a lot of intelligence and thought.

 

[katydid23]

Link needed.

there were many lawsuits against the good police chief. Take your pick:

http://www.contracostatimes.com/bre...mer-richmond-cop-sues-chief-chris-magnus-over

Former Richmond cop sues Chief Chris Magnus, claiming sexual harassment, firing in retaliation
POSTED: 04/06/2015

This is not the first time Chief Magnus has faced blowback from among his rank and file. In 2007, eight black Richmond Police Department officers sued the city, alleging Magnus and former Deputy Chief Lori Ritter made racist jokes and denied promotions to black officers. In 2012, a Contra Costa County jury exonerated Magnus and Ritter, finding no evidence to warrant the allegations.

 

[katydid23]

Hey and look, a deadly use of force incident, under the chief:

http://richmondconfidential.org/201...ng-in-the-richmond-officer-involved-shooting/

But Perez wrestled free from the officer’s hold, then moved toward him, at which point the officer drew his gun and shot Perez three times in the front of the torso, Delik said. Perez died on the scene.

In an official statement released Sunday afternoon, Magnus said an aggressive Perez attacked the officer and attempted to take the gun from his holster.

“The officer and the suspect fell to the ground as they grappled with each other,” Magnus said. “The suspect grabbed and held on to one of the officer’s hands, while using his other hand to simultaneously go for the officer’s gun.”

Delik said he did not see Perez reach for the officer’s gun. The officer did not use his baton or any other non-lethal weapons, Delik said.

Magnus confirmed that batons, tasers, and pepper spray are standard issue for all Richmond police, but didn’t know whether the officer carried or used any of the three on Perez.

“We do have indications that the officer took other steps to try to get the individual into compliance in terms of verbal commands and trying to physically engage with him,” Magnus said. “Exactly why and when he chose to do what is really a key part of the investigation.”

In the days since the shooting, Perez’s friends and family have gathered at vigils in front of Uncle Sam’s and in protest at police headquarters. They question why Perez was shot.

 

[Tawny]

Wow...

 

[Tawny]

Here we have some very positive news regarding law enforcement, someone who's trying to make a real difference, and it's picked apart piece by piece. I'm honestly disappointed and frustrated. JMO.

 

[bluesneakers]

Here we have some very positive news regarding law enforcement, someone who's trying to make a real difference, and it's picked apart piece by piece. I'm honestly disappointed and frustrated. JMO.

Most commenters are supportive and interested IMO. I'm glad you started the thread.

 

[katydid23]

Here we have some very positive news regarding law enforcement, someone who's trying to make a real difference, and it's picked apart piece by piece. I'm honestly disappointed and frustrated. JMO.

This chief who is trying to make a difference has had some very serious lawsuits against him for sexual harassment and for racial discrimination, brought by SEVEN AA officers. If you want to see that as me nit-picking, go ahead. But I am from the Bay Area and I have a different point of view about what I have been told. You can read all of the nice PR articles about what a great guy he is. But there is more to the story if you bother to look under the hood.

 

[Tawny]

This chief who is trying to make a difference has had some very serious lawsuits against him for sexual harassment and for racial discrimination, brought by SEVEN AA officers. If you want to see that as me nit-picking, go ahead. But I am from the Bay Area and I have a different point of view about what I have been told. You can read all of the nice PR articles about what a great guy he is. But there is more to the story if you bother to look under the hood.

Please remember this statement in future threads.

 

[bluesneakers]

there were many lawsuits against the good police chief. Take your pick:

http://www.contracostatimes.com/bre...mer-richmond-cop-sues-chief-chris-magnus-over

Former Richmond cop sues Chief Chris Magnus, claiming sexual harassment, firing in retaliation
POSTED: 04/06/2015

This is not the first time Chief Magnus has faced blowback from among his rank and file. In 2007, eight black Richmond Police Department officers sued the city, alleging Magnus and former Deputy Chief Lori Ritter made racist jokes and denied promotions to black officers. In 2012, a Contra Costa County jury exonerated Magnus and Ritter, finding no evidence to warrant the allegations.

From the quote^:
a Contra Costa County jury exonerated Magnus and Ritter, finding no evidence to warrant the allegations.

 

[EllieBee]

Yes. Starting off on the offensive and broadening the rift between LE and citizens seems to be a very effective model in so many US cities these days.

There are a lot of LAW ABIDING citizens who are sick to death of the bully tactics of LE and applaud those in LE who work closely with the community. Whether it be DARE programs in schools, local philanthropies or just getting to know their neighbors and becoming a part of the community fabric.

I refuse to denigrate those LEOs who are trying to mend the terrible damage done by this police-state "I am the boss, screw your rights" mindset.

All JMO, IMO, MOO.

and breathe.........

 

[Woodland]

Most commenters are supportive and interested IMO. I'm glad you started the thread.

Ditto. People will make up their own minds with this different model of police framework.

 

[katydid23]

Most commenters are supportive and interested IMO. I'm glad you started the thread.

So we are not supposed to discuss the controversial parts about this chiefs time at the helm? We are just supposed to say blindly ' great job' and ignore everything else?

 

[Woodland]

This chief who is trying to make a difference has had some very serious lawsuits against him for sexual harassment and for racial discrimination, brought by SEVEN AA officers. If you want to see that as me nit-picking, go ahead. But I am from the Bay Area and I have a different point of view about what I have been told. You can read all of the nice PR articles about what a great guy he is. But there is more to the story if you bother to look under the hood.

Surely then you can tell us about other police chiefs with similar accusations and how they compare?

 

[Tawny]

So we are not supposed to discuss the controversial parts about this chiefs time at the helm? We are just supposed to say blindly ' great job' and ignore everything else?

If you want to discuss the controversial parts, you have to include all of it. Like how he and Ritter were exonerated. Why was that left out?