CANADA Canada - Mary Ann Plett, 29, Edmonton AB, Sept 15 1971

[Clouddippingdown]

pleasestandby... you are brilliant. I am of the opinion that nothing is far fetched in the mind of a SK. Goose Lake is also referred to as Lone Pine.

 

[pleasestandby]

I believe that he is communicating again and I also believe that he placed that communication with Victoria Crow Shoe's body... he's telling them he's an old man now.

Clouddippingdown, in your reference to an old man, did you mean that literally, or were you referencing a nickname specifically used to describe Natty Bumppo in The Deerslayer?

http://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/d/the-deerslayer/about-the-deerslayer

 

[pleasestandby]

I am of the opinion that nothing is far fetched in the mind of a SK. Goose Lake is also referred to as Lone Pine.

Goose Lake is about 10 miles from Fort Assiniboine, where the newspapers said Plett's remains were found. Is Goose Lake Road actually on Goose Lake, or somewhere closer to Fort Assiniboine? I couldn't find it on the map. When I Google mapped it, I could now see Looma (where Cooper wanted to see property) is actually on the opposite side of Edmonton as Fort Assiniboine.

https://goo.gl/maps/ASfS68NKdrt

I guess the top portion of the skull does include the upper teeth, so that question is answered.

 

[Clouddippingdown]

Clouddippingdown, in your reference to an old man, did you mean that literally, or were you referencing a nickname specifically used to describe Natty Bumppo in The Deerslayer?

http://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/d/the-deerslayer/about-the-deerslayer

As in Victoria Crow shoe found at the Oldman River Reservoir; I meant that literally with the transposition of two as one. As in The Deerslayer, I wasn't aware of the nickname; however, through application it could also mean we have two literary enthusiasts, if in fact the age of the "James Cooper" is accurate.

 

[Clouddippingdown]

Come forward 44 years from 1971 to Victoria Crow shoe who was found at the Old Man River Reservoir very close to the Crows Nest Pass. We can split the difference with Victoria, B.C. going back to 1991 and the abduction of Michael Dunahee (4 yrs old) from the Blanshard Elementary School Playground and then we can come back to the Crows Nest Pass and split the difference again with Terry and Hailey Dunbar Blanchette (2 yrs old). And then we might ask ourselves was DS a gun for hire? There's many ways to play the name game if you have nothing but time and money on your hands. Maybe, not so much has changed in 44 years other than the hands. Just a theory and MOO.

If we were to know the items left behind at the CNP murders then we may have the advantage of further profiling imo.

 

[Woodland]

... Fort Assiniboine, where the newspapers said Plett's remains were found.

I could now see Looma (where Cooper wanted to see property) is actually on the opposite side of Edmonton as Fort Assiniboine.

SBM

Thank-you for this reminder pleasestandby - Fort Assiniboine is 100 miles from Edmonton or 160 kms in a northwest direction.

We don't know that Mary Ann ever made it south to Looma (from Edmonton) where she thought she was going - anything could have happened after 'Cooper' was picked up at a mall in Edmonton.

Considering all the open and remote space between Edmonton and Fort Assiniboine, why would 'Cooper' bother to drive that distance, then turn around and drive right back to Edmonton where Mary Ann's car was seen that same night about 11:00 pm passing by her office? What was wrong with the Looma site? She would be found to soon? There was still the option of many open and remote spots around Looma that would have kept her hidden for a long time.

This guy went to a lot of trouble - beginning with stalking and grooming Mary Ann over a period of time. Jmo.

 

[dotr]

Starting at about page 60, background info. concerning Mary Ann Plett.

https://books.google.ca/books?id=kh...YeCh2g7Q0e#v=onepage&q=mary ann plett&f=false

"Deadly Encounters: True Crime Stories of Alberta
By Barbara Smith"

 

[Woodland]

Lengthy article,
"Son would try to honour father's wishes and forgive mom's unknown killer, 41 years later"

By Pamela Roth, Edmonton Sun
December 04, 2012

http://www.edmontonsun.com/2012/12/...nd-forgive-moms-unknown-killer-41-years-later


Not long after MaryAnn's disappearance, another female real estate agent received a call from a man with a deep gravelly voice who identified himself as Dave Cooper. He also claimed to be from the east and wanted to arrange to see an acreage property out of town, but the realtor was too busy to schedule the viewing.

SBM

When this article was linked in post #2 it was fine, not opening for me anymore.

Fwiw I don't believe the call to a second agent to show another or the same acreage. An agent is to busy to schedule a showing? That's what they do. An acreage would represent a tidy sum. 15 minutes imo.

The title - husband of victim advises sons to forgive the killer if he is ever found. Hmmm. Having other thoughts here. Jmo.

 

[Woodland]

Actually they died in a plane crash about 7 years after Mary Ann was murdered - worst ever air disaster of the time in Canada. There's a word/phrase for that .....? If it applies.

I'd like to know how many people were involved in putting together the interactions Mary Ann had with 'Cooper'. Did anyone from her office or any friends have any tidbits or knowledge to offer LE?

 

[Clouddippingdown]

SBM

Thank-you for this reminder pleasestandby - Fort Assiniboine is 100 miles from Edmonton or 160 kms in a northwest direction.

We don't know that Mary Ann ever made it south to Looma (from Edmonton) where she thought she was going - anything could have happened after 'Cooper' was picked up at a mall in Edmonton.

Considering all the open and remote space between Edmonton and Fort Assiniboine, why would 'Cooper' bother to drive that distance, then turn around and drive right back to Edmonton where Mary Ann's car was seen that same night about 11:00 pm passing by her office? What was wrong with the Looma site? She would be found to soon? There was still the option of many open and remote spots around Looma that would have kept her hidden for a long time.

This guy went to a lot of trouble - beginning with stalking and grooming Mary Ann over a period of time. Jmo.

Absolutely, Woodland. Therein, by your reasoning imo, proves that everything, including items left behind was preplanned right down to the final location. Area around Looma would have been just fine with lots of hiding spots. Reason by design. He had already designed the whole scenario in his mind (based on something) and he needed to stick to that scenario because of the messages that he wanted to get across to the smart guys, LE. Maybe, he was testing them to see if they could figure it out?? You just answered why it's important to piece Mary Ann's case together using the clues that he left behind.

 

[Clouddippingdown]

The only significance I see related to James Fenimore Cooper is Goose Lake, and a far-fetched relationship at that, is that William Cooper's father founded Cooperstown on Otsego Lake, New York. The setting of The Deerslayer, by JFC, was also Otsego Lake. If you take all the letters, except the letter "t", in the word Otsego, and rearrange them, you get the word goose. Interesting, but far-fetched.

Scalping runs rampant in The Deerslayer, the last of JFC's series.

Goose Lake is often referred to as Lone Pine due to the location of it's former Post Office at the former Lone Pine Store. Apparently, Lone Pine, California is very important to the movie industry going way back to it's beginning in this industry with "The Roundup," starring Roscoe "fatty" Arbuckle. More old west influence.

In 1920, thehistory of Lone Pine wasdramatically altered when a movie production company came to the Alabama Hills to make the silent film The Roundup.[SUP][11][/SUP] Other companies soon discovered thescenic location, and in the coming decades, over 400 films, 100 televisionepisodes, and countless commercials have used Lone Pine and the Alabama Hillsas a film location.[SUP][[/SUP]
TheRound-Up is a 1920 Western film starring Roscoe "Fatty" Arbuckle and featuring Wallace Beery. The movie was written by Edmund Day and TomForman, directed by George Melford, and based on Day's play that was a huge hit forRoscoe Arbuckle's older cousin Macklyn Arbuckle and JuliaDean on the Broadwaystage in 1907. It was Macklyn in the play who created the famous phrase used inadvertisements of the film, nobodyloves a fat man.[SUP][1][/SUP]
Arbuckle was castas a most unconventional-looking cowboy lead in The Round-Up because thestudio didn't want to let their expensive star remain idle while his next comedywas being readied, and the film turned out to be one of Arbuckle's biggestcritical successes.

Could the meaning of Goose Lake aka Lone Pine be "nobody loves a fat man"?

If, there is a SK who possesses this "type" of thinking pattern as in connection to victims, possessions and locations then we, theoretically could follow it through to KARE - could this be Edmonton's SK thread and pick up with the same thinking patterns in the Melissa Letain case whereby items never recovered being a CN Trucking key chain and watch (meaning either time or stalking) is concerned as it connects to the reflected CNP attachment, as I explained on the KARE thread (CN being formerly known as CNP) of the present day Victoria Crow Shoe case close to the CNP (Crows Nest Pass).

What we would have would be a fat man who is now an Oldman who at one time worked for CN Trucking. By combining the meaning of items and locations over a period of 44 years and 3 murders in one Province. Once we have the train of thought in motion we can then look at other similar factors as reflected in other cases, keeping in mind that even though he may be impulsive, he also has the need to be recognized and imposes that recognition through names, items and locations whether it be in a conscious manner or simply because certain items mean something to him.

 

[pleasestandby]

Once we have the train of thought in motion we can then look at other similar factors as reflected in other cases, keeping in mind that even though he may be impulsive, he also has the need to be recognized and imposes that recognition through names, items and locations whether it be in a conscious manner or simply because certain items mean something to him.

More coincidences?

James Fenimore Cooper wrote articles regularly for Graham's Magazine. Mary Ann Plett last seen at Graham Realty

Cooper writes about the lone pine that stood above Otsego Lake in his short story, The Eclipse.

Cooper's father, William, was also a "realtor", as was Mary Ann Plett, selling off lots and farms from his purchase of the Croghan Patent, a huge tract of land around Otsego Lake.

There's even a character in Cooper's story Home as Found in Chapter 16 named Wheaton. Her (Plett's) car was found at Wheaton Auto Sales.

 

[Clouddippingdown]

Her killer was no amateur and from all the name referencing that I'm seeing, I would have to say that he put a lot of thought into every detail of Mary Ann's case and that thought was based on his favorite author. Now, if he lived in the Edmonton area prior 1971 then I wonder if there would be a name reference from one of the author's novels as to the area that he lived. Based on the whole cowboy and Indian theme I'm guessing a farm or ranch type situation with livestock. I'm beginning to put more faith in the speculation from media and RCMP that Mary's Ann's killer was also responsible for 7 hitchhiker deaths and it would be interesting to know who these hitchhikers were, where they lived and where they were found. JMO

 

[Clouddippingdown]

Uncas, Alberta

Uncas
The Canadian Northern Railway established a station here in 1909, and named it after the town of the same name in Oklahoma. James Fenimore Cooper introduces a character by this name in his novel The Last of the Mohicans. The post office operated from August 1925 through May 1968. Approximately 30 km east of Edmonton

 

[Clouddippingdown]

Scalping runs rampant in The Deerslayer, the last of JFC's series.

The Deerslayer, or The First Warpath (1841) was the last of James Fenimore Cooper's Leatherstocking Tales to be written.

There should be a name assimilation with this book.

 

[pleasestandby]

Uncas, Alberta

Uncas
The Canadian Northern Railway established a station here in 1909, and named it after the town of the same name in Oklahoma. James Fenimore Cooper introduces a character by this name in his novel The Last of the Mohicans. The post office operated from August 1925 through May 1968. Approximately 30 km east of Edmonton

Now we just have to find an unsolved cold case murder victim in the vicinity of Uncas or nearby Antler Lake, or, a missing person from the Edmonton area.

 

[pleasestandby]

I'm beginning to put more faith in the speculation from media and RCMP that Mary's Ann's killer was also responsible for 7 hitchhiker deaths and it would be interesting to know who these hitchhikers were, where they lived and where they were found. JMO

Scroll down to "Alberta" at the following link for missing persons

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/mp-geo-index.html#AB

Alberta unidentified persons

[URL="http://www.doenetwork.org/"]http://www.doenetwork.org/[/URL]

 

[dotr]

"Edmonton missing persons cases include:

Jason Freedom Adam, missing since Oct. 21, 2007.
Eunice Antoniuk, missing since June 2, 1972.
Corey David Bannerman, missing since Nov. 26, 2007.
Mildred Batoche, missing since May 26, 1967.
Karl Heinz Behr, missing since Dec. 25, 1981.
Alexander John Belcourt, missing since 1991.
Delores Dawn Brower, missing since May 13, 2004.
Lara Danielle Brown, missing since Aug. 29, 1998.
Maggie Lee Burke, missing since Dec. 9, 2004.
Marie Carlson-Hill, missing since Feb. 15, 2012.
David Michael Creaser, missing since Nov. 19, 2004.
Shelly Tanis Dene, missing since Aug. 1, 2013.
Jon Michael Donohue, missing since Sept. 1998.
Darryl Darcy Dubitski, missing since Dec. 5, 1982.
Melissa Jeannette Ekkelenkamp, missing since July 6, 2011.
David Joseph Gibson, missing since Feb. 2004.
Diane (Daya) Gregory, missing since Feb. 26, 2006.
Wayne Albert Hansen, missing since Dec. 20, 1996.
Michelle Jeanette Harmer, missing since Nov. 15, 1995.
Roxanne Isadore, missing since Sept. 2007.
Dale Edward Mark Jackson, missing since June 28, 2010.
Gayebrella Daisy King, missing since 1978.
Dylan Steven Koshman, missing since Oct. 11, 2008.
Jason Todd MacMillan, missing since Dec. 10, 2002.
Larry Ray Matis, missing since March 10, 1983.
Jeffrey James McArthur, missing since Aug. 27, 2001.
Eileen Gail McCarthy, missing since Nov. 14, 1971.
Dustin Ryan McMillan, missing since Sept. 30, 2010.
Michelle Mercer, missing since Feb. 9, 2006.
Leseriani Mollel, missing since June 22, 2007.
Dean Curtis Mortensen, missing since Jan. 23, 1992.
Tania Marie Murrell, missing since Jan. 20, 1983.
Kenneth Myatt, missing since April 7, 2007.
Corrie Renee Ottenbreit, missing since May 7, 2004.
Stephen Kiley Payne, missing since Oct. 4, 2002.
Craig Brian Rain, missing since Oct. 2000.
Bobby Richards, missing since Jan. 26, 1981.
David Henri Rocque, missing since March 5, 2010.
Linda May Scott, missing since March 3, 2000.
Kate Carol Sieben, missing since Nov. 3, 2006.
Calahan Cihnzay Vandermint, missing since June 5, 1995.
Cynthia Beryl Weber, missing since July 1981.
Joseph Thomas Zerk, missing since Dec. 1, 2001."

http://www.edmontonsun.com/2014/09/03/edmonton-police-sweep-river-valley-for-human-remains

 

[dotr]

Mildred Batoche's name probably popped up earlier in thread, reminded me of Mary Ann, in particular the dark-rimmed glasses, she sometimes wore imo.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...ing-since-May-26-1967&p=12118814#post12118814

"Edmonton, Alberta,Mildred Batoche, 23 ( Millie Wanchisco) Missing since May 26, 1967"

 

[Clouddippingdown]

My vote is with Mildred... her and Mary Ann have a similar look, uncomfortably similar; I think one that might turn his head. This is based on not isolating a SK that appears to be as far advanced as the one in Mary Ann's case to one m/o, but rather 3 or more. If her SK was mid forties in 1971 that would mean we have to go back to early 1950's and not sure about the records that far back. If there is nothing significant with consistency dating back that far then we would probably need to believe that the age accuracy is off in Mary Ann's case and her killer was much younger then he appeared or claimed to be.