FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #21

[Jersey*Girl]

Gosh I've missed so much. I'm trying to catch up but wanted to note 3:18 is the definite time Michelle arrived at Dale's complex. I'll look for the backup to that today, Thor, bc I know you'll ask . I know it was released in the media about the neighbor's security camera but the proof I'm talking about actually was in an interview where people in Michelle's family spoke, as well as the OPD, and it was determined by the OPD & experts that the neighbor's video was only off by 2 seconds or 2 minutes (something like that). Please just give me some time to look for the right link.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Imo, if there is a poi in a case & only 1 thus far, then that person is a suspect. A suspect & poi are one in the same, it's only a term le uses with each choosing to use whichever term. If there's only 1 suspect, that person would automatically be deemed prime suspect bc there's nobody else named to compare with. By naming a person prime suspect, it legally allows le to pull more pertinent info. It's an investigative tool & tactic, nothing less or more. It doesn't mean he's guilty or conversely innocent, but it warns to be cautious & allows for deeper info to be pulled. In this instance, I personally do suspect le has some stuff that they're trying to piece together, mainly Michelle's person. My own opinion is that I'm still on the fence. I know that sounds crazy to you guys based on what's released, but I see several factors on how I think she could have been targeted or maybe Dale's being framed...who really knows at this point?

 

[TxLady2]

IMO it will be easy to prove Dale was involved in her disappearance. Without seeing all the evidence we do NOT know what's behind door #2...With what we do know...I still believe the DA's office has enough for a conviction. Based on cell pings, Michelle's phone activities, Jr's activities on the days in question, FB activity with him and friends, and a host of other IMO admissible evidence...I believe the DA could get twelve peers to collectively form a guilty verdict.

The odds right now are probably not high enough that any DA that's in his or her right mind would feel confident to secure said conviction... That being said the burden of proof could be met IMO at this moment but why rush the process? If Dale is being tailed and kept in check by private and public eyes, he poses little immediate danger to the public. Why not sit back continue collecting evidence UNTIL you feel 99% sure you'll get said conviction? JMO

Respectfully....

If they don't even have the evidence to arrest and charge him, how on earth do you think a jury would have enough to convict him? LE is supposed to know a lot more than we do, and by "we", I mean the general public which is where a jury is going to come from.

There may be enough probable cause to arrest him... but that is a long way from being guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It's not what you know, it's what you can prove that matters.

I seriously doubt that they're sitting back just biding their time, waiting for the right moment to slap those handcuffs on. I think it's possible they're hoping to find her body so they will hopefully find enough evidence to connect him to the crime. At this point, they can't even prove that she's dead, or was murdered, and specifically that he did it.

Like most people here, I believe he did it, but I want to see the proof. They only get one chance at this, and it better be right the first time.

 

[Skully]

Imo, if there is a poi in a case & only 1 thus far, then that person is a suspect. A suspect & poi are one in the same, it's only a term le uses with each choosing to use whichever term. If there's only 1 suspect, that person would automatically be deemed prime suspect bc there's nobody else named to compare with. By naming a person prime suspect, it legally allows le to pull more pertinent info. It's an investigative tool & tactic, nothing less or more. It doesn't mean he's guilty or conversely innocent, but it warns to be cautious & allows for deeper info to be pulled. In this instance, I personally do suspect le has some stuff that they're trying to piece together, mainly Michelle's person. My own opinion is that I'm still on the fence. I know that sounds crazy to you guys based on what's released, but I see several factors on how I think she could have been targeted or maybe Dale's being framed...who really knows at this point?

What she said!

 

[Skully]

Does a Hummer have GPS and if so, can LE get anything from it in the way of where it was or tracking?

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Does a Hummer have GPS and if so, can LE get anything from it in the way of where it was or tracking?

Yes, it's built into it, standard factory in a Hummer. However, Michelle's was never turned on...OnStar I think? That's on the net somewhere but I specifically remember it being the very first question I asked either on this forum or another. It was proven to me in a link supplied to an interview or else it was said by her family on her Missing FB profile. I honestly don't remember so please forgive me.

However, Michelle had an iPhone. If she had her notifications turned on to be able to "check-in" to places on Facebook, then investigators could backtrack that path taken simply by pulling the database backup to that software, bc even if she didn't officially "check-in" but rather had her setting to be allowed, then the internal gps on her iPhone would have traced that path. I've wondered this since the beginning.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Be back shortly, gotta run...

 

[sandina]

Just an attempt at being more specific on the window:
3:18 pm - MP seen on video in car in front of Dale's condo.
3:22 pm - MP parks, gets kids out of car, and enters Dales condo.
(something happens)
3:55 pm - Dale begins to pack up kids to go to parents house.
4:00 pm - Dale leaves towards parents house as he would need 30 minutes to get there
4:30 pm - Dale arrives at parents house as per witness.


As for the "something happens", if Dale did something, then everything would be likely to have occurred in this 33 minutes. If you were to believe Dale somewhat then Dale would have a relatively unexplained time between 3:32 pm and 3:55 pm, about 23 minutes.

The only way that Dale could have committed the crime, IMO, is that someone else was involved from the beginning at Dale's condo and that specific person is his mother, father, or both. I don't see Dale as the type of person to have such loyal friends that would cover up a dead body for him.

The extra person would allow him a much larger window obviously, and it could have been his mother driving Dale's car to her house with the kids.

I don't see him committing the crime, cleaning up, moving the H3 into the garage, etc. in less than 33 minutes. Not completely impossible, but difficult to see. And then you would have the situation with leaving incriminating evidence at his condo for at least an hour.

Great post! I just have one issue. By Dale's own timeline, which we know isn't true now (Michelle arriving at 4pm & he & her both left 10 minutes later), he would say he left at 4:10, arriving at parents house at 4:30, correct? I still contend that perhaps he wasn't at the parents house at EXACTLY 4:30 but maybe 4:35, 4:38, etc.

 

[southern_comfort]

Just an attempt at being more specific on the window:
3:18 pm - MP seen on video in car in front of Dale's condo.
3:22 pm - MP parks, gets kids out of car, and enters Dales condo.
(something happens)
3:55 pm - Dale begins to pack up kids to go to parents house.
4:00 pm - Dale leaves towards parents house as he would need 30 minutes to get there
4:30 pm - Dale arrives at parents house as per witness.

~snipped~

BBM: Where did the 3:22 come from? Thanks!

 

[southern_comfort]

Great post! I just have one issue. By Dale's own timeline, which we know isn't true now (Michelle arriving at 4pm & he & her both left 10 minutes later), he would say he left at 4:10, arriving at parents house at 4:30, correct? I still contend that perhaps he wasn't at the parents house at EXACTLY 4:30 but maybe 4:35, 4:38, etc.

I don't think we know the 4:00 arrival timeline isn't true from DS's perspective. We know she entered the complex at 3:18, but I don't think we know how long it took her to go up to the door (unless I missed something, which is possible).

 

[Jazzmaster]

Respectfully....

If they don't even have the evidence to arrest and charge him, how on earth do you think a jury would have enough to convict him? LE is supposed to know a lot more than we do, and by "we", I mean the general public which is where a jury is going to come from.

There may be enough probable cause to arrest him... but that is a long way from being guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. It's not what you know, it's what you can prove that matters.

I seriously doubt that they're sitting back just biding their time, waiting for the right moment to slap those handcuffs on. I think it's possible they're hoping to find her body so they will hopefully find enough evidence to connect him to the crime. At this point, they can't even prove that she's dead, or was murdered, and specifically that he did it.

Like most people here, I believe he did it, but I want to see the proof. They only get one chance at this, and it better be right the first time.

No...I think we are on the SAME page. My point was they MOST LIKELY have enough to satisfy "probable cause" but are not convinced they could CONVICT him. It was and still is MOO if the case was painted corrected and certain evidence was deemed admissible in court...there is a chance...be it a small one...that a jury COULD find Dale guilty. With the burden of proof resting on the shoulders of the DA's office...I do not see them pressing forward until they are all but certain they can get a conviction... Hope that it explains my point a bit better.

 

[Jazzmaster]

Imo, if there is a poi in a case & only 1 thus far, then that person is a suspect. A suspect & poi are one in the same, it's only a term le uses with each choosing to use whichever term. If there's only 1 suspect, that person would automatically be deemed prime suspect bc there's nobody else named to compare with. By naming a person prime suspect, it legally allows le to pull more pertinent info. It's an investigative tool & tactic, nothing less or more. It doesn't mean he's guilty or conversely innocent, but it warns to be cautious & allows for deeper info to be pulled. In this instance, I personally do suspect le has some stuff that they're trying to piece together, mainly Michelle's person. My own opinion is that I'm still on the fence. I know that sounds crazy to you guys based on what's released, but I see several factors on how I think she could have been targeted or maybe Dale's being framed...who really knows at this point?

I respectfully disagree on all accounts here...There’s a BIG difference between a suspect and a POI. A person of interest is someone LE wants to talk to for information about a case...A suspect on the other hand is a person LE BELIEVES may be INVOLVED in the crime.

As for Dale being "framed" or someone else "targeting" Michelle we have ABSOLUTELY NO evidence to support those theories...Plenty to support HOW Dale COULD be involved but I have yet to see ONE piece of info released that points to ANYONE other than Dale. JMO

 

[Jazzmaster]

Good morning everyone!

I'm reading back to catch up on what I've missed (I should probably start waaay back), and saw this. I understand your analogy, Jazz, but I also see Thor's point. Something to think about is this: When my husband & I were trying to have a baby, we suffered 2 false positives. So re your little bit pregnant analogy, it could in all honesty be a false positive...which coincidentally would be proving a negative lmao... :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

Again my point had nothing to do with Dale being falsely accused. I was stating with my analogy, he is either GUILTY or not guilty. There's no in between. IMO all that has been released by MSM and my own research points TOWARD his guilt and until new info is released that points away from his guilt...which BTW I do NOT believe such evidence exists...I will continue to believe Dale is GUILTY of MURDERING Michelle. JMO

 

[missingm]

Great post! I just have one issue. By Dale's own timeline, which we know isn't true now (Michelle arriving at 4pm & he & her both left 10 minutes later), he would say he left at 4:10, arriving at parents house at 4:30, correct? I still contend that perhaps he wasn't at the parents house at EXACTLY 4:30 but maybe 4:35, 4:38, etc.

I came across the 4:00pm by backing up from when he was witnessed (whether parents or neighbor) to arrive at his parents' house.

Background on how long:
* Google maps show that it would take 28 minutes in traffic, 23 minutes without. * Also a news organization tested the path and said that it took a little over 23 minutes, although we don't know the traffic conditions.
* Likewise Jazzmaster tested the drive, shortest at 20 minutes, but allowed for 30 minutes as the longest. (Of course if she drives as fast as she types... :rollercoaster: ) jk Jazz....

I think that he (or someone) went to his parents house because his story (if you believe him) and the cell phone pings (if you believe he had it) seem to both indicate that general direction.

 

[missingm]

BBM: Where did the 3:22 come from? Thanks!

Well, 3:18pm was the timestamp that she appeared in the video. She had not rounded the corner and parked yet. Without knowing the seconds, we can generalize that it could have been 3:18:30 pm. (30 seconds). So I generally gave he 3 and a half minutes to a) park, b) get the kids and probably bag for clothes out of the car and walk kids to front door. I am open for other suggestions on the general amount of time.

Most of the intention of this timeline is to see what could have been done if Dale caused her disappearance. I think it limits his actions if it was a crime of passion and he acted alone. Limits, but does not rule out the possibility. IMO, he would have had to hide the car (likely in the garage) and take care of the body. I think that leaves him minimal time to clean up the crime scene, so there couldn't have been any blood.

IMO, there is no way the Dale would have left his condo with her body just lying on the floor, her hummer parked outside, or any blood on the floor. IMO, he is just not that composed or without fear to do it. He probably would have had to put her body in the hummer in his garage and or taken her with him.

Wish I knew how the bf (and friends) were cleared... it would put my mind at ease as he is the typical profile that message boards like this one go crazy over. Willing to accept (somewhat) for now tho'.

 

[Skully]

Imo, if there is a poi in a case & only 1 thus far, then that person is a suspect. A suspect & poi are one in the same, it's only a term le uses with each choosing to use whichever term. If there's only 1 suspect, that person would automatically be deemed prime suspect bc there's nobody else named to compare with. By naming a person prime suspect, it legally allows le to pull more pertinent info. It's an investigative tool & tactic, nothing less or more. It doesn't mean he's guilty or conversely innocent, but it warns to be cautious & allows for deeper info to be pulled. In this instance, I personally do suspect le has some stuff that they're trying to piece together, mainly Michelle's person. My own opinion is that I'm still on the fence. I know that sounds crazy to you guys based on what's released, but I see several factors on how I think she could have been targeted or maybe Dale's being framed...who really knows at this point?

All good points. I am too still on the fence, because of the circumstances in which she went missing, being not in Dale's favor; like daylight, kids, crime at his condo, all the ones I listed before. Also the timeline is really tight.

Have you seen Death of a Golden Girl? it is still on line for Dateline. Paula Sladewski, and her bf Kevin Klin. If ever a guy looked guilty because of circumstances, he was it. The only thing that saved him was a very grainy video putting her with someone else. They had the same history as MP and DS and she was a knock out. They had a fight in Miami, club Space and he was kicked out and she was too, but they didn't exit together. He was first, her exit was a few minutes later. If you haven't see this show, it is a good reason to think about your POI. He was the POI for a long time, until they found this video. There are differences in the case for those who will say it's not the same thing, yes, but he was the last one to be with her, until he was kicked out and she left the same exit, all on video, but then she just disappears. She is found in a dumpster, burned. So someone didn't want DNA. They were vacationing from Michigan and went to Miami for New Years. I am not saying Dale didn't do this, or he did, because they have to have some thing more to arrest him because of cases like this.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

I respectfully disagree on all accounts here...There’s a BIG difference between a suspect and a POI. A person of interest is someone LE wants to talk to for information about a case...A suspect on the other hand is a person LE BELIEVES may be INVOLVED in the crime.

As for Dale being "framed" or someone else "targeting" Michelle we have ABSOLUTELY NO evidence to support those theories...Plenty to support HOW Dale COULD be involved but I have yet to see ONE piece of info released that points to ANYONE other than Dale. JMO

Jazz, I think you took my post out of context. When I stated there's no difference between suspect & poi, I'm only referring to if there's only one person that police have their eye on. In this case, it would only be their choice to use whichever term.

Legal def:
http://definitions.uslegal.com/p/person-of-interest/

 

[Thor]

Again my point had nothing to do with Dale being falsely accused. I was stating with my analogy, he is either GUILTY or not guilty. There's no in between. IMO all that has been released by MSM and my own research points TOWARD his guilt and until new info is released that points away from his guilt...which BTW I do NOT believe such evidence exists...I will continue to believe Dale is GUILTY of MURDERING Michelle. JMO

"They're looking for any way to move the case forward," Bailey told WKMG. "When you have very limited information or limited evidence, it's a very good thing to do."

HERE

 

[SleuthDecay]

Imo, if there is a poi in a case & only 1 thus far, then that person is a suspect. A suspect & poi are one in the same, it's only a term le uses with each choosing to use whichever term. If there's only 1 suspect, that person would automatically be deemed prime suspect bc there's nobody else named to compare with. By naming a person prime suspect, it legally allows le to pull more pertinent info. It's an investigative tool & tactic, nothing less or more. It doesn't mean he's guilty or conversely innocent, but it warns to be cautious & allows for deeper info to be pulled. In this instance, I personally do suspect le has some stuff that they're trying to piece together, mainly Michelle's person. My own opinion is that I'm still on the fence. I know that sounds crazy to you guys based on what's released, but I see several factors on how I think she could have been targeted or maybe Dale's being framed...who really knows at this point?

IMO, the biggest distinction between POI and PS is suspicion vs. evidence. Police may privately call a person a "suspect", but if they have no real evidence, just suspicion based on, say, criminal history and/or inability to rule the suspect out, they will (publicly at least) use the softer term "person of interest'. If, on the other hand, they have solid evidence (even if not enough to arrest), they'll feel comfortable enough from a legal standpoint to publicly tag the person a "suspect". There could also be other reasons to use one term vs. the other, but, IMO, this is the most common reason. JMO. And I fully understand that the "suspect" tag does not equal guilt.

 

[SleuthDecay]

I don't think we know the 4:00 arrival timeline isn't true from DS's perspective. We know she entered the complex at 3:18, but I don't think we know how long it took her to go up to the door (unless I missed something, which is possible).

If Michelle had been sitting outside Dale's in her car for 42 minutes as you have previously suggested, there would be evidence of this, IMO. She most likely would've been texting someone, probably her boyfriend, since they had been exchanging texts just before she pulled up to Dale's. This also would've been the perfect time to get in touch with her son (as she normally did), as he would've been getting home from school during this window of time. We know she wasn't texting her boyfriend and we know she never contacted her son, or anyone to make arrangements for him so he wouldn't be home alone. IMO, your theory that she may have sat in the car for 42 minutes is not viable.