GUILTY Germany - Oskar Gröning, 'The Accountant of Auschwitz', goes on trial, age 93

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RR0004 said:
You have to wonder how those two managed to get past their parents wearing those shirts.
Yes, I'm afraid the world will forget. I have to give Germany credit for allowing these trials to continue, but time is running out.
Momoffourboys, how lucky you all are.
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Indeed, time is running out. We are slowly losing our only eye witnesses. I am proud that my children have heard the stories and first hand accounts. Most kids my son's age have never heard about the Holocaust.

I was, recently, invited to hear this man speak (in NY). Very interesting story.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/community/miami-dade/coral-gables/article4369952.html
 
Seven plaintiffs (including survivors of Auschwitz) were present today., as well as the defendant. Max Tibor Eisen, 86, and William 'Bill' Glied, 85, arrived at the camp as 13 and 15 year olds. Both live in Toronto. They are represented by lawyers, one of whom asked if Gröning could ever have imagined Jews might leave Auschwitz alive. After a long pause he answered:

'No, I could not have imagined that.'

He was also questioned about whether his responsibilities were really only on the ramp and he stated that after January 31st, 1944, he 'no longer stood on the roster'.

I don't fully understand that answer but it could just be the brief quote in the article, so I'll try to find a link with a little more of the testimony.

http://www.dw.de/gröning-tells-cour...ined-survival-of-jews-at-auschwitz/a-18402835
 
Bild has more. I've linked to a google translation so it will seem a little jumbled.

Gröning was actually asked if he could imagine Jews surviving the camp AND going on to have their own children. The pause in his answer was so long because, he revealed, he'd forgotten the question.

He was also quizzed over the truth of if he requested transfers to fight on the Eastern Front, where his own brother had just died at Stalingrad (My note: and where no German or Russian in their right mind wanted to go).

Gröning replied he'd asked for the transfer in November and his brother didn't die until Christmas.

He also denied any financial gain made at the camp, or any black marketeering, with one exception. Every time a train arrived, the guards had to run nearly a mile to get their guns from the storeroom. So he brought one from a black marketeer for 30 Marks. He said he only dealt with relatively small amounts of money, although in '43 the Gestapo raided the staff rooms while he was away, and he came back to find two of his staff detained.

http://translate.google.de/translat...ng-dritter-tag-40659794.bild.html&prev=search
 
zwiebel said:
Seven plaintiffs (including survivors of Auschwitz) were present today., as well as the defendant. Max Tibor Eisen, 86, and William 'Bill' Glied, 85, arrived at the camp as 13 and 15 year olds. Both live in Toronto. They are represented by lawyers, one of whom asked if Gröning could ever have imagined Jews might leave Auschwitz alive. After a long pause he answered:

'No, I could not have imagined that.'

He was also questioned about whether his responsibilities were really only on the ramp and he stated that after January 31st, 1944, he 'no longer stood on the roster'.

I don't fully understand that answer but it could just be the brief quote in the article, so I'll try to find a link with a little more of the testimony.

http://www.dw.de/gröning-tells-cour...ined-survival-of-jews-at-auschwitz/a-18402835
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Oh my goodness...the stories these witnesses have to tell. The unthinkable depravity...300,000 people exterminated in two months!!

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/22/w...ning-auschwitz-birkenau-guard-trial.html?_r=0
 
zweibel, thank you very much for your coverage of this trial. I have followed everything nazi related that was available since I was around 20, many moons ago. My dad, a dentist in the medical corp under Patton's third army, was at Auschwitz during the liberation.

Will write more when my broken arm starts feeling better. Thanks again!
 
I tried to get to Lüneburg today, in the vague hope of taking some pictures. Sadly, traffic was against me and I only just got home after a fruitless, long journey. I'm just going to have to look up today's proceedings on the Internet now, like everyone else. :(
 
daisymae said:
zweibel, thank you very much for your coverage of this trial. I have followed everything nazi related that was available since I was around 20, many moons ago. My dad, a dentist in the medical corp under Patton's third army, was at Auschwitz during the liberation.

Will write more when my broken arm starts feeling better. Thanks again!
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That's fascinating. You must tell us more. If you'd like to, of course.
 
I'm banging my head against the wall here because I can't find anything in German or English that is definitely about proceedings today. I know the trial doesn't restart until Tuesday - did they do that German thing and shut up shop lunchtime Friday too, without anything really happening?

The only German news I'm finding is all about Eva Kor's moving interview with BBC Radio 4 today - which I can't even listen to as it needs Flash. Here it is, for those of you who have it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p02pw8cg

Here's a quote from it, I think.

..as she arrived to give evidence against Groening, whose job was to strip arrivals of their wealth and belongings as they arrived by cattle-truck train at the liquidation camp, she gave the former SS man a hug.

She thanked him for “having some human decency in accepting responsibility” for what he had done.

She said on BBC Radio 4’s Today programme she had forgiven the Nazis for what they had done to her -- not because they deserved it, but because she deserved to be free of the burden.
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http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/auschwitz-survivor-eva-kor-tells-5577504

ETA: Can't believe the vague coverage of such an important trial.

Also...are you guys on here also following what's been going on with Göring's heirs? They were fighting for royalties from use of his war diaries, but just lost the case. I'm thinking of starting a thread.

ETA: No, that is another case. His daughter also wanted his assets back, taken in WW2. Heck.
 
Just one last thing; from Eva's twitter it seems the very first time she came face-to-face with Oskar at court and he touched her arm, she screamed for help, then fainted. Very brave lady to overcome her fears, and history.

https://mobile.twitter.com/EvaMozesKor
 
Forgive me. There are two families of two Nazi war criminals currently fighting for a share of 'their' money, unbelievably, and I've confused the two.

1: Goebbels. His family want royalties for use of his wartime diaries and are suing Random House publishers. The publishers are fighting the case as they don't believe a war criminal, or his heirs, should profit from his crimes.

http://www.theguardian.com/books/20...uld-pay-to-quote-joseph-goebbels-in-biography

2. Göring. His 77-year old daughter wanted just a 'subsistence living' from his assets seized after the war. Ownership of these assets, many of which were artworks, are still vociferously disputed by the families they were 'collected' from. The Bavarian Government took only minutes to reject her application today.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...le-G%F6ring-s-daughter-loses-fight-for-assets
 
I remember being in high school and being assigned to read Anne Franks book. Then we studied what hapened during the Holocaust. I was in shock. It was my first realization of true evil. I ws in shock, had trouble sleeping for a while. I never realized how bad people could be.
 
daisymae said:
zweibel, thank you very much for your coverage of this trial. I have followed everything nazi related that was available since I was around 20, many moons ago. My dad, a dentist in the medical corp under Patton's third army, was at Auschwitz during the liberation.

Will write more when my broken arm starts feeling better. Thanks again!
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Auschwitz was liberated by the Soviets coming in from the east. The Americans came from the west and liberated numerous concentration camps in Germany. I've seen a number of films on these liberations, including 16 Photographs At Ohrdruf, the documentary maker was grandson of a medic in the 365th medical battalion, who helped liberate Ohrdrufl, a sub-camp of Buchenwald. Worth watching to hear still living soldiers talk about it. Please post about your Dad's story.
 
please forgive my lousy typing as my left arm is broken so this is one handed! sorry but can't do capital letters.

the day my dad's dental school class graduated, the army signed them all up. my dear father would never talk about his experience at auschwitz. in the last year of his life i asked him again and all he would say to me is that bodies were stacked up like firewood. i so wish he would have opened up more. i guess it was even harder for him being a jewish man.

i do have a few things outside of the camp he told us about. while driving down a road in the black forest probably with a couple of other men, a large group of nazi's came out of the woods, arms raised and surrendered to them. not knowing the german language he pointed down the road for them to walk where they needed to go. he said he had never been so scared.

he brought home 2 guns from those nazi's. one was a luger, and the other one he gave away to a friend when i was a teen. a few years ago a friend of mine researched the luger and discovered it belonged to someone higher up. the holster has a metal insignia on it and was used in ww1. inside the holster is a small compartment which i believe would have held a cyanide capsule or a suicide bullet. the original bullets from ww2 are still in it and are green.

as he was a dentist, when our military were there kicking the nazi's out of their offices, he went in a dental office. he wanted to see the equipment and said everything was top notch, high quality, the best he'd ever seen. he was impressed i'd say.

while in that office there was a locked cabinet so he kicked it open to find a barrel of dental plaster. he kicked the barrel over and found a door enameled sign that says dentist in german (dentsrher dentist, i think) with a swastika on it. other door signs he brought back are bier-glocke, waschbecken sauberhalten, klossett sauberhalten, kassen dentist and one more i can't decipher. these don't have a swastika. also included is a stainless spoon, military issued, with an engraving of what looks to be an eagle and swastika. and 2 more medals that i'll have to find my magnifier to read. they look like uniform medals.

zweible, can you translate those things?

i don't believe he brought back much else, except some magazines, postcards, etc.
 
I definitely can't translate old German, but I have a friend who can, brilliantly. If I get pics, I'll do my best.
 
I should have warned people in advance I have been mixing up Goebbels and Göring my entire life, by the way, and I've already done that twice in this case. I don't know why. I lost half my marks in a history exam once, through suddenly switching their names.

If I do it again, I am very grateful for any corrections.
 
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