Christmas

[Eagle1]

A lot of us have studied a lot more psychology than just Jung, and don't think the theory Patsy's a murderer is at all impressive.

 

[DebE]

I am glad Patsy is a Christian, and I am glad she is such a spritual being. It is truly amazing to me how many criminals claim to know Jesus as their Savior. There are many, many criminals on death row who know Jesus Christ, and there are many others who have never committed a crime who do not believe in a Supreme being.
I can not give Patsy a pass because she is a Christian, that is between her and her God. But I hate it when people use Christianity as a crutch.

 

[SisterSocks]

A lot of us have studied a lot more psychology than just Jung, and don't think the theory Patsy's a murderer is at all impressive.

Oh Jung 's teachings, Must be talking about BrotherMoon. Hi Eagle its been awhile =)

 

[Eagle1]

Long time no see. Welcome back.

 

[Britt]

Brother Moon you should re read DOI!

Read it with the sad knowledge YOUR CHILD was murdered Christmas Day.

I'm not BrotherMoon, but if my child were murdered Christmas Day or any other day, I would have better things to do than read, much less write, a self-serving public-relations book.

I'd be too busy helping LE solve the case and cooperating with the investigation -- reality-based cooperation, that is.

I would not waste valuable time, money and energy hiring a greasy lawyer, running a PR racket, filing lawsuits, writing a book and doing media tours.

 

[Eagle1]

You're right, but there may be a reason for the Rs' strange behavior that none of us would ever have thought of, rather a long story I've already posted in the SBTC thread about an apparent spy, predicted in ancient Ezekiel 28:3 or 3:28, from whom nobody can have any secrets.

Patsy's getting healed from cancer, not one time, which is probably more than I could do, but twice, proves her spirituality is genuine, and in The Patricia Letters, which I think she wrote, she describes a harrassing phone caller she thinks could be the killer but her family are afraid of him and she's not to say anything, so she just hints, but says he made a sound that is "not of this world". I can believe her, because of all the Biblical predictions, which you may not believe, I realize.

It's Satan's last stand, and his m.o. is Accuser of the Brethren or saints, which might explain the hate propagandist at Charlevoix, the one hanging around the gas station, and probably there were others. TV religion people have said we seem to have another Hitler, covert this time, and a Propaganda 2 organization, like Hitler's first one. I dunno, just reporting what I've heard.

If, If, If, as Camper always says, Satan in sheeps' clothing claimed the R's and little JonBenet had too much pride and needed humbling, he may have just used someone who was also at the party on the 23rd, w/out actually being in the house, like Charles Manson murdering by proxy, by knowing what to tell, and like the pathologists' said, maybe the perp didn't really mean to kill her but he may have been mind-controlled to molest her. Anyway, if you were up against Satan himself, you'd lawyer up and all the other things they've done to avoid talking about it.
Correct? I'd suspect "the accuser" in a lot of other cases too, like Svetlana Aronov, Chandra Levy. A woman has written a book about the "dysfunctional CIA", and just maybe he's the reason for that.

Just guessing, and just a tentative opinion of the moment till some better explanation comes along.

Disproving Bro. Moon's claim that Patsy knew of some heathen "Sacrifice Beats the Cancer", notice that she knew to go to a healing service, the first time she beat cancer, none of them having been especially religious before that, and probably she did the same thing the 2nd time. Now the question is, where did that expression "Sacrifice Beats the Cancer" come from? From the actual killers trying to frame the R's?

 

[gaia]

I totally agree with you. I've always maintained Patsy (+Rams) seemed way too preoccupied with self-serving surface matters and not nearly enough on the real issues surrounding their little girl's horrible death. I'll just never forget the first time I saw John and Patsy on TV after JonBenet's death....they made the hair stand up on the back of my neck. It was right then and there I truly believed they were involved and nothing has ever really convinced me otherwise. In fact, the more I learned, the more certain I became they were responsible.

As for BrotherMoon, his particular investigative slant on this case isn't necessarily everyone's cup of tea, but probably because I'm so fascinated with psychology, I find his interpretations of the crime to be useful and interesting.

Nuff said. :hand:

 

[Britt]

As for BrotherMoon, his particular investigative slant on this case isn't necessarily everyone's cup of tea, but probably because I'm so fascinated with psychology, I find his interpretations of the crime to be useful and interesting.

So do I, Gaia. IMO his analysis of Patsy is closer to the truth than most and may even be right on. But I also think John was involved somehow, either before (sexual abuse) or after (coverup assistance) or both.

Eagle, if it were Satan, is it not just as likely that he used Patsy as his tool for evil as an intruder? And wouldn't it make more sense logistically to use someone already in the home?

 

[Eagle1]

Sorry to have to disagree, will do it in as civilized a way as possible, but

just jumping to conclusions when you first see people, as you say you did, which is evidently what Bro. M. did too, isn't exactly INVESTIGATION, proofs, or psychology, far from it ! But believe whatever you want.

Editing after reading Britt's post. We were posting at the same time.

Nope, people just saying they believe "the devil made someone do" some crime doesn't prove a thing.

Satan's actually a coward, "resist the devil and he will flee from you", maybe even before trying anything, and no mere Satan could make a normal mother kill her child, no matter what she's been through. Andrea Yates, who they say had been mentally ill a long time, may have been easy for him.

JonBenet was Patsy's whole life and Patsy's never been shown to have been unstable mentally. You a mom?

I keep thinking about (Schiller's book?) John reportedly saying "I'm so sorry," without finding out what he meant. He was not confessing, or would be incarcerated by now. We all go through several stages of grief, including wondering if there was some way we were negligent.

Someone must have been telling him he'd been too lax about security or something.

 

[gaia]

If we accept the premise that heaven and hell occur here on earth and could be a measure of how our lives go while here, Satan might be interpreted as that part of our minds which defies logical thought and rules of the society in which we live. Kinda like Flip Wilson's "the devil made me do it". This kind of thinking, which may or may not affect our behavior, could be beyond our control or perhaps a mode of thinking we've learned. To me, Patsy was strongly influenced by her mother's point of view - and that's putting it mildly - not to mention her religious zeal. Families go from one generation to the next sharing and perpetuating sometimes bizarre ideas or themes - as with the idea Satan is real and messes with our lives. That's just one example from Patsy's world. She has many and they surely contributed to so many strange ways of looking at the world, her daughter, what life's about and how it is to be lived. This is true for all of us, but in Patsy's case, she's spoken and written often about her world viewpoint and justification for so many things that have happened to her and her family.

To me, Patsy reminds me of someone who might believe The Farmer's Almanac predicts weather, etc., the Bible should be taken literally, and it's completely logical to think a small foreign faction killed her daughter. To me, that's quite a stretch.

 

[gaia]

About John walking around saying "I'm sorry", I think he sees himself as the leader who must be right and do all the right things or someone might blame him for something going wrong - even when he's not responsible for whatever went wrong around him - thus - "I'm sorry". Some people just can't stand to be blamed and will go to great lengths to ensure they aren't. Poor old John was not able to prevent the murder, so he was left to only apologize. Must have been Hell for him. I suspect that fact grated on him personally more than anything else - except the death of his daughter, of course.

 

[Eagle1]

Yes, John, and Patsy too, may be rather perfectionist. There's also the "guilt" part of grieving. Most of us when we hear someone's dead may beat ourselves up a bit about not having been able to do anything to save them.

BTW, when we object to any hater's post about PR, we're simply defending a fellow Christian, genuinely spiritual woman, who may have made a mistake letting JonBenet go with somebody (She told her sister We didn't mean for THIS to happen") but certainly isn't a killer.

And AUTHORITIES, professionals like FBI, don't feel the parents are guilty, have expressed sympathy because they not only lost a beloved child, but also get blamed and hated by a lot of people who weren't there.
So who are we to claim we know better than they?

We "hate the sin rather than the sinner" but feel honor and duty bound to defend a fellow human who's been dealt a terrible blow, and even had to help cover it up! FOR SOME REASON !!! Evidently.

 

[gaia]

We hate the sin and not the sinner. I'm with you on that. Deal is, Patsy and John have made it hard to be very sympathetic toward them. From day one, I felt a negativity about them that is hard to explain but was palpable. This was at the very beginning when the death was just a horrible news story. Their behavior from that time on just felt wrong. I read their book and felt appalled. Dunno. Sure, I have no idea how I'd act in that circumstance or what I'd say, but I don't think it would resemble what these two people did. That's all.

This is an intuitive call. Mine only.

 

[claudicici]

I found this old thread.I'm amazed.I feel exactly the same way Brother Moon does.
This makes perfect sense to me.It also makes me think of Patsy's premonitions,
seeing the perfect JB in the coffin and introducing death to christmas.
Do her premonitions really reaveal her premeditations?

 

[Tadpole12]

Heyya claudicici,

Following the various books, with their described reactions and comments from the Ramseys, it's difficult to ascertain a degree of guilt,' through these snippets of their 'decribed behaviour'. IMO

But one thing, that has been often pointed out by various posters is that the Ramsey shared little intimate physical contact on the day of the discovery of JBR's body. No one describes the clutching, clinging and gripping embrace that is seen among partners in a solid relationship, when they receive devastating news.
It's magnetic, IMO, you dive into each others arms, the only place in the world that is safe and grounded, held in your partners arms. And you cling to your partner.

Seems to me, there was a distance between the Ramseys.

 

[joeskidbeck]

Heyya claudicici,

Following the various books, with their described reactions and comments from the Ramseys, it's difficult to ascertain a degree of guilt,' through these snippets of their 'decribed behaviour'. IMO

But one thing, that has been often pointed out by various posters is that the Ramsey shared little intimate physical contact on the day of the discovery of JBR's body. No one describes the clutching, clinging and gripping embrace that is seen among partners in a solid relationship, when they receive devastating news.
It's magnetic, IMO, you dive into each others arms, the only place in the world that is safe and grounded, held in your partners arms. And you cling to your partner.

Seems to me, there was a distance between the Ramseys.

Tadpole, in my opinion, that is the most interesting thing anyone has ever said on this board. I have never known a woman who would have let her husband (or her son) out of her sight on that day. When my dad died, I will never forget that my sister sat on the couch for 12 hours with her husbands arms around her. I remember that because at the time I was thinking how nice it would be to have that kind of comfort. This would be compounded a thousand times if your child were missing or dead. No, the Ramseys have never, for one moment, shown the true emotions of a parent of a murdered child. You know, this is such an ugly case. There have been lots of ugly murders of children, but this one is tops on my list because of the parent's behavior. They were afraid to be around each other that day, lest their behavior expose their secret......

 

[MurriFlower]

I found this old thread.I'm amazed.I feel exactly the same way Brother Moon does.
This makes perfect sense to me.It also makes me think of Patsy's premonitions,
seeing the perfect JB in the coffin and introducing death to christmas.
Do her premonitions really reaveal her premeditations?

I guess this has nothing to do with your post cici, but reading back was interesting:

BrotherMoon - banned
Eagle1 - banned
sisi - banned
TessaRing28 - banned
DebE -banned

 

[claudicici]

oh,oh,lol I saw that too wonder why?

 

[MurriFlower]

oh,oh,lol I saw that too wonder why?

IDI perhaps??

 

[claudicici]

they were not just IDI....

oh and speaking of christmas I never noticed there was a broken ,PURPLE christmas ornament in the wine cellar !

http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-ornament-broken.htm