Human Remains (*cadaver) Detection (HRD) dog questions and answers **NO DISCUSSION**

[sarx]

What are the success rates, percentage-wise, for well-trained HRD dogs? (High I would guess.) Are records kept charting an individual dog's percentage of success - say, after trials at the end of training?

Yes, like in the 90% plus range. It has been my experience and actually there was a study out recently too that when working with well trained dogs, failure is more often caused by the handler than the dog. We call it GDSH...
Yes, records of EVERYTHING should be kept including success rate.
Training is ongoing as is re-certification and logs are (or should be) kept of all of it. Good handlers will continue with weekly training, it never ends.
I think this is a very important point to bring up, so thank you!

ETA- I think it's important to note that when training properly it is a part-time at best and dang near full time job. The hours you put in the first 18-24 months are ridiculous. The upkeep on training is only slightly better. Oh, and you're doing it for free... This again is where logs come in to play, cuz if you don't have the hours, you don't have the experience, you don't have a reliable dog....

 

[Nancee Drue]

Can the scent of a deceased, decomposed body be tracked to a certain person, or are all deceased, decomposed human scents the same?

If a decomposed scent was on the sheets, or carpet, and those items were cleaned, or replaced...will the scent remain?

thank you

 

[nursebeeme]

why would you think the dog got the hit next to the bed... what scenario could you come up with for a hit to be here (ie: say someone dies in the bed and falls out would you get a hit on the bed as well?.. or is it more likely that the body was placed down in that location?)

eta: when you train with dogs do you also train for certain scenarios?

 

[sarx]

Can the scent of a deceased, decomposed body be tracked to a certain person, or are all deceased, decomposed human scents the same?

If a decomposed scent was on the sheets, or carpet, and those items were cleaned, or replaced...will the scent remain?

thank you

Depends, but yes, scent can remain thru a whole lot, including some pretty good "clean ups".

 

[sarx]

why would you think the dog got the hit next to the bed... what scenario could you come up with for a hit to be here (ie: say someone dies in the bed and falls out would you get a hit on the bed as well?.. or is it more likely that the body was placed down in that location?)

eta: when you train with dogs do you also train for certain scenarios?

Oh my, there are so many scenarios I'm not sure I could even list them all. I think that transfer scent is a possibility as well. If they died in the bed I would expect a hit there as well. It doesn't necessarily have to be the body that was put there, just something that came into contact with it.


When training you try to do as many scenarios as you can think of. You use past experience, things you've read about, things other people have done, you work during different times of the day and night, in every weather condition you can, with every age victim/mp you can get ahold of.

 

[LancelotLink]

Oh my, there are so many scenarios I'm not sure I could even list them all. I think that transfer scent is a possibility as well. If they died in the bed I would expect a hit there as well. It doesn't necessarily have to be the body that was put there, just something that came into contact with it.


When training you try to do as many scenarios as you can think of. You use past experience, things you've read about, things other people have done, you work during different times of the day and night, in every weather condition you can, with every age victim/mp you can get ahold of.

They also took a comforter as evidence. Perhaps it was from the bed?

 

[TGIRecovered]

The "expert" on JVM right now says that cadaver dogs have never hit on the scent of death unless the body has lain there at least 1 1/2 hrs. after death. He sites "studies I've seen". I think Sarx needs to call in and straighten them out.

 

[sarx]

The "expert" on JVM right now says that cadaver dogs have never hit on the scent of death unless the body has lain there at least 1 1/2 hrs. after death. He sites "studies I've seen". I think Sarx needs to call in and straighten them out.

What exactly is he an expert in? Finding studies? Nope that wouldn't be it either... Ugh, where do they find these people?

 

[nursebeeme]

Oh my, there are so many scenarios I'm not sure I could even list them all. I think that transfer scent is a possibility as well. If they died in the bed I would expect a hit there as well. It doesn't necessarily have to be the body that was put there, just something that came into contact with it.


When training you try to do as many scenarios as you can think of. You use past experience, things you've read about, things other people have done, you work during different times of the day and night, in every weather condition you can, with every age victim/mp you can get ahold of.

so say bedding was washed (either from the crib or the parents bed).. would dogs still be able to sniff that out (that is if it wasn't thrown away somewhere) eta: even if top bedding was taken away would mattresses still hold scent for dogs?

 

[sarx]

so say bedding was washed (either from the crib or the parents bed).. would dogs still be able to sniff that out (that is if it wasn't thrown away somewhere)

Depending on the contact, quite possibly.

 

[nursebeeme]

sarx and oriah,

on the 17th the dogs hit in the family home.


on the 18th there was a massive five plus hour search on north brighton with a no fly zone (same no fly zone that was put in place during serving of the search warrant on the 19th with no fly zone d/t dog techiques).

could the hrd dogs have tracked the scent to this area as well? (prompting the no fly zone as previous searches did NOT have this no fly zone)

**eta: further wondering makes me ponder the fact of the sightings of man walking with a baby in several locations that night

 

[sarx]

sarx and oriah,

on the 17th the dogs hit in the family home.


on the 18th there was a massive five plus hour search on north brighton with a no fly zone (same no fly zone that was put in place during serving of the search warrant on the 19th with no fly zone d/t dog techiques).

could the hrd dogs have tracked the scent to this area as well? (prompting the no fly zone as previous searches did NOT have this no fly zone)

**eta: further wondering makes me ponder the fact of the sightings of man walking with a baby in several locations that night

Disclaimer-this is not saying it happened...
Yes, it is possible.

 

[nursebeeme]

vlpate wondered if HRD dogs will hit on menstrual blood (paraphrased)

 

[Karmaa]

Question: (thanks in advance)... you keep mentioning "well trained" dogs. How can we tell if these dogs were well trained? Is there some kind of professional certification or something?

 

[Paige SC]

How long does a body need to be dead before the dogs would pick up on the scent? Just say for example a baby was suffocated in her crib. Would the baby need to be in the crib for an hour (or more or less) post mortum before the decomp would rise to a detectable level? If that makes sense.

 

[sarx]

vlpate wondered if HRD dogs will hit on menstrual blood (paraphrased)

The dogs that were there wouldn't.

 

[sarx]

Question: (thanks in advance)... you keep mentioning "well trained" dogs. How can we tell if these dogs were well trained? Is there some kind of professional certification or something?

So glad you asked! Yes, there is. NASAR has 3 levels of certification and there is also FEMA certification. Those are the only 2 I trust. Generally speaking if you are certified elsewhere but don't have those, it's because you couldn't pass. Sorry to be so blunt.

 

[sarx]

How long does a body need to be dead before the dogs would pick up on the scent? Just say for example a baby was suffocated in her crib. Would the baby need to be in the crib for an hour (or more or less) post mortum before the decomp would rise to a detectable level? If that makes sense.

The dogs have the ability to smell it at the moment of death, I've watched house pets be able to tell as someone passed.

 

[Paige SC]

The dogs have the ability to smell it at the moment of death, I've watched house pets be able to tell as someone passed.

That's amazing. So they are trained then, to smell at the moment of death? It makes you wonder how that's even possible. Even tho cellular changes begin immediately, you wouldn't think a biological (scent) would happen at the same time? Fascinating stuff.

 

[sarx]

Much like every odor we scent, we smell different when we are happy, angry, stressed, sick. Dogs can sniff out cancer before it can be detected by doctors, the list goes on and on.