Canada - Marie-France Comeau, 37, & Jessica Lloyd, 27, slain, Ont, 2009 & 2010 - #2

[antiquegirl]

Hazel, here is the article that mentions the hunting camp.:
http://www.canada.com/news/Williams...a false attack accusations/2558062/story.html

Max, Hazel links the same article and quotes from it. The hunting camp was frequented by Mr. Jones, not RW, as mentioned in her post.

HTH

 

[wishingtorihome]

I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

 

[flipflop]

I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

#1 good question, I have not read anything about which direction he was heading.
#2 A neighbour at the cottage stated in the media that she noticed unmarked cars watching from across the lake, she noticed this on saturday, so who knows, LE may have had him under surveillance since the thursday road side stop.
#3 anything is possible....I agree.

 

[Summersolstice]

http://www2.macleans.ca/category/need-to-know/?current=108880#post108880:

"High-profile Ottawa defence lawyer Michael Edelson has been retained by Col. Russell Williams, the former commander of CFB Trenton charged with the murders of two women. Edelson is currently representing Raymond Lahey, a former Bishop of the Antigonish Diocese in Nova Scotia charged with possessing and importing child *advertiser censored*. The well-known lawyer also successfully represented Ottawa Mayor Larry O’Brien in a trial last August, where he was found not guilty of political influence-peddling. Over the course of his 29-year career, Edelson has personally represented over 55 clients charged with murder. Col. Williams is scheduled to make a brief appearance in a Belleville court this morning via video link from the Quinte Detention Centre, where he has been held since his arrest last week."

BBM. For those who don't know about that case, this will get you started:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/nova-scotia/story/2009/10/01/ns-lahey-charged-sydney.html

 

[flipflop]

I just thought of something...
Snipped from a media article:
His wife, Bonnie, the treasurer of a neighbouring municipality, received a phone call one day shortly after police visited their house. “What’s it like to live with a murderer?” asked the female caller, according to Jones.

If Jones was hauled in and questioned for the rapes in the neighbourhood, why would someone call as use the word MURDERER if no one was murdered at this time? This took place before any murders, didn't it?

Am I missing something or did the media screw this up, or did the Jones's?

 

[antiquegirl]

I have many questions. Perhaps another Websleuther has answers or ideas.
(sorry if any or all of this has been addressed already – I may have missed it).

1.) When Colonel Williams encountered the police roadblock on highway 37, members of the OPP were stopping motorists in both directions. (this according to the Macleans article,
– see paragraph 5 on this page

http://www2.macleans.ca/2010/02/16/the-secret-life-of-colonel-russell-williams/4/

Which way was Williams heading - and where was he most likely going?
(also, where was he when he was arrested?)

2.) He must have been very shaken up after getting stopped, (possibly concerned about what the police knew about him). But then, he wasn’t arrested until three days later, which would have given him plenty of time to move or discard things. Could he have done this, or would police have put him under surveillance between the time of the road stop and his arrest?

3.) If police had actually put him under surveillance after the road interview, then perhaps they actually witnessed him discarding things from one of his homes and then confronted him with this information and made the arrest, (which later led to him revealing where the body of Jessica Lloyd could be found). Is any of this possible?

1.) “Williams came to the attention of the police as a result of information gathered during a road side canvass on Highway 37 on the night of February 4, 2010. (snip)” said a statement issued at a joint press conference.

http://www.vancouverite.com/2010/02...el-williams-charged-in-two-slayings-of-women/

This reference to "night" can be found in many media outlets. Also,

"Col. Russell was driving toward Tweed when he was stopped by police at a rolling road block."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

I am assuming from these accounts that RW was on his way home to Cosy Cove Lane when he was stopped.

Williams then turned himself in to Ottawa police and gave a detailed statement to a detective from the behavioural sciences squad.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/story_print.html?id=2564958&sponsor=

Not sure how reliable this information is, but it sounds as if he voluntarily went in to a police station. But this source says:

"So the colonel was asked to come in for questioning."

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

2.) "Something about him wasn't right, he was more evasive than he needed to be," a source familiar with the investigation said.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...that-broke-the-case-wide-open/article1462401/

3.) I agree with you and flipflop that this is possible.

JMO

 

[antiquegirl]

I just thought of something...
Snipped from a media article:
His wife, Bonnie, the treasurer of a neighbouring municipality, received a phone call one day shortly after police visited their house. “What’s it like to live with a murderer?” asked the female caller, according to Jones.

If Jones was hauled in and questioned for the rapes in the neighbourhood, why would someone call as use the word MURDERER if no one was murdered at this time? This took place before any murders, didn't it?

Am I missing something or did the media screw this up, or did the Jones's?

(Underlined by me)

ITA. I thought of the same thing. Methinks Mrs. Jones made this up, but that's JMO.

 

[Hazel]

Hazel, here is the article that mentions the hunting camp.:
http://www.canada.com/news/Williams...a false attack accusations/2558062/story.html

Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

 

[maxfactor]

Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

ah, I see. I guess I'm used to people around here saying they have a hunting camp, or just camp and there is usually a cabin on the lot.

 

[nonfictionrocks]

Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

My husband comes from a a long line of hunters and when they refer to a hunting camp this usually means a cottage or cabin-like structures. Hunting season is in the fall and although some hunters may sleep in tents most either hunt during the day and return to the comforts of their home at night or they stay overnight in more permanent structures - JMO

 

[nobodyzgirl]

That Deep River connection again!

I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. She wasn't in Deep River when she died, she was in Scarborough, and I grew up in Scarborough and the UofT Scarborough campus is not near Warden Woods Park. I actually lived within walking distance of the campus. I don't think they will find a connection to RW. I'd also be surprised if he murdered someone in 1987 and then regressed to home invasions. Most people that commit these types of crimes escalate their crimes, not the other way around - that's just MOO

 

[Hazel]

To most people, "over the lunch hour" would commence approx 12:00 noon, and Cpl Comeau was found less than an hour later.

He must have grabbed her right away and covered her mouth or hit her to knock her out. She is dead before the boyfriend gets there just before 1 p.m. the same day, so she is freshly dead when he finds her.

respectfully snipped and BBM

:waitasec: Found this article (dated January 28, 2010) that has me pondering. Hopefully you guys can help me understand WHY does LE wants to know Marie's whereabout between the late evening hours of Monday, Nov. 23, and noon on Tuesday Nov. 24?

WHY is LE not asking about her whereabouts between noon Tuesday, Nov. 24 and noon Wednesday Nov. 25 (time when she was allegedly seen coming home by her neighbour?)

- Is it possible that the neighbour didn't see her on Wed. 25, but a day earlier?
and
- Is it possible that the the PM revealed she was dead for a while when found?

or
- Is it possible that there is error on this article

or
- Is it possible LE already know where she was Tuesday after the noon hours, but still don't know where she was earlier, and need this info to piece things together.

or
- I'm too tired, and cannot think straight and need to go to sleep.


OPP seek public’s assistance in Brighton murder case
Police anticipate a lengthy investigation in Marie Frances Comeau murder
Jan 28, 2010 - 04:32 PM

BRIGHTON -- Northumberland OPP is seeking the public’s assistance in solving the murder of Marie Frances Comeau.

Police want to determine where Ms. Comeau was between the late evening hours of Monday, Nov. 23, and noon on Tuesday Nov. 24.

“We’re looking for any information at all,” said Detective Inspector Paul McCrickard, lead investigator. “If she visited someone, got gas, or went into a Tim Hortons, we want to know.”

The OPP believe Ms. Comeau was between Brighton and Belleville before she was murdered. She may have been driving a silver, four-door, 2009 Toyota Yaris hatchback.

“She could have been on foot or in her car. We believe she was in her car,” Mr. McCrickard said. “We just want to confirm her whereabouts and who she might have been with. At this point in the investigation, we really have no idea.”

rs&bbm

read more : http://northumberlandnews.com/news/article/147213

 

[antiquegirl]

respectfully snipped and BBM

:waitasec: Found this article (dated January 28, 2010) that has me pondering. Hopefully you guys can help me understand WHY does LE wants to know Marie's whereabout between the late evening hours of Monday, Nov. 23, and noon on Tuesday Nov. 24?

WHY is LE not asking about her whereabouts between noon Tuesday, Nov. 24 and noon Wednesday Nov. 25 (time when she was allegedly seen coming home by her neighbour?)

Presumably because they already know where she was during those 24 hours.

- Is it possible that the neighbour didn't see her on Wed. 25, but a day earlier?

If my neighbour was found murdered and I was home, I don't think I'd make a mistake like that. Everything about that day would be pretty fresh and certain in my mind. It's like you know exactly where you were and what you were doing when you heard about the 9/11 attacks (or JFK's assassination if you're old enough).

and
- Is it possible that the the PM revealed she was dead for a while when found?

Not if the neighbour saw her less than an hour prior.

or
- Is it possible that there is error on this article

It happens a lot, but I don't think so in this case because they have both the days and the dates in there. If it had been just one word in question, I'd be doubtful.

or
- Is it possible LE already know where she was Tuesday after the noon hours, but still don't know where she was earlier, and need this info to piece things together.

This would be my best guess. I think nobody knows her whereabouts during this period and LE hopes to tie it in with her killer.

All above JMO. Good catch, Hazel.

(Respectfully snipped)

EDIT: Sorry, but I just read the entire article and I've sort of changed my mind. Having read the rest of it, I now think maybe the dates could be a journalistic error. Hazel, do you feel like writing to the Northhumberland News and asking for a clarification? If not, I could do it on Friday. If this is indeed a mistake, it's a huge one and should be corrected.

 

[Summersolstice]

I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. She wasn't in Deep River when she died, she was in Scarborough, and I grew up in Scarborough and the UofT Scarborough campus is not near Warden Woods Park. I actually lived within walking distance of the campus. I don't think they will find a connection to RW. I'd also be surprised if he murdered someone in 1987 and then regressed to home invasions. Most people that commit these types of crimes escalate their crimes, not the other way around - that's just MOO

Indeed she was murdered in Scarborough. What if she met someone there who was also from Deep River, and they started a conversation? What if they had known each other previously? The parents have questions, and I think their concerns are worth considering. I trust parental instinct. Hopefully there is DNA evidence.

We don't know what his pattern was...yet.

 

[Summersolstice]

My husband comes from a a long line of hunters and when they refer to a hunting camp this usually means a cottage or cabin-like structures. Hunting season is in the fall and although some hunters may sleep in tents most either hunt during the day and return to the comforts of their home at night or they stay overnight in more permanent structures - JMO

ITA. If it's not a permanent structure, it's often a trailer, or motorhome, or mobile home, something with heat. (Having lived in hunting country.)

 

[antiquegirl]

Indeed she was murdered in Scarborough. What if she met someone there who was also from Deep River, and they started a conversation? What if they had known each other previously? The parents have questions, and I think their concerns are worth considering. I trust parental instinct. Hopefully there is DNA evidence.

We don't know what his pattern was...yet.

(BBM)

RW left Deep River at age 7 or 8. Margaret M. would have been either 4 or 5 years old at the time. If they knew each other back then, it's unlikely they'd remember each other when they were adults. Also, I think the only way the two kids could have been connected would be through their parents. Yet, Margaret's parents have no recollection of him.

"Despite the proximity, they say their daughter and Williams did not know each other as children."

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache...ver&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=firefox-a

 

[pinkeyesucks]

Yes maxfactor, read that. I was trying to make a distinction between "hunting cabin" and "hunting camp". Mr. Jones mentions hunting camp, so I imagined (and I could be TOTALLY wrong), that he was bringing maybe a tent (something portable), and that there is no structure (cabin) there to be searched, like you suggested.

:waitasec: Thinking about it, maybe you are right, maybe there IS some kind of wooden structure(s).

I can't say for sure, but most people in the area refer to their hunting cabins as "hunting camps", but since the hunting season is mainly in the fall and winter they consist (normally) of small cabins, often with a wood stove, sometimes electricity, sometimes not. Tents don't cut it around here especially after you reach a certain age.

I am not sure why, but I don't think that he took her there. I believe that he took her back to his cottage, and that she was still alive when she got there. The sexual assaults lasted for a number of hours (or so it has been reported) and this would have allowed him more time without being spotted. Marie's assault and subsequent murder appear to have a shorter time frame but perhaps when they say "her death was unintentional" it means she wasn't supposed to come home, that it was a panty theft gone bad. The forensics team was not camped out at Jessica's house long enough for the crime scene to have been there, nor was it reported that they found a smoking gun there....Not that they report much of anything that is accurate. But that is just my opinion. Call it a hunch.

 

[pjgrrrl]

As for the aerial search, they did not search into the Tweed area- only by jessica's house, as there was an immediate response to want to search her area, as well as other related streets such as harmony, which extends fully into Shannonville. The helicopters didn't extend their search beyond this, and was called off shortly after finding nothing.

Also Tweed has some random back roads, much like any other small community would. It would have taken awhile to end up on Cary Road, JMO.


I find it interesting he lived in Deep River as a child, I lived very close to there at one point and there is a very weird vibe in the air. Anyone from that area knows Deep River has some strangeness there. My father actually said "oh, well that explains a lot". My thoughts exactly, but I am just confused as to why he would kill (if indeed he has killed before), and then went to assaulting, and then back to killing. Do murderers/rapists usually go backwards? I find that so odd.

OH, and in my neck of the woods- a hunting camp, or cabin= same thing. Generally sits back from the road, has no electricity or very little, has a bed, a stove, (sometimes just a coleman stove!) a sink, a table and a whole wack of games! I have spent many a day in them, it's quite nice actually.

 

[nobodyzgirl]

As for the aerial search, they did not search into the Tweed area- only by jessica's house, as there was an immediate response to want to search her area, as well as other related streets such as harmony, which extends fully into Shannonville. The helicopters didn't extend their search beyond this, and was called off shortly after finding nothing.

Also Tweed has some random back roads, much like any other small community would. It would have taken awhile to end up on Cary Road, JMO.


I find it interesting he lived in Deep River as a child, I lived very close to there at one point and there is a very weird vibe in the air. Anyone from that area knows Deep River has some strangeness there. My father actually said "oh, well that explains a lot". My thoughts exactly, but I am just confused as to why he would kill (if indeed he has killed before), and then went to assaulting, and then back to killing. Do murderers/rapists usually go backwards? I find that so odd.

OH, and in my neck of the woods- a hunting camp, or cabin= same thing. Generally sits back from the road, has no electricity or very little, has a bed, a stove, (sometimes just a coleman stove!) a sink, a table and a whole wack of games! I have spent many a day in them, it's quite nice actually.

BBM

I'm sure anything is possible, though in all the years that I have read/followed true crime I've never seen a serial criminal go from murder, reverting back to home invasion and then back to murder. Generally they start with a smaller crime (i.e., home invasion), when they don't get caught, they graduate to something more serious (rape) and again when they don't get caught they graduate once again (murder) - though that's just MOO, though it seems to be the general pattern for most of these types of criminals. Like you, PJ, I find it odd that he would murder, then go to home invasions, then back to murder

 

[Summersolstice]

As for the aerial search, they did not search into the Tweed area- only by jessica's house, as there was an immediate response to want to search her area, as well as other related streets such as harmony, which extends fully into Shannonville. The helicopters didn't extend their search beyond this, and was called off shortly after finding nothing.

Also Tweed has some random back roads, much like any other small community would. It would have taken awhile to end up on Cary Road, JMO.


I find it interesting he lived in Deep River as a child, I lived very close to there at one point and there is a very weird vibe in the air. Anyone from that area knows Deep River has some strangeness there. My father actually said "oh, well that explains a lot". My thoughts exactly, but I am just confused as to why he would kill (if indeed he has killed before), and then went to assaulting, and then back to killing. Do murderers/rapists usually go backwards? I find that so odd.

OH, and in my neck of the woods- a hunting camp, or cabin= same thing. Generally sits back from the road, has no electricity or very little, has a bed, a stove, (sometimes just a coleman stove!) a sink, a table and a whole wack of games! I have spent many a day in them, it's quite nice actually.

I'm not sure about "going backwards". I tend to think of such people having more than one interest. In other words, couldn't a person have an interest in B&Es while having an interest in more violent things at the same time? Do we even know the "interests"? If a person's personal and work life can be neatly compartmentalized, couldn't their "interests" be compartmentalized, too?