FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #23

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Even though it's the Huff. Post It's good to see more National attention back on Michelle's case.

Michelle Parker's Mom Files Wrongful Death Lawsuit Against Missing Daughter's Ex-Fiance

"This is really about accountability and people answering questions that really haven't been answered yet," Morgan said. "Yvonne last night was sobbing, and because she feels like nobody ever had to answer for what really happened."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...d=maing-grid7|main5|dl5|sec1_lnk2&pLid=282281
 
No, they're with Dale in Tennessee.

That's scary...The actions of Josh Powell under pressure come to mind. I hope someone is keeping a close watch over those kids!
 
Even though it's the Huff. Post It's good to see more National attention back on Michelle's case.

Michelle Parker's Mom Files Wrongful Death Lawsuit Against Missing Daughter's Ex-Fiance

"This is really about accountability and people answering questions that really haven't been answered yet," Morgan said. "Yvonne last night was sobbing, and because she feels like nobody ever had to answer for what really happened."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/...d=maing-grid7|main5|dl5|sec1_lnk2&pLid=282281



Just FYI: the story was also on AOL's "welcome" page.
 
Im guessing Dale Sr. and Mrs. Dale Sr. will NOT be able to take the fifth?

I hope we get to learn some of the details ....of that night and the next day by asking Dale jrs Parents or was also his sister still living in the home?

Was Dale Sr asked questions under oath at one time? or and I confused with another case?
 
Im guessing Dale Sr. and Mrs. Dale Sr. will NOT be able to take the fifth?

I hope we get to learn some of the details ....of that night and the next day by asking Dale jrs Parents or was also his sister still living in the home?

Was Dale Sr asked questions under oath at one time? or and I confused with another case?

BBM. I saw something similar below in Jersey's post. Why can't they plead the fifth?
 
Im guessing Dale Sr. and Mrs. Dale Sr. will NOT be able to take the fifth?

I hope we get to learn some of the details ....of that night and the next day by asking Dale jrs Parents or was also his sister still living in the home?

Was Dale Sr asked questions under oath at one time? or and I confused with another case?

Yes, Sr was questioned under oath on Dec 7:


http://www.themlpnetwork.com/2012/0...eline-key-dates-to-missing-mom-investigation/

(near bottom of page)
 
BBM. I saw something similar below in Jersey's post. Why can't they plead the fifth?

Hi southern. Can they cite their fifth amendment rights during depo if they're asked questions that aren't incriminating towards them? Wouldn't a judge have to rule on that? I remember last year that Dede Spichter plead the fifth during her depo but it was highly speculated & reported that she could have helped Terri Horman get rid of Kyron, so the implication was there. Is the implication there by police that Dale's parents helped him? Idk, all I'm aware of is that Dale is still their #1 & only suspect. By saying that, I'd think they're "not on record" as even insinuating DS Sr & TS helped him...in which case then the judge could accept their 5th amendment plea & not firce their answers. Or am I wrong?

For some reason I thought that just bc somebody wishes to take the fifth doesn't necessarily mean that they legally can do so. I thought a judge would have to rule on that. Or no? Anybody know?
 
JG,

I don't know but I thought anyone could use the fifth if they felt an answer could incriminate them in a crime. ICBW. Was DeDe on a flyer at some point with Terry? I can't remember now.
 
JG,

I don't know but I thought anyone could use the fifth if they felt an answer could incriminate them in a crime. ICBW. Was DeDe on a flyer at some point with Terry? I can't remember now.

Yes, Dede was on a flyer.

Don't know about pleading the fifth. I've never done that & would never advise anyone I love to do that. I believe in the truth & its how I raise my children - even my oldest that has put us through hedoubletoothpicks lol. I can't imagine ever being in a position to even question taking the fifth. Is there a lawyer on board that would know? I was thinking along the same line as you, except that I'd add the lawyer could ask questions that wouldn't necessarily incriminate the Smith parents, but could in fact incriminate their son, in which case I thought they'd have to answer certain questions bc those questions wouldn't be about them but rather about their son. I thought a judge would have to rule on the questions they're pleading the fifth on bc not necessarily would they be able to legally do so if the questions aren't leaning toward their criminal negligence but instead toward someone else - their son.
 
Hi southern. Can they cite their fifth amendment rights during depo if they're asked questions that aren't incriminating towards them? Wouldn't a judge have to rule on that? I remember last year that Dede Spichter plead the fifth during her depo but it was highly speculated & reported that she could have helped Terri Horman get rid of Kyron, so the implication was there. Is the implication there by police that Dale's parents helped him? Idk, all I'm aware of is that Dale is still their #1 & only suspect. By saying that, I'd think they're "not on record" as even insinuating DS Sr & TS helped him...in which case then the judge could accept their 5th amendment plea & not firce their answers. Or am I wrong?

For some reason I thought that just bc somebody wishes to take the fifth doesn't necessarily mean that they legally can do so. I thought a judge would have to rule on that. Or no? Anybody know?

I'll start with my usual caveat, that I don't practice criminal law (and I'm not verified)... but I would think in this case there's been plenty of indication that they could face criminal charges at some point. Sr. has been questioned, his house has been raided, and I don't know what else. He has clearly been in the crosshairs.

They'd want to tread carefully though, because I think inferences can be drawn from refusing to answer questions in a civil case. It's not quite the same as a criminal proceeding.
 
Yes, Dede was on a flyer.

Don't know about pleading the fifth. I've never done that & would never advise anyone I love to do that. I believe in the truth & its how I raise my children - even my oldest that has put us through hedoubletoothpicks lol. I can't imagine ever being in a position to even question taking the fifth. Is there a lawyer on board that would know? I was thinking along the same line as you, except that I'd add the lawyer could ask questions that wouldn't necessarily incriminate the Smith parents, but could in fact incriminate their son, in which case I thought they'd have to answer certain questions bc those questions wouldn't be about them but rather about their son. I thought a judge would have to rule on the questions they're pleading the fifth on bc not necessarily would they be able to legally do so if the questions aren't leaning toward their criminal negligence but instead toward someone else - their son.

Jersey*Girl in this instance I will have to disagree with you, IMO there are plenty of reasons a defendant will take the 5th having nothing to do with guilt or innocence. Despite common misconceptions trials, either civil or criminal are not about justice and/or truth per se but simply about what can be proven or not proven, let me give you an example if I may:

Assume the following:

1. John's ex wife is murdered
2. John is the last person to have seen the victim and had a big fight before she left.
3. John Doe is in fact innocent.

Then ... one of the police question might be:

Did you have fight or an altercation when you last saw her?

there are 2 possible answers here.

A. Yes I did have a fight.

B. No I did not have fight.

Which is the correct one?

If A then John just handed the prosecutor a motive for killing her wife which helped a lot if he gets convicted.

If B, then John Doe lied, and if caught in that very lie, he just handed the prosecution not just a motive for killing his ex-wife but also the weight of perjury against himself.

Perhaps, depending on the situation, the answer is another altogether ... to take the 5th, in which case John Doe did not lie, did not misrepresents facts, and therefore and most importantly perhaps he did not help the prosecution make a case against himself.

BTW that works also if John Doe is guilty.

Now stuff like this go on all the time in every courtroom here and abroad. Trials are a matter a strategy, evidence and the attorneys' ability to present a convincing narrative that proves a case, where the outcome might be in doubt and where every word counts and can be represented in many ways and to mean quite the opposite then one particular point of view or testimony.

In the words of one of the immortals ...

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts, His acts being seven ages ...."
-William Shakespeare
 
Thor, thank you so much. I know nothing about pleading the fifth. Only stuff I know is what I've learned on here. That's why I thought the only person that could take the fifth would be somebody that's incriminated in a crime. In this case I didn't think Dale's parents could take the fifth but southern_comfort explained they could. Now you with your post. Thank you for helping me understand better.

But one more thing if I may ask, doesn't a judge still have to rule on the questions that said deposed person wishes to take the fifth on? It's bugging me bc I learned that from somewhere & I honestly think I learned it here. I don't have any lawyers in my family or friends, just cops. Would they really know?
 
Thor, thank you so much. I know nothing about pleading the fifth. Only stuff I know is what I've learned on here. That's why I thought the only person that could take the fifth would be somebody that's incriminated in a crime. In this case I didn't think Dale's parents could take the fifth but southern_comfort explained they could. Now you with your post. Thank you for helping me understand better.

But one more thing if I may ask, doesn't a judge still have to rule on the questions that said deposed person wishes to take the fifth on? It's bugging me bc I learned that from somewhere & I honestly think I learned it here. I don't have any lawyers in my family or friends, just cops. Would they really know?

Jersey*Girl you're very kind as usual, but I really don't know much about legal matters myself. Real law is a very painstaking knowledge of a multitudes of statues and legal precedents. I'm more interested in the law in its historical and social implications.

Now .... as far as I know .... Judges can rule on any aspect of law, they are in fact judging how the law is interpreted and exercised in their respective courtroom, their rulings may be required to be affirmed by an appellate court and the US Supreme Court is the ultimate arbiter in everything jurisprudence should it choose to hear specific legal arguments.

No right is absolute, and that includes the 5th Amendment to the constitution, but a witness cannot be forced, in any type of settings, to give testimony where such a testimony can carry criminal liabilities for himself/herself. In its most general sense, that 5th is to protect against an authority that could coerce a testimony from a witness through intimidation or worse, it's one of the most fundamental right accorded to defendant and non defendant alike and it's rooted in a deep seeded mistrust of a government void of check and balances .

However there are exceptions and they can be many ... in one such instance, in criminal trials self-incriminating testimony can be compelled by giving the witness immunity from any and all criminal liability that may result from his/her testimony. In civil cases, it can be real tricky since it involves convincing a judge that the witness has no reasonable cause to fear criminal liabilty ...

Hoffman v. United States, 341 U.S. 479, 486, (1951), quoted in U.S. v. Argomaniz, 925 F. 2d 1349 (11th Cir. 1991)

Absent evidence that we know at this point, there's is no way to anticipate in the the Parker case how the judge is going to rule. Lawyers for the family must convince a judge that there are enough evidence to warrant a trial and if and when said trial takes place, it would be a matter of legal arguments by the opposing lawyers an the final bench rulings that will dictate what is going to happen at trial, including a possible testimony of DS and/or any of his family members.

All JMO
 
I have a question. If the Hummer was pulled into Dale's garage, would the neighbor's video camera catch it on video? I can't remember how much of the driveway on Dale's side it picked up. In some of our theories we have thought that the Glow sticker was removed in the privacy of Dale's gargage, if the video picks him pulling the hummer inside, well we need another theory.
 
I have a question. If the Hummer was pulled into Dale's garage, would the neighbor's video camera catch it on video? I can't remember how much of the driveway on Dale's side it picked up. In some of our theories we have thought that the Glow sticker was removed in the privacy of Dale's gargage, if the video picks him pulling the hummer inside, well we need another theory.

I would assume that if there was a video showing DS driving the H3 inside his garage on that day he would have been arrested already.
 
I would assume that if there was a video showing DS driving the H3 inside his garage on that day he would have been arrested already.

I agree, but it keeps coming up that maybe that is what happened and if the video view takes in that garage, it is not a good theory. We have to come up with a way the stickers were removed before leaving the condos and not being seen being striped by anyone. If not the garage, then where? If the garage is not on video view, then it is possible to have a theory including it.
 
I agree, but it keeps coming up that maybe that is what happened and if the video view takes in that garage, it is not a good theory. We have to come up with a way the stickers were removed before leaving the condos and not being seen being striped by anyone. If not the garage, then where? If the garage is not on video view, then it is possible to have a theory including it.

There are plenty of theories as to how DS might have gotten rid of the GLOW stickers. We have been discussing it for a long time, to me at this point the problem it's not a lack of theories but a luck of evidence supporting those theories.

In any case, it seems to me that there's not much of a chance the camera or any other camera did/would/could have recorded Michelle leaving the Condo or else DS would all but certainly have been excluded as a suspect. As it stands, it seems that the camera capturing the video of the H3 arriving at Dale's it's all there is.

Also, if DS is the perp, hiding the GLOW stickers shouldn't be much of a problem, they could very well be where Michelle is ... more difficult to remove then unnoticed if taken off at the actual crime scene.

Lastly, I still don't see how DS would have pulled this off all by himself under the circumstances surrounding the disappearance... still may be the lawsuit will go forward? May be some real evidence will be revealed or found? May be DS or any of his family members will testify after all? I'm deeply skeptical of it all, but I sincerely hope I'm wrong.
 
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