GUILTY Canada - Kienan Hebert, 3, Sparwood BC, 7 Sept 2011 - #2

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I don't think people think of him as a hero. What I am surmising is IF he will talk, he and the case will be an interesting case study for future abductions, plus monitor the house in the future. I agree if someone has never come back before, resources are better used elsewhere. That is why they study & keep stats on these rare stranger abductions to try and get ahead of the learning curve for the next time. This was a strange case from the beginning IMO.
 
~n/t~ said:
I don't want this guy getting any leniency because he didn't harm Kienan. I'm grateful Kienan wasn't harmed but others were and he should get what's coming to him once caught.
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I think that's a slippery slope right there tho...

There are so many sick people in the world, and if zero leniancy is given for returning the boy safe and unharmed it is sending a message to other abductors ... The thought of that scares me to no end. On the other hand you don't want to encourage abductions ... I don't know the answers.. I really don't, I just think this is shaky ground, and I have to trust that they are well advised and doing the right thing.
 
I am thinking/hoping/praying he will be classified as a dangerous offender and/or incompetent and be put away somewhere/anywhere that he will never be on public streets again.
 
CrimeBella said:
I think that's a slippery slope right there tho...

There are so many sick people in the world, and if zero leniancy is given for returning the boy safe and unharmed it is sending a message to other abductors ... The thought of that scares me to no end. On the other hand you don't want to encourage abductions ... I don't know the answers.. I really don't, I just think this is shaky ground, and I have to trust that they are well advised and doing the right thing.
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I don't think he's as sick as some may think. Yah he probably has issues but he's smart enough to have evaded RCMP and local authorities (60 officers) across BC and Alberta. He has a criminal mind. This was not his first offence. He's done this before and he will continue to do it again if we let him serve in psych hospital and to be released when the professionals think he is well enough.

As you can see, I think Canadian laws side with the accused. What about the victims? It needs to change.

o/t sort of. Just recently in Quebec, a doctor was charged with murdering his 2 children. He was found not guilty for reason of insanity and was sent to a psych hospital. This guy will be out in no time. Count on it.

It's sickening.
 
Dee10 said:
I am thinking/hoping/praying he will be classified as a dangerous offender and/or incompetent and be put away somewhere/anywhere that he will never be on public streets again.
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Amen!
 
Dee10 said:
I am thinking/hoping/praying he will be classified as a dangerous offender and/or incompetent and be put away somewhere/anywhere that he will never be on public streets again.
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Totally agree with this!

I don't want to give the impression I am in any way thinking he gets a free pass based on his background ~ I just think it's a shame that he had to turn out this way, when he didn't do anything to deserve the contributing factors to who he is today.
 
~n/t~ said:
I don't think he's as sick as some may think. Yah he probably has issues but he's smart enough to have evaded RCMP and local authorities (60 officers) across BC and Alberta. He has a criminal mind. This was not his first offence. He's done this before and he will continue to do it again if we let him serve in psych hospital and to be released when the professionals think he is well enough.

As you can see, I think Canadian laws side with the accused. What about the victims? It needs to change.

o/t sort of. Just recently in Quebec, a doctor was charged with murdering his 2 children. He was found not guilty for reason of insanity and was sent to a psych hospital. This guy will be out in no time. Count on it.

It's sickening.
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I think he is a very sick man. Anyone that steals another child is sick imo.

I agree he does have a crimminal mind, and he is a danger to society and to himself. But I don't think he is smart, at all, - I think he just found a really good hiding spot and stayed there. Even the balloon boy managed that with cops all over the place lol. Growing up without a lot of friends, it's no wonder he knows the back country and hiding spots now like the back of his hand.

I just hope this isn't a game to him right now....
 
Regarding returning K, I wonder he if he just didn't realize how much care a 3 year needs. Was he fussing & crying for Mommy & Daddy. Did he have accidents, picky eater, whining...not the playmate he anticipated? Did the pleas work and if so what in particular struck him, etc?

Will he try to abduct an older child? The previous child in '85 who was in foster care, his lawyer said he had planned to sell him back to his real parents for under $3,000 (it was a strange amount), but he allegedly molested the child twice, so I didn't buy the ransom bit.

I have total faith they will catch him soon & I am sure/hope parents have their kids in virtual lockdown until he is, but I hope we will be able to learn the answers at the very least 'motive'. The professionals (cough) will figure out the rest & perhaps we may learn whenever this goes to trial.
 
CrimeBella said:
I hope this is it and they catch him... I bet the whole area is not sleeping well until this guy is caught...
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I can't imagine living in that community if he's never caught. I would never be able to sleep at night
 
CrimeBella said:
I think he is a very sick man. Anyone that steals another child is sick imo.

I agree he does have a crimminal mind, and he is a danger to society and to himself. But I don't think he is smart, at all, - I think he just found a really good hiding spot and stayed there. Even the balloon boy managed that with cops all over the place lol. Growing up without a lot of friends, it's no wonder he knows the back country and hiding spots now like the back of his hand.

I just hope this isn't a game to him right now....
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Anyone who kidnaps, murders, harms another human being is sick to normal folks like us because we can't ever imagine doing something so horrific to anyone especially to a child. It doesn't make them criminally insane though.
 
~n/t~ said:
I don't think he's as sick as some may think. Yah he probably has issues but he's smart enough to have evaded RCMP and local authorities (60 officers) across BC and Alberta. He has a criminal mind. This was not his first offence. He's done this before and he will continue to do it again if we let him serve in psych hospital and to be released when the professionals think he is well enough.
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Well, apparently you do not have to be to bright, or even human, to avoid capture: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tive-cow-surrenders-98-days-run-abattoir.html :floorlaugh:

But in all seriousness, just living an almost solitary lifestyle can create severe psychological disorders, especially someone who has a history such as his...he is simply predisposed. His physical appearance suggest an underlying disorder, I saw FAS mentioned, but his asymmetrical appearance suggests a possible genetic disorder(by no means is that certain though), he could just be less than handsome to put it nicely. I think either way, some serious research needs to be done on him, and the reason he returned the boy, so hopefully whatever tactics used by LE appealed to him can be used to appeal to other kidnappers.

I honestly think what we have here is someone who has a low IQ, and has never been taught to deal with their emotions in an effective manner, i.e. loneliness manifests into kidnapping, anger into violence and a shyness of people/social awkwardness that resulted into his recluse like behavior. I do think the fact that he returned the boy shows he still has some ability to reason, and is not a lost cause. Do I want him on the streets anytime soon? Absolutely not.

I think years and years of cognitive behavior therapy would only prepare him to live in a halfway home at best. Of course, thats the science side of me speaking...having little brothers myself though, makes me also think lock him up and melt the key into another lock!
 
On Monday, Moskaluk declined to offer details on how someone managed to break into the Hebert home on two occasions.

"With respect to the home, again the RCMP's number one priority was the safe return of Kienan and steps were taken to facilitate that. We cannot discuss any of the details at this time as to how things unfolded here," he told CTV News Channel.

Moskaluk said police are being cautious about divulging any investigative details about why Hopley is considered a suspect.

"At this point in time if Randall Peter Hopley was seen by a police officer he would be placed under arrest, we would have the grounds to arrest him," Moskaluk would only say.

He also cautioned news outlets against broadcasting sensitive details, such as the location of police checkpoints, which could help the suspect evade capture.

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/CanadaAM/20110912/kienan-hebert-hopley-sought-111209/
 
Kamille said:
I can't imagine living in that community if he's never caught. I would never be able to sleep at night
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I am 100 km north and even I am scared. I wish the RCMP could reassure us somehow! I have friends in Fernie and their kids are camping in the parents room. I am sure most people are also sleeping like this... until he's caught anyway.

Every community around is small and surrounded by vast mountain terrain. So many places to hide. Makes me happy though that the bears are very hungry this time of year....
 
I hope this man is locked up for life. He gets no pass from me because he has a birth defect or anything else wrong with him.
 
~n/t~ said:
I just had this crazy thought. Maybe Kienan and Hopley didn't go very far and when the family moved to the neighbour's home, Hopley decided to go back in?? Could they have been inside the house for the 3 days whilst everyone was looking for them?

This is what brought me to that possibility. bbm



http://www.theprovince.com/news/return+mysterious+abduction/5384761/story.html
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I admit I wondered this too. Its interesting to me to note that when LE received a 911 call stating the child would be found at home -- LE WAS OUTSIDE looking around with flashlights according to the media reports! Dad saw the lights from where he was staying and went to find out what was going on, and was then told about the 911 call. It was THEN that they went inside and looked to find Kienan sitting on the couch. You tell me -- if you were a cop and had gotten that call -- would YOU be skulking about OUTSIDE?? Why weren't they INSIDE??

I suspect its because they had a feeling that the suspect and child were somewhere extremely closeby, and wanted to make it as safe and unthreatening as possible for the suspect to make a drop of the child, and a get away (they'd want him nowhere near the poor kid when they took him down!!). Imagine how afraid Kienan might have been if they'd taken a suspect down infront of him! That poor kid could have been taught to believe the suspect was a friend etc.... it would traumatize him further to see them take him down!!

I'm very pleased with how this has turned out so far, and I have no doubt that sooner or later, they'll apprehend their suspect!!Have faith people and be aware that we may not always know what exactly goes on behind the scenes, or why... just for the love of god be happy the child was returned HOME ALIVE, and UNHARMED save for any emotional distress (have to hope nothing of a sexual nature was done to / forced on the child!!)
 
Also - I don't think that the media released the photo of the child playing happily at home with his family for OUR benefit so much as for the suspect's. They want him to see and know that he has done a very good thing and that the child is happy to be home, and loved.... I'd do the same thing if I were LE.
 
I know we all feel so happy that the POI did the right thing. We all know that it very rarely, if ever, happens. Nobody once to "jinx" the whole relief thing by saying something to cause the POI to take another child.

However, this expert has hit the nail on the head, IMO. No sugar coating leniency here.

RH returning the child to the home he stole him from, in the midst of a massive manhunt, is possibly all about power. Regardless of his supposed "lack of intelligence", he certainly had enough fortitude to put a massive risk on himself to take the boy back where he stole him from.


Stephen Porter, Director of the Centre for the Advancement of Psychological Science and Law at the University of British Columbia Okanagan, offered a third — and darker — explanation of the suspect returning Kienan to his home.

“The suspect may have been communicating his power and control . . . and even superiority over the police and parents,” Porter said in an email to the Star. “That is, it could have been a sadistic motivation. He took a huge risk returning Kienan to his home, suggesting a powerful motive for doing so.


http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1052250
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Wondergirl said:
I know we all feel so happy that the POI did the right thing. We all know that it very rarely, if ever, happens. Nobody once to "jinx" the whole relief thing by saying something to cause the POI to take another child.

However, this expert has hit the nail on the head, IMO. No sugar coating leniency here.

RH returning the child to the home he stole him from, in the midst of a massive manhunt, is possibly all about power. Regardless of his supposed "lack of intelligence", he certainly had enough fortitude to put a massive risk on himself to take the boy back where he stole him from.
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I agree 100% with the expert.
 
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