Freddy Gray Verdict #2. Not Guilty

[KaaBoom]

Now that Officer Nero was found NG will he be able to get his job back?

Do you have any information, that he doesn’t have his job now? The only thing I can find is that he is suspended with pay.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Very predictable. It’s what happens 99% of the time. The cops are found not guilty in a criminal court, but guilty in a civil court, and the city pays out 6.5 million dollars. The others will be found not guilty too. Nothing will change, the police department will go on with business as usual, until it happens again, and then the cycle will repeat again, along with the riots.

I have long since given up any hope of ever seeing anything change.

rbbm

No way it happens 99% of the time. I would like to see statistics supporting that claim. imo

 

[bluesneakers]

Do you have any information, that he doesn’t have his job now? The only thing I can find is that he is suspended with pay.

Suspended with pay.

Nero has been a member of the Baltimore Police Department since 2012. Before that, he was a volunteer firefighter for 10 years in New Jersey. He has been suspended with pay during the ongoing trials.

http://www.wmcactionnews5.com/story...acquitted-of-all-charges-in-freddie-gray-case

 

[bluesneakers]

rbbm

No way it happens 99% of the time. I would like to see statistics supporting that claim. imo

Over the last decade, law-enforcement agencies have recorded roughly 1,000 fatal shootings each year by on-duty police. An average of fewer than five each year resulted in murder or manslaughter charges against officers, Stinson found.

The cases are often difficult to prove. Of the 47 officers charged* from the beginning of 2005 through the end of last year, about 23 percent were convicted, Stinson found.

*Anyone's guess on how many escaped charges.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/police-shooting-charges_us_5661b436e4b079b2818e4765

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Do you have any information, that he doesn’t have his job now? The only thing I can find is that he is suspended with pay.

No, I don't I just assumed they had let him go, but it seems he is returning to work.

 

[formerjerseygirl]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/ma...-williams-nero-transcript-20160523-story.html
Good read-just the facts

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Very predictable. It’s what happens 99% of the time. The cops are found not guilty in a criminal court, but guilty in a civil court, and the city pays out 6.5 million dollars. The others will be found not guilty too. Nothing will change, the police department will go on with business as usual, until it happens again, and then the cycle will repeat again, along with the riots.

I have long since given up any hope of ever seeing anything change.

It didn't even go to civil court did it?

I thought the Mayor decided to give the family millions even before the criminal trials were held?

Did a civil court/jury find these officers guilty?

 

[KaaBoom]

rbbm

No way it happens 99% of the time. I would like to see statistics supporting that claim. imo

Lawyer in Ferguson case: 99% of the time police not charged in death of young person of color

 

[JeannaT]

Lawyer in Ferguson case: 99% of the time police not charged in death of young person of color

That could also mean 99% of the time, cops are justified in shooting. I would still like to see the actual statistics, not just a lawyer pulling something out of his hat.

I would also like to see what era in time we're talking about - I would agree, prior to 1960, cops shot people of color with no second thought often.

I would like to see cases in the last 15 years. How often police shot people of color against police training and policy.

 

[KaaBoom]

It didn't even go to civil court did it?

I thought the Mayor decided to give the family millions even before the criminal trials were held?

Did a civil court/jury find these officers guilty?

Baltimore to pay Freddie Gray's family $6.4 million to settle civil claims

 

[JeannaT]

It didn't even go to civil court did it?

I thought the Mayor decided to give the family millions even before the criminal trials were held?

Did a civil court/jury find these officers guilty?

I'm sorry to split hairs, but a civil jury doesn't find someone guilty or not guilty, they find them responsible or not responsible.

Some of the officers were clearly responsible for the injuries to Freddie Gray - and the city was probably saving money settling out of court.

 

[KaaBoom]

That could also mean 99% of the time, cops are justified in shooting. I would still like to see the actual statistics, not just a lawyer pulling something out of his hat.

Please read the article. There are statistics in the article. About 97% of the time they are not charged. Even when charged, there is only a small chance of conviction. My 99% number is low. It’s probably actually 99.9xxx%.

If all these cases are justified, then why are tax payers paying out billions of dollars every year to settle wrongful death suits for police officers? It’s not easy to sue the government. The government doesn’t just pay out billions of dollars to settle law suits because they feel like being nice. They pay it, because it’s cheeper then going to court and losing.

 

[sonjay]

It's very wrong that this officer was charged at all with any criminal charge. The charges were a joke -- like something you'd see in The Onion.

I'm surprised that any police officer is willing to continue working for that PD.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Lawyer in Ferguson case: 99% of the time police not charged in death of young person of color

Respectfully you said it in reference to cops being found not guilty in a criminal court and then guilty in civil court.

 

[KaaBoom]

I'm sorry to split hairs, but a civil jury doesn't find someone guilty or not guilty, they find them responsible or not responsible.

Some of the officers were clearly responsible for the injuries to Freddie Gray - and the city was probably saving money settling out of court.

If I as a private citizen am clearly responsible for the injuries resulting in someone’s death, I’m going to go to prison for manslaughter for it. Which is the same thing that should happen to LEOs who do the same. But for some reason I can’t understand, LEOs in this country are above the law.

 

[bluesneakers]

Please read the article. There are statistics in the article. About 97% of the time they are not charged. Even when charged, there is only a small chance of conviction. My 99% number is low. It’s probably actually 99.9xxx%.

If all these cases are justified, then why are tax payers paying out billions of dollars every year to settle wrongful death suits for police officers? It’s not easy to sue the government. The government doesn’t just pay out billions of dollars to settle law suits because they feel like being nice. They pay it, because it’s cheeper then going to court and losing.

Imagine if instead of paying a dead person's family $6million they used it to pay or train their officers. I think about that a lot.

 

[K_Z]

Regarding Officer Nero's status with the police department, it appears he is on desk duty, and still drawing a paycheck-- not suspended or fired. Mayor Rawlings- Blake said there is a pending internal investigation that cannot be completed until all of the 6 trials are completed.

A police statement said Nero will remain on administrative capacity during the investigations, which won't be completed until the last officer's trial ends because the officers may be called as witnesses in their co-defendants' cases.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/23/us/freddie-gray-trial-officer-edward-nero/

She says, “This is our American system of justice and police officers must be afforded the same justice system as every other citizen.” She says Nero now faces a Police Department administrative review. The Baltimore Police Department says Nero remains on administrative duty while an internal investigation continues. It says the probe won’t be completed until the criminal cases against all officers are complete. A total of six officers are charged in Gray’s April 2015 death.

http://www.kurv.com/update-mayor-baltimore-ready-in-case-of-disturbance/

It's my opinion that if Officer Nero is fired, or disciplined following his complete acquittal, he has an excellent civil case against the city for wrongful termination, and malicious prosecution. Maybe even some additional legal complaints. I think he would be awarded millions in damages-- maybe the city would even settle without going to court.

 

[KaaBoom]

Respectfully you said it in reference to cops being found not guilty in a criminal court and then guilty in civil court.

OK I'll rephrase it. From my experience in following these types of cases, cops are virtually always found not guilty in a criminal court, at the same time legally responsible for the death in a civil court.

 

[K_Z]

It's very wrong that this officer was charged at all with any criminal charge. The charges were a joke -- like something you'd see in The Onion.

I'm surprised that any police officer is willing to continue working for that PD.

I think the charges for Nero, and how they were brought, goes far beyond a joke. Nothing will probably happen to Marilyn Mosby for her disgraceful and unethical conduct and actions in this situation, but a great many people feel that she engaged in malicious political prosecution that was motivated by everything *EXCEPT* justice. That's my opinion.

She should lose her job, and be stripped of her law license, IMO. That would be a good first step toward mending the corruption, IMO.

 

[Hope4More]

I think the charges for Nero, and how they were brought, goes far beyond a joke. Nothing will probably happen to Marilyn Mosby for her disgraceful and unethical conduct and actions in this situation, but a great many people feel that she engaged in malicious political prosecution that was motivated by everything *EXCEPT* justice. That's my opinion.

She should lose her job, and be stripped of her law license, IMO. That would be a good first step toward mending the corruption, IMO.

Having no good sense at all, apparently, I'm gonna wade into this.


What happened to Freddy Gray was wrong, and the wrong of it began when he was arrested without probable cause.

Running away from a cop when one has done nothing wrong is not illegal, and it is even less illegal when one begins running BEFORE one sees a cop, who just happens to be in the vicinity when one is running.

That's when things began to go very wrong very quickly, but I'm going to stay only on Officer Nero's role in the story. Or lack of role.

Nero did not make the decision to arrest Gray, and he was not in fact the arresting officer. The fact that there was no probable cause to arrest Gray is not, in any meaningful sense of the word, Nero's responsibility.

Yet, one of the charges against Nero, the assault charge, was predicated on the very dubious legal proposition that because there was no probable cause to arrest Gray, any action taken against Gray after arrest was an ASSAULT, and here I am talking that charge could have been levied even if nothing whatsoever untoward had happened to Gray after his arrest. The very fact he was taken into custody, according to this innovative charge, constituted an assault on Gray.

Am I relieved the judge had a problem with that charge? Yes. Very. Charging Nero with that nonexistent crime was a mistake, IMO, and finding him guilty of a nonexistent crime would have done nothing to bring justice to Gray who died in police custody without committing a crime.

Neither was Nero responsible for making sure Gray was seat belted in the van. According to LE protocol, the driver of the van, Officer Gooding, bore the responsibility for making sure Gray was securely seat-belted. Not Nero. Again, where is the justice in convicting Nero on a criminal charge for not doing something that he was not responsible for doing?

Nero's has been considered the weakest of all the 6 cases. It shouldn't be any great surprise he was cleared on the charges, and IMO that he was cleared is a sign the system worked, not that it failed.

Gooding the driver's trial is next. His degree of involvement and culpability are greater and so are the charges; my guess (and hope) is he won't walk.